Pipe Smoking Study, It Doesn't Look Good.

[JTex]

Life has risks. Auto accidents, accidents with tools (I still have eight fingers and two thumbs), salt, coffee, sodas, alcoholic beverages, earthquakes, fires, hurricanes, tornadoes, and random shootings--- all of these can do harm. I have enjoyed the pipe and leaf for almost 60 years and am still healthy. Wow, after listing all these dangers, I need a little Mac Baren HH Pure Virginia.

 

[brian64]

I still have eight fingers and two thumbs

You're doin' a lot better than this guy then so far:

 

[JTex]

Could change today--using the miter saw and drill.

 

[seldom]

This thread keeps going! I'll repeat a sentiment that has been stated here. I will die. I've accepted the fact of my own mortality. Quality of life is important to me given my limited time. I understand the risks in my pipe smoking and in my drinking. I do it anyway because I like it. I'd not recommend anyone else do these things.
It is well understood that pipe smoking is physiologically unhealthy whether or not you want it to be.

 

[anotherbob]

seriously if you want to blame someone for the attitude people have towards smoking and tobacco. Blame the cigarette companies who knew what their product does to people while incorrectly calling their product tobacco (seriously those things are to tobacco what kraft singles are to cheese). People are coming around to the facts but that's going to take time. You can't expect people to turn around after decades of being lied to on such a level.

 

[Worknman]

That means that during the study, 4 pipe smokers died for every 3 non-smokers who died. That’s for any cause, not just cancer or COPD or smoking related things. And they’re relatively sure (19 times in 20) it isn’t just coincidence or a trick of the numbers.

Why or how isn’t captured, that’s a limitation of this sort of study.

Ok I understand now. So the RR 1.33 means for every non smoker that died 1.33 smokers died, ie. 4/3. Also means that based on the study's parameters,non smokers were 33% more likely to die of "something" than non smokers I assume.

 

[wulfheard]

The “all or nothing” attitude is the greatest risk to Pipesmoking.
The future of Cigarettes is absolutely certain, it won’t be long until Vaping has totally replaced that habit in society anyway, tying yourself to the Titanic won’t stop it from sinking.

So you think you can separate your pipe smoking from cigarette or cigar smoking? Maybe hide in the shadows and be overlooked? Do you actually think the anti smoking zealots look at you any different than the person who sucks down a pack of Marlboros?

In truth the future of ALL tobacco products are certain. Anyone who thinks otherwise is puffing away in a state of denial.

The first shots have already been fired in regard to vaping. The attacks will continue until it is taxed the same way tobacco is. Make no mistake, money is the first objective. Then as vaping declines, a new demon must and will be found to start the cycle all over again...Sure vaping may replace cigarette usage in the near future. That is exactly why the antis are eyeing it up...To them it's the emerging cash cow and next justification to intrude on our lives.

 

[brian64]

It is well understood that pipe smoking is physiologically unhealthy whether or not you want it to be.

True. But the degree to which it is unhealthy is NOT well understood...in context and in comparison to other forms of tobacco consumption as well as to other common practices that have even greater health risks but are not typically characterized truthfully...such as much of the "food" people eat every day.

Point being that the entire issue here boils down to accuracy...any and all tobacco use is almost always lumped together as having the same overall health risk.

This is not just a minor inaccuracy...it is a gross inaccuracy...even an intentional lie in some cases...that the general public has been relentlessly propagandized to believe. And even many pipe and cigar smokers believe it.

And it is simply not true...beyond any reasonable doubt.

The most effective propaganda is partly true, but spun and distorted to serve an agenda.

incorrectly calling their product tobacco (seriously those things are to tobacco what kraft singles are to cheese).

+1

 

[trouttimes]

Let's face it, smoking is not the healthiest thing you do but I do enjoy it. I think it helps mellow me. As a past friend Chris Ledoux, a rodeo cowboy/singer said, " I would rather spend 10 sec. in the saddle than watch a lifetime from the stands."

 

[warren]

Studies are simply studies. Now, how your physiology handles smoke, any amount of any type of smoke, is something only time will tell. And when you find out it'll be too late to change one way or the other. I just took a "pre-cancer screening" which showed no cancer precursors. 60 plus years of smoking. Thing is a test next week or month could have different results.

" I would rather spend 10 sec. in the saddle than watch a lifetime from the stands."

So would I. It was all those seven and nine second rides that were a total waste of time for me. Might as well not paid the fee and stayed at home.

 

[lawdawg]

True. But the degree to which it is unhealthy is NOT well understood...in context and in comparison to other forms of tobacco consumption as well as to other common practices that have even greater health risks but are not typically characterized truthfully...such as much of the "food" people eat every day.

Point being that the entire issue here boils down to accuracy...any and all tobacco use is almost always lumped together as having the same overall health risk.

This is not just a minor inaccuracy...it is a gross inaccuracy...

I'm really having a hard time understanding how the statements like the one @brian64 just made are controversial, especially among fellow pipe smokers who are all well-aware of the BS that goes on with the anti-tobacco groups.

Nobody here has given any indication that any of us think smoking is healthy, and I think we all understand that smoking carries health risks. Those of us who are objecting to the "settled science" about smoking just think that most of the research on this issue is biased rather than objective, and is therefore bad "science", and we've explained and demonstrated specifically what's wrong with these studies. Nobody here is in any denial.

 

[olkofri]

I actually think that smoking is healthy.

And that is because I follow a wholistic approach to health that includes and considers thoroughly both soul and body. We are souls and have bodies, not the other way around has been my approach for a long time. Unfortunately, science was dealt a mortal wound over a hundred years ago when it became 100% naturalistic. If I were to follow the materialistic path that results from naturalism, then, yes I would have to conclude that smoking is unhealthy; but because I acknowledge both visible and invisible aspects of creation, I must conclude the opposite when I recognise the positive and healing aspects smoking a pipe or cigar have on the soul.

Ignoring the supernatural when doing science, just because it can't be measured with our current apparati, is like trying to do meteorology whilst writing off the sun, just because we can't land on it and take measurements.

 

[alaskanpiper]

I don't know about smoking being healthy, but giving me shit about it can be hazardous to your health.

 

[didimauw]

Interesting topics, good conversation and in depth arguments.

Just remember, I'm on here all the time boys.

puf

 

[tobefrank]

I don’t think a believe in the supernatural is even required to look at health more holistically. All you need to do is consider mental health an important element of overall health.

Mental health is still largely misunderstood and under-emphasised, but psychology is a science too.

And things like mindfulness and being kind to oneself by treating yourself to a (for me occasional) bowl are key aspects of pipe smoking in my opinion.

 

[alaskanpiper]

Mental health is still largely misunderstood and under-emphasised, but psychology is a science too.

And things like mindfulness and being kind to oneself by treating yourself to a (for me occasional) bowl are key aspects of pipe smoking in my opinion.

Can't agree more! Nor can my Master's degree in Psychology

 

[Ctbill]

Something, eventually, will kill us all. I referenced in a prior post the random acts of choking on kale, falling down stairs, or getting hit by a texting teen on the road. I ride a motorcycle frequently - those statistics have been presented here as well as “grim”. If I factored in where I live, what I do for a living, where I drive, how much I drive, WHAT I drive, some other hobbies, and a few pipes/cigars a week - I should have been dead last year - or earlier.
...Statistically speaking...
BUT - I enjoy a motorcycle ride, and a pipe, and a cigar, and a Scotch responsibly (I think), so I’m still here. And enjoying life...
My bowl a day pipe will likely not be my demise. If it turns out it is, down the road, then “I’ve enjoyed my life”. But that is likely not what really is the underlying factor in what did me in.
Please enjoy your life. It’s later than you think...

 

[olkofri]

Well, I consider psychology a pseudo-science. I'm with Arthur Machen on it: "psychology is one ounce of sense and a pound of nonsense". If you ask me, the pound has become a ton in the century between Machen's observation and us. My good friend, the one who majored in psychology and ditched it because he found it folly, and is now working as a physiotherapist agrees.

They key is moderation, but of course, the 'no safe level of exposure' fallacy so loved by the antis does away with moderation quite nicely.

In truth, there are three different effects scenarios from a given substance:







Tobacco is the last one, in which there is a dose that is actually beneficial, before it crosses into harmful; or at the very least the second one. But the 'settled (pseudo)science' will use every weapon and trick in their arsenal to make everyone believe it's the first one.

 

[brian64]

@olkofri: Your 3 graphs illustrate it perfectly. Bravo.

As for your comments on the soul...I for one agree entirely...but when I'm already having an uphill battle attempting to argue 2+2=4, I'm reluctant to jump into calculus.

The most fundamental question of all, imo, is:

Is consciousness an artifact of matter, or is matter an artifact of consciousness?

I say it's the latter.

 

[warren]

I'm simply trying to point out that science, for or against smoking, is totally irrelevant to the smoking discussion these days. The debate has moved far beyond and no one, on the "anti" side cares. The "pro-smokers" want to continue a debate which has long ago been decided. We just have these long, sometimes entertaining posts, repeated often, which provide ... I really do not know what for some of our members.

I observed months ago on this site that most of the shrinks I know agree that, at best, their profession is "witchcraft". At worst, an amalgam of "best guesses" based on years and years of anecdotal evidence presented by other practioners.