What Are The Physics Of "Thick Wall = Cool Smoke"?

Log in

SmokingPipes.com Updates

Watch for Updates Twice a Week

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

Status
Not open for further replies.

olkofri

Lifer
Sep 9, 2017
8,175
15,013
The Arm of Orion
As we see here in the first diagram, it seems that yer valve gear is intrudin' on yer sand pipes and the steam- powered whistle done fogged up the cab windows. Which is causin' excessive heat in yer chimney.


View attachment 43615
Does that one smoke cooler than this one:
IMG_7699__74642.1501098249.jpg


?

:LOL:
 
Jan 28, 2018
14,032
158,114
67
Sarasota, FL
I don't see there being an appreciable difference in the temperature of the smoke due to bowl thickness. I do think the conduction heart adsorption of a thick briar is going to be superior to convection cooling due to the minimal amount of air flowing around the outside of the bowl. I agree smoking technique is the primary factor in having a cool smoke.
 

rajangan

Part of the Furniture Now
Feb 14, 2018
974
2,810
Edmonton, AB
I concede that the delta in temperature as a result of fluid velocity might be negligible and noticed only by the most sensitive of tongues; yet, a pipe with a larger chamber diameter would push more volume of smoke through the hole and it'd travel faster than it would in a pipe with smaller chamber diameter. The pipe smoking system is nothing but a Venturi tube:

venturi-effect-flow-pressure-vector-illustration-diagram-fluid-air-movement-dynamical-physics-example-experiment-tube-model-173140979.jpg
A larger diameter bowl would only push more volume of smoke if you took larger draws. This isn't the case. My point is that the rate through the stem is constant; therefore, the rate through the ember is a dependent variable which is inversely related to the diameter of the bowl.
 

Chasing Embers

Captain of the Black Frigate
Nov 12, 2014
45,251
119,264
A larger diameter bowl would only push more volume of smoke if you took larger draws. This isn't the case. My point is that the rate through the stem is constant; therefore, the rate through the ember is a dependent variable which is inversely related to the diameter of the bowl.
The problem with that is that the entire surface of the pack doesn't remain constantly ignited and the ember burns down an inverted cone not adhering to the bore of the chamber necessitating tamper usage to guide the unburned tobacco to the warmer center of the pack to be burned.
 

rajangan

Part of the Furniture Now
Feb 14, 2018
974
2,810
Edmonton, AB
The problem with that is that the entire surface of the pack doesn't remain constantly ignited and the ember burns down an inverted cone not adhering to the bore of the chamber necessitating tamper usage to guide the unburned tobacco to the warmer center of the pack to be burned.
The previous post I commented on suggested that if I draw 100mL of smoke at 50mL/sec through stems with identical draft holes, it will move faster out of the stem if the bowl is wider because venturi effect.

As for the cone theory, the same volume of air moving through a wider cone will be moving slower, and therefore not be burning as hot.
 

Chasing Embers

Captain of the Black Frigate
Nov 12, 2014
45,251
119,264
As for the cone theory, the same volume of air moving through a wider cone will be moving slower, and therefore not be burning as hot.

Not really a theory since the force of the draw is going to be strongest at its place of origin and as the ember is drawn to that point it is starting from an area less pull to greatest. My last post was just bait really to see if you just wanted to argue, it's just a pipe, not high school calculus.:rolleyes:
 

rajangan

Part of the Furniture Now
Feb 14, 2018
974
2,810
Edmonton, AB
We were all theorizing, brainstorming what possible things might account for the mystery. It seemed to me that my ideas got shut down when I was only trying to contribute to the conversation.

I was trying to figure out if you were a troll or an idiot. I guess I know which it is, now. You're apparently intelligent and a dick.
 

LBT

Lurker
Aug 10, 2020
33
78
Central Oregon
Is it possible that the greater heat retention of the thicker walled bowl serves to keep the ember burning with less frequent puffing? Thus a smoldering ember, especially if there is a difference in bowl diameter/draft hole size could provide satisfactory smoke volume for less rapid airflow?

Hey, Iraisch! (damn auto correct wants to make you Irish - as you have likely dealt with)

This is a common challenge students in thermodynamics wrestle with: what state is the system in at time-start?

IF you've already saturated the bowl to its heat capacity, THEN a thick-bowl will be a more stable heat sink, and would support your hypothesis (not addressing the bowl diameter/draft hole challenge).

IF you're beginning a smoke (which I took for this situation), THEN a thicker bowl will be more of a 'heat suck,' or, as we're circling around, deliver a cooler smoke (all things being equal).

I wasn't connecting the dots (being new to the forum), but the OP is Road-to-Pines, and his challenge in assessing what made sense is embedded in your question. Do thicker bowls offer a deeper heat sink to cool the smoke, or is it the other way around, do they serve as insulation? I should have addressed that more clearly at the beginning. Your post helped!

Lee
 
  • Like
Reactions: rajangan

jpmcwjr

Lifer
May 12, 2015
26,263
30,344
Carmel Valley, CA
I read these nuggets as if they're being spoken by the man pictured in your avatar.
Unfortunately, I am looking more and more like that avatar! I now do have a very white beard, though no fedora. And days of wearing a suit coat are far behind me.

I will focus on the word "nuggets" and be well chuffed. Thanks.
 

jpmcwjr

Lifer
May 12, 2015
26,263
30,344
Carmel Valley, CA
Is it possible that the greater heat retention of the thicker walled bowl serves to keep the ember burning with less frequent puffing? Thus a smoldering ember, especially if there is a difference in bowl diameter/draft hole size could provide satisfactory smoke volume for less rapid airflow?
Yes, yes, yes! But not discernible except by highly calibrated equipment, or a man with a palate and brain far superior to most of us.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.