Has Any from McClelland Actually Made a Statement About Their Future

[saltedplug]

I know the one [B&M] I was in last week had talked to Mary directly and asked how much they could buy and were told that there wasn't anything left TO buy.

Last I heard only 5100 was jeopardized as the McClellands weren't satisfied, not because no red VA was available but because the red VA they'd smoked was not of sufficient quality. But the reaction was that there was plenty of quality red VA available. Then I read someone saying that he had talked to Mary who said that they were having supply problems, which shared on the board is third-hand information. Above we have a hearsay account fifth-hand about deeper supply problems. So as far as I know all we have is information so attenuated that it becomes suspect, as information relayed comes imbued with the cognitive process of all of those in that chain.
Another guy puts McClelland in the same boat as Dunhill, both of them sinking. Then by inference we hear about all the panic buying, virtually wiping out the supply of McClelland VAs. But off course panic buying in the face of imagined scarcity doesn't mean McClelland won't produce more, and it has nothing to do with the viability of their operation. Then he tells us to rely on other blenders tobaccos. BUT WAIT very little of this has happened.
It's clear that McClelland is having problems, and that this is due to supply, but that's all that's clear. In this I know nothing, but as yet we have no substantial account from the McCledllands about their trouble, and catastrophizing and panic buying, predictable human behavior in the face of scarcity, would appear to be to no purpose.

 

[zitotczito]

Kind of like the impending forecast of a big snow storm, a great way to clear out any old stock and start fresh.

 

[cortezattic]

Hey! :x I heard it on the INTERNET! Good enough for me!

 

[cigrmaster]

salt, that sure was the long way around of saying you think the rumors are bullshit. Pipestud is very close to the McNiel's. He was the first to report about the shortage of Red Viginia's which was told to him by Mary I believe. Now on his site for aged tobacco's, he refers to the MC Virginia's and other blends as being out of production.
I have known Steve aka Pipestud a very long time(18 or so years), I have never known him to spread rumors or speak without full knowledge of a situation. I choose to believe him when he speaks or types. I planned accordingly and now I can smoke my Butera Dark Stoved to my hearts content with the knowledge I have plenty of back up.
Thanks Steve.

 

[elvergun]

The McNeils certainly did not handle this very well. They told some people one thing (that they are closing shop), and they told other people a completely different story (they informed the Country Squire radio guys that most blends were safe).
After 40 years in business I expected them to make a more graceful exit. I hope we get the straight story one of these days.
I guess that the stampede was going to happen no matter what though...

 

[ben88]

IMO, McClelland is about to close down (sell off possibly). Why have they decided to do it, only they know. Could be anything.

Could be a decision to retire, or could be (hopefully not) somebody is ill. Nods towards supply problems most likely is a smokescreen. Is it a ruse just to drum up sales for a while? I don't think so. A lot of people might end up feel foolish if it is so. Everything is a pure speculation, of cause, but that's what I think is happening.

 

[saltedplug]

I'm not calling bullshit on anyone, especially as I don't have any solid information. Pipestud seems to be the best source of information, especially as he talks to Mike McNeil directly. I am certainly not calling bullshit on anybody on the board. Rather, as I said most of the information we have is hearsay and uniformed. How do we know McClelland might not start importing VAs from China, etc., when we have given them no time to exhaust other sources of supply? We don't know what they're going to decide to do, depending on what alternatives they might find.
Particularly I question the panic-buying and the overall mood off catastrophizing that I read.
Harris, glad you're stocked on your Butera. How is your sweet meerschaum smoking?

 

[sablebrush52]

The McNeils certainly did not handle this very well. They told some people one thing (that they are closing shop), and they told other people a completely different story (they informed the Country Squire radio guys that most blends were safe).

All I've ever heard is second or third hand. What the McNeil's have or haven't done is hearsay. Let's say, for a moment, that they are closing up shop. It would have not have done their customers any good to make such an announcement. All that would have happened is that hoarders and speculators would have swooped in and wiped out everything they could, leaving their regular customers with zilch. Not saying anything allowed their customers potentially extra months of buying time. Once the stock began to thin out people noticed and raised an alarm and the hoarders and speculators swooped in and bought up what they could amid the general panic. So they handled it very well. And if they wanted to have their plans known they would have said something. They have worked hard to offer great products for decades. That's what they have done, and they deserve nothing but thanks for doing that.
Hoarders and speculators may not be happy, but so what? We like to promote this myth of a "brotherhood" of pipe smokers, and on a micro level it truly does exist. People can be, and often are, very generous with sharing their tobaccos on an individual basis. On a macro level that "brotherhood" simply doesn't exist.

 

[cigrmaster]

salt, I honestly think that the McNiel's are tired and want to retire. I believe they just don't know how to say it as of yet. I believe they have been telling certain retailers so they could stock up before the announcement came. These retailers have been telling certain long time customers and this is where I believe most of the rumors have been coming from. I am just glad I heard about this a couple of weeks ago so I could stock up on the one MC blend I do like.
I am enjoying the Meer but after so many bowls, I have realized it will not replace my briars. Certain blends do nicely in it, but others the flavors seem thin. For example, my 2007 Stonehaven smokes better in the 2 pipes I have dedicated to it. The flavors from the Meer are not as rich or as full if that makes any sense.

 

[snagstangl]

If they were selling but were going to stop blending and retire, they could be closing because they are selling out to another company and yet most blends could be safe. I think a graceful exit from business is almost never likely.

 

[elvergun]

All I've ever heard is second or third hand. What the McNeil's have or haven't done is hearsay. Let's say, for a moment, that they are closing up shop. It would have not have done their customers any good to make such an announcement.

While it is true that the information we have is second hand, we have heard different versions of what was going on from those second hand sources. Perhaps the Country Squire Radio dudes misunderstood what the McNeils told, but they were very clear in their podcasts that they were informed by both Mike and Mary (they had talked to both the day of they recorded their shows) that that most of their tinned offerings were safe from the same fate as the 5100 blend. Either you are retiring or you are not. The message they gave to the Country Squire guys was that they were not retiring and that they would continue to make many of their blends (well, at least that is what these guys seemed to have understood). The message they imparted to PipeStud (or to someone PipeStud talked to) was that they were done for good.
And here we are, still uncertain about what is really going on. The speculators did swoop in...and the panic did ensue.

 

[sablebrush52]

Perhaps the Country Squire Radio dudes misunderstood what the McNeils told, but they were very clear in their podcasts that they were informed by both Mike and Mary (they had talked to both the day of they recorded their shows) that that most of their tinned offerings were safe from the same fate as the 5100 blend.

Or they were asking for information that the McNeils didn't want to give, and/or didn't think were appropriate for broadcast. There is such a thing as a right to privacy. And if they were protecting their regular customers they sure as hell wouldn't be saying anything. And if you say "No comment", everyone expects the worst.

Either you are retiring or you are not.

Sometimes that decision isn't so clear. Closing McClelland wouldn't be an easy one to make. It's their baby and it's been their baby for 40 years.

The speculators did swoop in...and the panic did ensue.

Eventually, and inevitably, after the announcement about 5100. No one, except the McNeils, knows what was going on before that. And no one, except the McNeils, knows what is going on now.

 

[balkisobrains]

I think that what they told Country Squire was short-term, and it was pretty accurate. Bulks dried up, they didn't close down, and we saw another shipment of 40th and some other stuff.
Someone just posted here or somewhere that they read on Facebook.....I know....that there may be another 40th shipment yet (which I also think may happen), and a couple other blends, and that would be it, and that they were starting to sell off Oriental leaf and some processing equipment. Just throwing it out there if anyone wants to track that down.
I have heard exactly no one say that they have been able to place back-orders or re-ups for anything, only that they cannot place back-orders or re-ups for anything at all, and current online inventories reflect that, and I have been trying to see the forest through the trees all along here, and it really does not look good.
=(

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

Forget the retirement announcement and deal with the facts. Retailers haven’t received 5100 since December and have been told it’s not available for order. St James Woods has not been available from the major internet retailers for at least 4 weeks. Other bulk and tin blends based on 5100 have steadily disappeared from the shelves. If the McNeils aren’t voluntarily retiring, they’ve sure adopted a rather strange marketing strategy at this point. When I see smoke, I at least assume there’s a chance of fire.

 

[deathmetal]

Sounds like a classic case of a struggling business: they are telling us what has not worked out, and are re-organizing to keep as many profitable products out there as they can.

 

[perdurabo]

I still get a kick out of the GLPease McClelland blends. Rumors running wild. Meanwhile C&D Gives us the Melville Series. :clap:

 

[cosmicfolklore]

I have nothing new to add to the rumors, and I shot my whole load of great McClelland jokes in the other McClelland rumor thread. But, I would just like to add that because a business, “goes out of business” does not mean that it was NOt successful, lost money, nor was victim to anything negative. Having spent years working with my local Business Leaders Association and CoC, people close businesses for many positive reasons; to enjoy the freedom of using their savings before they are too old to do so, to take on new projects, or simply to move on. However, after closing our shop, when we run into old customers, they always seem to appologize for something, and that sucks. I always try to let them know that we are having the time of our lives. I may take on a landscaping project or fret over a corn crop, but 13 years was a long time. We saw it as a success. We have lots of land between my wife and I. We’re certainly not rich, but we also don’t have the BS of being rich, and “We Did it Our Waaaay!” Ha ha.

My mother cashed out her diner, and now she is somewhere between California and New Mexico in an RV, doing what she dreamed of doing her whole life. Of course I worry about a 78 year old woman driving an RV with her only slightly younger husband, but it’s her life, and she’s always wanted to travel.
Whatever happens, if we lose McClellands it will most likely be more sad for us than them. And, I just hope that if they close, they beat the hell out of life and enjoy every minute of it.

 

[georged]

Sounds like a classic case of a struggling business: they are telling us what has not worked out, and are re-organizing to keep as many profitable products out there as they can.

Mike and Mary are friends of mine. What you describe is not the case at all.

 

[kcghost]

George, I agree. Nothing could be further from the truth. This is simply about time. Tick, tick, tick.

 

[philobeddoe]

Mike & Mary McNiel don’t “owe” us an explanation or anything else for that matter. They have given us access to 40 years of stellar pipe tobaccos and how they conduct their Business is indeed their business. If you are concerned they are stopping production then I would advise you to buy what you can afford, in any event tobacco will never be cheaper than it is today, so plan accordingly. I especially don’t care for any of the comments questioning their motives or implying that they have some nefarious reasons for keeping their affairs from the general public.