Info About Dunhill's "Not For Sale" Pipes

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sasquatch

Lifer
Jul 16, 2012
1,683
2,862
Occam's razor cuts both ways, which is one reason it's not an especially useful tool in philosophy. If simplicity is our guide for theory selection, then the simplest theory, which is that someone drilled a white dot into an unstamped pipe, should be preferred.

The truth is, we don't have any idea where that pipe was made. Until we see telltale signs of production in the Dunhill facility (again, tenon, slotting, mortise size and shape etc) the jury is "out" at best. But the jury has already quite rightly decided - Not a Dunhill stem, not a Dunhill finish, not a Dunhill shape... why are we still assuming it's a Dunhill?

The pipes I pictured above have white dots. Which is a Dunhill?
 

jguss

Lifer
Jul 7, 2013
2,411
6,211
As what's-his-name must know, his argument is wholly meretricious. Proving a negative is notoriously difficult, and that's the position he's trying to maneuver the naysayers into adopting. The appeal to ignorance (or argumentum ad ignorantiam) is of course a well-known logical fallacy, and sadly is also one of the oldest, and shabbiest, of lawyers' tricks. But the fact remains that absence of evidence is not evidence. If one is determined to reject expertise there's no limit to what can be denied. There's also no limit to what can be asserted. But in fairness to the OP if he's interested in buying what are potentially Dunhills at a bargain price I'm sure there are forum members that are prepared to sell him hundreds. And if he's prepared to wait a week or two I can promise that all will have white dots on their stems.
 

beefeater33

Lifer
Apr 14, 2014
4,063
6,118
Central Ohio
Occam's razor cuts both ways, which is one reason it's not an especially useful tool in philosophy. If simplicity is our guide for theory selection, then the simplest theory, which is that someone drilled a white dot into an unstamped pipe, should be preferred.

The truth is, we don't have any idea where that pipe was made. Until we see telltale signs of production in the Dunhill facility (again, tenon, slotting, mortise size and shape etc) the jury is "out" at best. But the jury has already quite rightly decided - Not a Dunhill stem, not a Dunhill finish, not a Dunhill shape... why are we still assuming it's a Dunhill?

The pipes I pictured above have white dots. Which is a Dunhill?
I'd say the one in the front?............ The button looks a little off, but the pipe in the back is a bit blurry on my monitor.........
 

sasquatch

Lifer
Jul 16, 2012
1,683
2,862
As what's-his-name must know, his argument is wholly meretricious. Proving a negative is notoriously difficult, and that's the position he's trying to maneuver the naysayers into adopting. The appeal to ignorance (or argumentum ad ignorantiam) is of course a well-known logical fallacy, and sadly is also one of the oldest, and shabbiest, of lawyers' tricks. But the fact remains that absence of evidence is not evidence. If one is determined to reject expertise there's no limit to what can be denied. There's also no limit to what can be asserted. But in fairness to the OP if he's interested in buying what are potentially Dunhills at a bargain price I'm sure there are forum members that are prepared to sell him hundreds. And if he's prepared to wait a week or two I can promise that all will have white dots on their stems.
Bingo.
 
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weezell

Lifer
Oct 12, 2011
13,653
49,163
You announce a proposition and then you defend it. Your arguments and all of the data you collect are predicated to supporting your proposition. You defend your proposition and create the essence of reasonable doubt to anything contrary so that your proposition is more than a supposition; You propose that proposition could be fact. But if not a fact, it is a proposition that can be construed as possibly being a fact given certain circumstances.

The problem with your argument is that it is a supposition built on a proposition based on a point of view biased in your own experiences and tethered only by your own constructs to a universe of your own making.
YEAH! And if the dog didn't stop to take a shit it would have caught the cat... cray
 
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telescopes

Pipe Dreamer and Star Gazer
I think it's disingenuous and dangerous to the community to promote myths, to twist bullshit into "possibility", and to obscure and obfuscate rather than search for truth and clarity.
I agree with every word you say... and yet, this is the good ole USA we are living in, LOL. I was only referencing the use of profanity to make a point. I think it weakens a position if the position is a strong one, and your argument already stood on the merits of sound logic.
 

jguss

Lifer
Jul 7, 2013
2,411
6,211
I agree with every word you say... and yet, this is the good ole USA we are living in, LOL. I was only referencing the use of profanity to make a point. I think it weakens a position if the position is a strong one, and your argument already stood on the merits of sound logic.

I agree in principle, but in practice profanity plays a signal role in emphasizing key aspects of the points we make. Without “f*ck” doing triple duty as an intensifier/modifier/qualifier the English language as spoken in the demotic would be greatly impoverished.
 

Briar Lee

Lifer
Sep 4, 2021
4,759
13,782
Humansville Missouri
You have one. He's told you. You haven't listened.
I’m going to give him plenty of photographs for him and others to look at, when it gets here.

The simplest explanation for a White Spot pipe in Germany with missing Dunhill markings and a NOT FOR SALE stamp is a Dunhill employee made himself a pipe NOT FOR SALE (a lunch box special) and left it behind on his tour of duty in Germany.

It could be a complete forgery.

Let’s first see if the White Spot, is an obvious forgery.

If it is, why would somebody forge a fake White Spot, then get a conscience and ruin it as a counterfeit he could pass off as genuine?

If it looks real, then does the rest of the pipe have that high dollar glow only genuine luxury goods emit?

We proceed to construction details of Dunhill pipes, then.
 

sasquatch

Lifer
Jul 16, 2012
1,683
2,862
I agree in principle, but in practice profanity plays a signal role in emphasizing key aspects of the points we make. Without “f*ck” doing triple duty as an intensifier/modifier/qualifier the English language as spoken in the demotic would be greatly impoverished.
My man.
 

beefeater33

Lifer
Apr 14, 2014
4,063
6,118
Central Ohio
I’m going to give him plenty of photographs for him and others to look at, when it gets here.

The simplest explanation for a White Spot pipe in Germany with missing Dunhill markings and a NOT FOR SALE stamp is a Dunhill employee made himself a pipe NOT FOR SALE (a lunch box special) and left it behind on his tour of duty in Germany.

It could be a complete forgery.

Let’s first see if the White Spot, is an obvious forgery.

If it is, why would somebody forge a fake White Spot, then get a conscience and ruin it as a counterfeit he could pass off as genuine?

If it looks real, then does the rest of the pipe have that high dollar glow only genuine luxury goods emit?

We proceed to construction details of Dunhill pipes, then.
Hey, if it smokes good, all is well.............. a Dunhill?, maybe, Maybe not........... but a good smoking pipe is what it is............. I like your style, BriarLee.......... keep 'em coming!!.........
 
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telescopes

Pipe Dreamer and Star Gazer
Let's try something different.

A car happens to be made from some parts that happen to have a Cadillac emblem on them. But no where on the car does it say Cadillac.

Let's assume that the car may have been made at a Cadillac factory by a Cadillac employee. The car parts may have actually been carried off in Johnny Cash's lunch box.

But... as far as the title is concerned and as far as any buyer may be concerned, none of this makes it a Cadillac. It will not have the same warranty of a Cadillac nor will it have the same assurance of quality of a Cadillac. It will be a knock off, plain and simple.

The pipe in question already has many red flags. Even if a part of it originated in the Dunhill factory, nothing to this story would make it a Dunhill.

This is akin to someone taking a summer seminar at Harvard and proclaiming that they have a Harvard education.

So, Mr. @Briar Lee , by virtue of the fact that your pipe fails to state Dunhill and lacks other markings that actual Not for Sale Dunhill pipes have, it can not be a Dunhill because it lacks the credentials that would make it so. Parkers and Hardcastles are NOT Dunhill's. They are Parkers and Hardcastles, no matter how good they are.


Your pipe is ruled NOT to be a Dunhill and your petition for redress is denied. The court has ruled.

Of course, you may appeal, that is your right. But I suspect that your request for an injunction will be denied as well.

But please, show us the pipe when it arrives. If it smokes well, you have a pipe with a story. And that has to count for something.
 

saltedplug

Lifer
Aug 20, 2013
5,194
5,097
The effectiveness of profanity lies in the fact that being vulgar it is not civil. When we hear it some part of us is always shocked, and we silently tell the user that he shouldn't use it. We are less likely to use it when we have strong feelings but lack compelling logic or a strong case.

I've never been able to stop using it, because I really don't want to.
 

georged

Lifer
Mar 7, 2013
5,491
13,920
This thread has activationized my suspicionizer that Kevin hires secret InterWebz agents to create threads that walk the fine conversational line between silly enough to be entertaining while sticking to its topic enough to avoid locking.

The more I think about it the more likely it seems, in fact.

I mean, spotting real Dunhills is not rocket science, and we're four pages and a week into it... rotf
 

sasquatch

Lifer
Jul 16, 2012
1,683
2,862
I’m going to give him plenty of photographs for him and others to look at, when it gets here.

The simplest explanation for a White Spot pipe in Germany with missing Dunhill markings and a NOT FOR SALE stamp is a Dunhill employee made himself a pipe NOT FOR SALE (a lunch box special) and left it behind on his tour of duty in Germany.

It could be a complete forgery.

Let’s first see if the White Spot, is an obvious forgery.

If it is, why would somebody forge a fake White Spot, then get a conscience and ruin it as a counterfeit he could pass off as genuine?

If it looks real, then does the rest of the pipe have that high dollar glow only genuine luxury goods emit?

We proceed to construction details of Dunhill pipes, then.

Again, Germany, home of Vauen, who have successfully defended their right to use a white spot on pipes made in Germany, would be a much more likely source for this German-found pipe, in German Germany.

I'm curious what means you'll use to determine if a white dot is a forged white dot or not? Is there some metric of authentic whiteness of which I am unaware?

2Ecw67q.jpg


Of these dots, which do you suppose is authentic?
 

sasquatch

Lifer
Jul 16, 2012
1,683
2,862
The effectiveness of profanity lies in the fact that being vulgar it is not civil. When we hear it some part of us is always shocked, and we silently tell the user that he shouldn't use it. We are less likely to use it when we have strong feelings but lack compelling logic or a strong case.

I've never been able to stop using it, because I really don't want to.
One must "break the mind of logic" to transcend.

Master Tung-kuo asked Chuang Tzu, "This thing called the Way-where does it exist?"
Chuang Tzu said, "There's no place it doesn't exist."
"Come," said Master Tung-kuo, "you must be more specific!"
"It is in the ant."
"As low a thing as that?"
"It is in the panic grass."
"But that's lower still!"
"It is in the tiles and shards."
"How can it be so low?"
"It is in the piss and shit."
 

telescopes

Pipe Dreamer and Star Gazer
I agree in principle, but in practice profanity plays a signal role in emphasizing key aspects of the points we make. Without “f*ck” doing triple duty as an intensifier/modifier/qualifier the English language as spoken in the demotic would be greatly impoverished.
Hmmm. Damned the torpedos, full speed ahead...

Yes, that works.

"You'll find no "evidence" because you haven't a fucking clue what you're looking for and won't accept anything at all as evidence against your silly story."

No, that is unnecessary because one, it is not a life or death moment, and two, the argument was already made magnificently without the use of profanity.

Words should elevate our logic, not bastardize it. But feel free to fuck'in disagree with me. LOL
 

sasquatch

Lifer
Jul 16, 2012
1,683
2,862
Let's try something different.

A car happens to be made from some parts that happen to have a Cadillac emblem on them. But no where on the car does it say Cadillac.

Let's assume that the car may have been made at a Cadillac factory by a Cadillac employee. The car parts may have actually been carried off in Johnny Cash's lunch box.

But... as far as the title is concerned and as far as any buyer may be concerned, none of this makes it a Cadillac. It will not have the same warranty of a Cadillac nor will it have the same assurance of quality of a Cadillac. It will be a knock off, plain and simple.

The pipe in question already has many red flags. Even if a part of it originated in the Dunhill factory, nothing to this story would make it a Dunhill.

This is akin to someone taking a summer seminar at Harvard and proclaiming that they have a Harvard education.

So, Mr. @Briar Lee , by virtue of the fact that your pipe fails to state Dunhill and lacks other markings that actual Not for Sale Dunhill pipes have, it can not be a Dunhill because it lacks the credentials that would make it so. Parkers and Hardcastles are NOT Dunhill's. They are Parkers and Hardcastles, no matter how good they are.


Your pipe is ruled NOT to be a Dunhill and your petition for redress is denied. The court has ruled.

Of course, you may appeal, that is your right. But I suspect that your request for an injunction will be denied as well.

But please, show us the pipe when it arrives. If it smokes well, you have a pipe with a story. And that has to count for something.
This is the opposite case - a car made entirely from Hyundai parts but with a fake sticker on the back saying "Lamborghini".


It... might... it just might... be a Lamborghini.
 
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