What To Do About Mold In Unnamed Manufacturer Tins

[cosmicfolklore]

First, I have not closed any threads because they were just discussing mold at C&D. I closed threads once the posters had just started to bash the company without contributing anything helpful or furthering the discussion. We had a couple of posts made late at night that were closed because they were made by brand new members that had just posted inflammatory youtube videos, obvious trolling behavior. We mods have never been instructed to just remove any threads that were critical of sponsors. All posts that were removed have had something that qualified for closing or removal stated within forum rules. And, as usual, if you have an issue with moderation of the forums, it is against the forum rules to state as much publicly, take it up the mod of your preference. This is just to keep some sanity within the forums, plus it's in the rules "period".
I had the pleasure of talking with Ted of C&D on the phone last week. We discussed the mold issue, and maybe I can better help clarify the issue.
Now, this was not an issue with the Red Carolina Virginias in particular. They were trying a new anti-mold agent that was designed for them that would take care of a range of PH issues ranging from Perique blends to burleys. Obviously, it didn't work as well as they would have hoped. On average, every tobacco company will potentially see mold issues in 1 out of 1000 tins. But, the failure rate of this new anti-mold agent was about 7-12 out of 1000, which has had the new phenomena of being documented by online forums, which might be leading to an exaggeration of the mold issue. C&D did not say this, but this was my assumption after given the numbers. The posts online have not been an adequate reflection of how many tins have been actually reported to C&D or retailers. For every tin with mold, hundreds have been

Has this been fixed? Yes, they now use a combination of the old anti-mold agents and the new ones. However, C&D wants to be known as one of best tobacco companies and will continue to honor exchanges.
Suggestions that C&D are doing nothing or not enough are just complete speculation, unfounded, and potentially unfair. If anyone has an issue, as always it is better to just address the company directly than to expect a company to happen to see your post and then come on a forum to help you. I know, I know, sometimes we like to have an excellent reason to make a post that will lead to invigorating discussions. I am guilty of this also. But, just know that this company is doing it's best, IMO, to resolve the issue and restore consumer confidence.
It is not an issue that has an easy one blurb response, because the numbers the company sees and forum posts don't add up, which can lead to speculations, assumptions, and eventual myths, like the Red Virginia assertion.
My suggestion is that if you have a problem or an unresolved fear about a C&D product, please contact the company that you purchased the product. If you just post a picture and never contact anyone, you are not really helping anyone, especially yourself.
Now, I am packing some Temple Bar into my stacked Becker dublin and enjoying a mold free GLP smoke. Hopefully, you now better understand...

 

[jking]

So the problem remains and has now spread to bulk blends. I guess that kills the theory of the cardboard inserts in the tins as the root of all evil.
To fully resolve this issue I have a simple solution. Make up a large batch of Old Joe Krantz, enough to finally get rid of all the red VA in question. Then offload the whole batch to 4nogs where no one buys anymore. No more consumers are affected, the bad tobacco is gone, and everyone's favorite retailer is left holding the bag. :lol:

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Umm jking, you obviously didn't read my post before posting.

 

[jpmcwjr]

Back to solutions:
I do wonder if drying the tobacco at home before re-jarring it would reduce the incidence..... Has anyone gauged the moisture content of the moldy tobaccos?

 

[bigpond]

Umm jking, you obviously didn't read my post before posting.

Or he had a different motivation to post, like slamming 4Noggins.

BTW, they have at least one customer left in the US right here. Moving on.
Cosmic, what is the new anti-mold treatment? People have been asking after this for months. C&D hasn't made it clear and people continue to wonder. For a company that created a position for a social media specialist it is showing a remarkable lack understanding of the nature of social media and it's impact on the market place.
I don't believe the onus should be on the consumer to restore shattered confidence.
If I bought moldy Carolina Red and had it replaced with Moldy Bijou, and had that replaced with Moldy Temple Bar would a call to Ted restore my confidence? Because as it stands my most recent tobacco order included no C&D derived blends which is the first time this has happened in three years.
Look, the 7/1000 line maybe entirely accurate. You may recall Sykes posted the same bit here during the Carolina Red incident. I'm sure other blenders face this same issue. Yet, there is no buzz to suggest it. Google mold and McClellands or Macbaran for example. Then do the same with C&D and compare. Do McClleland's customer's have a different affectation for social media than C&D customer base? Possibly. It's just as likely that C&D customers that also post to forums have really really bad luck.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Best solution... my $0.02... If you have worries about mold in a tin or bulk that you own, call the retailer. Otherwise, you are going to mess up something that could be a pretty awesome smoke.
However, if we are being "hypothetically entertaining"... drying a blend to too dry a state before re-jarring it might reduce the amount of any improvement that aging might produce. As it takes water to make a blend age, or so I deduce from reading blogs by tobacconists who seem to know better than me.

 

[woodsroad]

John, you would need to identify the mold(s) present, then research the conditions under which they will reproduce and bloom. A lack of moisture might help, but exactly how dry would it need to be? And is that low of a moisture level conducive to aging?

 

[jpmcwjr]

Y'all are right. Just pondering!

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Cosmic, what is the new anti-mold treatment?

I was just told that they had someone in the food industry make a new anti-mold agent that would deal with a larger range of PH factors. The new treatment is that they mix the new and old processes. I don't know any more than that. He may have mentioned names of chemicals, but I don't recall any. That may just be my poor memory though.

If I bought moldy Carolina Red and had it replaced with Moldy Bijou, and had that replaced with Moldy Temple Bar would a call to Ted restore my confidence?

Confidence is such an individual thing. What may restore confidence in one, might not another. I suggest that if you have an issue with mold in a tin that you have, or suspect... I can't very well suggest that everyone call this guy, but the proper course of action would be going to the retailer first.
I also talked with Ted about mold in other blends. In my five years or so of smoking a pipe, I have had mold in tins of McConnels Red Virginia, several McClelland bulks have molded in jars, and I've even had one tin of FVF mold on me a few days after opening. It just never occurred to me to take a picture of it and post it online. I didn't even think to ask to have it replaced. I just tossed the tin and opened another. I've seen maybe 4 or 5 moldy tins in my short stint of pipesmoking. It didn't warp my perceptions of these companies, nor did I even think about it until I was on the phone with this guy.

I think that what we have is partially a forum phenomena and partially a SNAFU by this company, and the two have combined to make this look like a bigger issue than it really is.

 

[woodsroad]

Y'all are right. Just pondering!

Yeah, well, cut that shit out! ;-)

 

[cosmicfolklore]

If I bought moldy Carolina Red and had it replaced with Moldy Bijou, and had that replaced with Moldy Temple Bar ...

BTW, if someone has actually seen mold in successions like that. I would think that C&D would be very, very interested to hear about this. Especially since there are thousands and thousands of tins that were sold during the time of them using the new agent, and there just isn't hundreds of reports. So that means that there are more guys like me, who slowly opened a tin, not knowing what to expect, and found an excellent tobacco inside. Hitting three tins of different makes with mold would be like hitting the lottery, and I suggest that maybe you pick some numbers for me.

 

[davet]

I do wonder if drying the tobacco at home before re-jarring it would reduce the incidence

If the blend is in a sealed container the mold spores are already there, are they not? Transfering from one container to another after some drying would postpone the molding I would think. Just curious, I certainly am no authority on mold.
It seems that questioning this mold issue is being questioned 8O I haven't bought any of the blends in question and probably won't for the time being. I know the retailers will come good but the issue for me is an international border and customs not to mention the issue of cellar over time.

 

[mso489]

Not to resort to happy talk, but it is interesting how rare mold is. I had one experience when I tried to hydrate tobacco with an apple slice, one of those online bad ideas, and another experience in a bulk package of blending tobacco, maybe Izmir Turkish. That's over years and dozens/scores of blends and blending leaf. A small quantity, I'd just trash. Slight mold, as with cheese, just remove the offending layer and maybe dry the rest out, and monitor that jar. Mold is really off-putting when it shows up, but in my experience, it's also unusual.

 

[davet]

Mold is really off-putting when it shows up, but in my experience, it's also unusual.

I've never experienced mold in tobacco, but when I've come across it elsewhere I turf it.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Yeh, I have never had an issue with mold on cheese. My mom, who came from dairy folks, always taught me to just eat the cheese mold. It does have a tastier flavor when the mold is green to blue. My sisters and I would fight over who got to eat the dark blue molds we would find in the fridge. Funny how mold can be more dangerous, depending on what it grows on.
One of the store in town had a mold issue. A customer told the local authorities, the store called in for expensive tests to be run, and the result was that, yes, there was mold and a moldy odor in the store, but none of the tests came back that positive for dangerous molds. But, people continue to post negative reviews on the store, claiming that all mold is dangerous, despite what the experts say. I think that we have become an anti-fungal society, even if the types of molds that are dangerous are very limited. Kind of like bacteria, even though most bacteria on our skin serves a very positive purpose, when given an opportunity, we use anti-bacteria lotions, even though that removing the "good" bacteria is making it more likely that we will get sick.

People in general prefer black/ white, good/ bad answers. If the answers takes several sentences to explain, then most people lose interest.

 

[daveinlax]

My sisters and I would fight over who got to eat the dark blue molds we would find in the fridge.

LoL! That is just stank ass nasty but it explains a lot. 8O

 

[cosmicfolklore]

You've never eaten blue cheese?

 

[Chasing Embers]

If not a Red Virginia issue, it's awfully curious that the posted offending blends contained Red Virginias. Is it just a coincidence, or something that has been investigated?

 

[cosmicfolklore]

It may be that the forum posts just make the reds seem more predominate. Maybe the guys getting mold in other blends are not immediately running to post pictures on the forums? That's my guess. I didn't talk at length with him about this in particular, but he did say that it was the anti-mold stuff, not the specific Red Virginias.

 

[Chasing Embers]

Ah, good to know.