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cosmicfolklore

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2013
35,772
84,216
Between the Heart of Alabama and Hot Springs NC
Tesla motors last a million miles between rebuilds.
Ha ha, bullshit. We have no idea how long a motor is going to last that was just built. But, mainly it is those batteries that is of more concern than the motor.
If you like EVs so much, buy you one. But, for one, they are way too expensive for mainstream America to afford, and just impractical for most mainstream America. My house is on one side of a stream, and we park on the other side, with laws preventing me from being able to run electrical lines across that stream. So, I personally will never own one.
I know that Musk is kicking around this idea of only leasing his cars, but to lease a vehicle, verses buying one, you are just throwing your money away. And, to be tied to that service contract... why would someone want these terrible financial choices?

Of course there are other EV options, but they are all just about as terrible.
Are you aware that the wheels on an EV have been specially engineered to carry the weight of all of those batteries? The weight is three times that of my pick up truck and the wheels run about $480 a tire, and will have to be replaced more frequently, because it is carrying way more weight than a regular car.

I'm not sure why you are cramming this EV crap down our throats in a Jeep thread. But, you either don't know anyone who owns one, or you are being misled. But, the costs of everything concerning an EV is more than a regular car... except maybe the cost of the oil that is being burned to make electricity to charge that thing.
 
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Briar Lee

Lifer
Sep 4, 2021
5,396
15,429
Humansville Missouri
I didn't say technology never equals progress...I said it doesn't always equal it.

And I just asked the man in the mirror...he said he stands by his statement.

PS: you can’t buy anything close to a “basic car” because they don’t make them anymore.

Yep, because they didn’t sell.

Well, they did sell, but last and for a steep discount. Then when they got traded in, the owner got less money.

My wife needs a newer Suburban and all the brand new ones are $75,000.

In theory you could buy a plain one for $65,000, but the dealerships only order the ones with heated seats.:)

When I was a kid a car loan was two or three years.

Now it’s six to eight.

They have to last the life of the loan, and then some.
 
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brian64

Lifer
Jan 31, 2011
10,247
16,802
Yep, because they didn’t sell.

Well, they did sell, but last and for a steep discount. Then when they got traded in, the owner got less money.

My wife needs a newer Suburban and all the brand new ones are $75,000.

In theory you could buy a plain one for $65,000, but the dealerships only order the ones with heated seats.:)

When I was a kid a car loan was two or three years.

Now it’s six to eight.

They have to last the life of the loan, and then some.

I’d definitely buy a true basic car for the right price if they made one…and I think a lot of people would.
 

Briar Lee

Lifer
Sep 4, 2021
5,396
15,429
Humansville Missouri
Ha ha, bullshit. We have no idea how long a motor is going to last that was just built. But, mainly it is those batteries that is of more concern than the motor.
If you like EVs so much, buy you one. But, for one, they are way too expensive for mainstream America to afford, and just impractical for most mainstream America. My house is on one side of a stream, and we park on the other side, with laws preventing me from being able to run electrical lines across that stream. So, I personally will never own one.
I know that Musk is kicking around this idea of only leasing his cars, but to lease a vehicle, verses buying one, you are just throwing your money away. And, to be tied to that service contract... why would someone want these terrible financial choices?

Of course there are other EV options, but they are all just about as terrible.
Are you aware that the wheels on an EV have been specially engineered to carry the weight of all of those batteries? The weight is three times that of my pick up truck and the wheels run about $480 a tire, and will have to be replaced more frequently, because it is carrying way more weight than a regular car.

I'm not sure why you are cramming this EV crap down our throats in a Jeep thread. But, you either don't know anyone who owns one, or you are being misled. But, the costs of everything concerning an EV is more than a regular car... except maybe the cost of the oil that is being burned to make electricity to charge that thing.

Ha ha, bullshit. We have no idea how long a motor is going to last that was just built. But, mainly it is those batteries that is of more concern than the motor.
If you like EVs so much, buy you one. But, for one, they are way too expensive for mainstream America to afford, and just impractical for most mainstream America. My house is on one side of a stream, and we park on the other side, with laws preventing me from being able to run electrical lines across that stream. So, I personally will never own one.
I know that Musk is kicking around this idea of only leasing his cars, but to lease a vehicle, verses buying one, you are just throwing your money away. And, to be tied to that service contract... why would someone want these terrible financial choices?

Of course there are other EV options, but they are all just about as terrible.
Are you aware that the wheels on an EV have been specially engineered to carry the weight of all of those batteries? The weight is three times that of my pick up truck and the wheels run about $480 a tire, and will have to be replaced more frequently, because it is carrying way more weight than a regular car.

I'm not sure why you are cramming this EV crap down our throats in a Jeep thread. But, you either don't know anyone who owns one, or you are being misled. But, the costs of everything concerning an EV is more than a regular car... except maybe the cost of the oil that is being burned to make electricity to charge that thing.

I’m not buying any new car, probably ever.

But about 15 million new cars will sell this year, so I can buy one used.

Detroit made motors that outlasted the car bodies sometime in the late seventies.

Tesla claims million mile motors, and that’s likely an understatement.

The problem with electrics is the battery degrades.

Not saying it fails, it degrades.

Mama’s range decreases. She’ll want a new buggy.

It’s a long, long march towards the Wonderful One Hoss Shay.

Look at your car. No matter how old it is, the clear coat paint is still shiny.

The suspension is practically everlasting.

Exhaust systems haven’t rusted in thirty years.

Seats don’t sag.

It likely will not need a new $100 radiator, but if it does you’ll forget about it soon.

The death of it comes when a rebuilt transmission is more than a good used car.



And when that good used car is electric and goes 0-60 in three seconds and runs on 4 cents a mile the gas cars days are soon over.

Winston Churchill is credited with saying capitalism is the worst system, except for all the others.:)

When you watch Elon Musk, and all the stuff he can afford to do, remember the namesake of his wealth, Nikola Tesla, died in poverty in a hotel.

Henry Ford’s grandkids still own a big chunk of Ford.

What Elon’s obituary will state, is he didn’t invent the electric car, he produced the Tesla.

By then a Tesla might not be a car brand.

The big makers are hard, hard after him.
 
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cosmicfolklore

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2013
35,772
84,216
Between the Heart of Alabama and Hot Springs NC
but the dealerships only order the ones with heated seats.
I have told dealerships to order me the cars I want, the color and options I want. They all say that they won't do it, but they always chase me down before I can get to my car to give me what I want. They still charge extra for an automatic transmission, and when I turn their arms, they will either drop that extra price or order me a special built manual tranny. I used to own a Civic with a manual transmission, because I wouldn't take anything else. It also came with window cranks. It was a 2015... till my daughter totaled it at the end of my driveway.
 

cosmicfolklore

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2013
35,772
84,216
Between the Heart of Alabama and Hot Springs NC
The death of it comes when a rebuilt transmission is more than a good used car.
I'm not sure who your mechanic is, but my oldest just put a new motor in her 1997 Tahoe for $3000, and the transmission was great, but my mechanic has a machine that makes rebuilding a transmission very cheap. It is way cheaper to do now than it was twenty years ago. So, we will see more cars and especially trucks last forever on the roads.
 
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brian64

Lifer
Jan 31, 2011
10,247
16,802
I have told dealerships to order me the cars I want, the color and options I want. They all say that they won't do it, but they always chase me down before I can get to my car to give me what I want. They still charge extra for an automatic transmission, and when I turn their arms, they will either drop that extra price or order me a special built manual tranny. I used to own a Civic with a manual transmission, because I wouldn't take anything else. It also came with window cranks. It was a 2015... till my daughter totaled it at the end of my driveway.

I don't think you're allowed to say tranny anymore.
 

dd57chevy

Can't Leave
Apr 7, 2023
418
1,206
Iowa
I question whether our electric grid/generating plants can handle the demand , especially in California .


"The general consensus is that utilities will be able to keep up with electric vehicle adoption due to planned infrastructure upgrades costing hundreds of billions of dollars. But many will recall there are some states that have had trouble keeping up with demand — notably California, who in the summer of 2022 experienced rolling blackouts due to excessive heat, and at one point even asked electric vehicle owners to refrain from charging their vehicles over the Labor Day weekend. Given the long cycles for infrastructure upgrades, states with aggressive electric vehicle mandates will be strained to keep up with electric vehicle adoption — especially since adoption rates are unpredictable, making capacity planning difficult."
 

Briar Lee

Lifer
Sep 4, 2021
5,396
15,429
Humansville Missouri
I question whether our electric grid/generating plants can handle the demand , especially in California .


"The general consensus is that utilities will be able to keep up with electric vehicle adoption due to planned infrastructure upgrades costing hundreds of billions of dollars. But many will recall there are some states that have had trouble keeping up with demand — notably California, who in the summer of 2022 experienced rolling blackouts due to excessive heat, and at one point even asked electric vehicle owners to refrain from charging their vehicles over the Labor Day weekend. Given the long cycles for infrastructure upgrades, states with aggressive electric vehicle mandates will be strained to keep up with electric vehicle adoption — especially since adoption rates are unpredictable, making capacity planning difficult."

Sometime after Fukushima, Union Electric, that operates the Callaway nuclear plant, had a series of debates in St Louis and my wife and I attended them all.

What the electric cars, then just a fraction of the market, will do is help balance the grid.

The grid has to handle peak demand, which is in the hot summer when Mama loads up the washer and dryer and cooks the brats supper while the A/C blows cold.

Then each night the demand falls until the next morning.

Nuclear power is two cents a kilo, but there are problems with do gooders and a staggering start up cost, plus occasionally there’s a Fukushima.

Wind energy was second cheapest then, likely as cheap as nuclear today,

The electrics will charge up while the family sleeps.

The power companies have a huge, huge new market to sell cheap power at night.
 

dd57chevy

Can't Leave
Apr 7, 2023
418
1,206
Iowa
Sometime after Fukushima, Union Electric, that operates the Callaway nuclear plant, had a series of debates in St Louis and my wife and I attended them all.
Curious as to the reason a lawyer from Bugtussle would attend . Are you a member of some kind of elec advisory/supervising board ?

I have to be careful how I say this , but I question the motives/wisdom that will be applied in Cali........
 

cosmicfolklore

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2013
35,772
84,216
Between the Heart of Alabama and Hot Springs NC
Curious as to the reason a lawyer from Bugtussle would attend . Are you a member of some kind of elec advisory/supervising board ?
My mother lives up in North Alabama, and every time Browns Ferry Nuclear Power Plant makes a new policy, they have to inform the public within the blast zone of the plant, which is pretty much all of North Alabama. By law, they have to do it in person, so they meet in several public places to reach everyone.
 
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dd57chevy

Can't Leave
Apr 7, 2023
418
1,206
Iowa
My mother lives up in North Alabama, and every time Browns Ferry Nuclear Power Plant makes a new policy, they have to inform the public within the blast zone of the plant, which is pretty much all of North Alabama. By law, they have to do it in person, so they meet in several public places to reach everyone.
Ok , I missed that Briar was talking about a nuke in Missouri . :rolleyes:
 

dd57chevy

Can't Leave
Apr 7, 2023
418
1,206
Iowa
I still have concerns about electricity demand . Cedar Rapids is poised to build a Google data processing facility on 1400 acres of land !


It was recently announced that the DAEC nuke plant will be reopened .


. I just want to have an operating fridge . 😁
 
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