Ogden's St Julien

[jaingorenard]

@simong and I recently had the chance to pick up a few pouches of some of the old Ogden's blends, including St Julien. St Julien was an incredibly popular tobacco in the UK, and makes up by far the majority of empty tins you find in junk and antique shops. I know a fair few pipe smokers who say 'my father/grandfather smoked St Julien'.

Having said that, I have never met anyone who has ever smoked it. So I thought I'd ask the forum! Has anyone smoked it?

 

[BingBong]

I have no doubt I did sometime knocking on 50 years ago, but it wasn't memorable like, say, Condor or Balkan Sobranie. That's a blast from the past, have you sampled it yet?

 

[jaingorenard]

I have no doubt I did sometime knocking on 50 years ago, but it wasn't memorable like, say, Condor or Balkan Sobranie. That's a blast from the past, have you sampled it yet?

Not yet!

 

[Mrs. Pickles]

Has anyone smoked it?

Only in my dreams! I’ve been curious about St Julien ever since stumbling on to a list of the components in its topping:

Source: Industry Documents Library - https://www.industrydocuments.ucsf.edu/tobacco/docs/#id=nnfj0211

(Also see page one of that document [code name BONBAC] for the components of St. Bruno's sauce when BAT made the blend. I think page three [UNPLAIT-X] is the case for Player's Navy Cut cigarettes.)

Just going off the list, I'm imagining a fresh batch would be smell like a warmer and creamier version of the old St. Bruno with baby powder Ylang Ylang at the forefront.

I heard a rumor that St Julien once had cocaine in the formula way back in the day, too.

This promises to be extrodinary stuff and so exciting to see such a well preserved package. Please let us know how it smokes!

 

[Terry Lennox]

Only in my dreams! I’ve been curious about St Julien ever since stumbling on to a list of the components in its topping:

View attachment 352297 Source: Industry Documents Library - https://www.industrydocuments.ucsf.edu/tobacco/docs/#id=nnfj0211

(Also see page one of that document [code name BONBAC] for the components of St. Bruno's sauce when BAT made the blend. I think page three [UNPLAIT-X] is the case for Player's Navy Cut cigarettes.)

Just going off the list, I'm imagining a fresh batch would be smell like a warmer and creamier version of the old St. Bruno with baby powder Ylang Ylang at the forefront.

I heard a rumor that St Julien once had cocaine in the formula way back in the day, too.

This promises to be extrodinary stuff and so exciting to see such a well preserved package. Please let us know how it smokes!

"Civet extract"
Don't Google it!

 

[sablebrush52]

That one has intrigued me since I first became aware of it, years ago, but long after it had been discontinued.

 

[beef]

Those damn civets... they also produce the most expensive coffee in the world if I am not mistaken. You brew their shit.

 

[Terry Lennox]

Your post just led me to take a tour of that tobacco document archive. How I would love to taste the old Capstan containing coumarin. I am very curious how the current iteration is flavored.

(meant this in reply to Mrs Pickles above)

 

[Mrs. Pickles]

Your post just led me to take a tour of that tobacco document archive. How I would love to taste the old Capstan containing coumarin. I am very curious how the current iteration is flavored.

(meant this in reply to Mrs Pickles above)

My guess the current Capstan is flavored with a synthetic replacement like Coumarex, but food grade.

 

[jaingorenard]

Only in my dreams! I’ve been curious about St Julien ever since stumbling on to a list of the components in its topping:

View attachment 352297 Source: Industry Documents Library - https://www.industrydocuments.ucsf.edu/tobacco/docs/#id=nnfj0211

(Also see page one of that document [code name BONBAC] for the components of St. Bruno's sauce when BAT made the blend. I think page three [UNPLAIT-X] is the case for Player's Navy Cut cigarettes.)

Just going off the list, I'm imagining a fresh batch would be smell like a warmer and creamier version of the old St. Bruno with baby powder Ylang Ylang at the forefront.

I heard a rumor that St Julien once had cocaine in the formula way back in the day, too.

This promises to be extrodinary stuff and so exciting to see such a well preserved package. Please let us know how it smokes!

What a fascinating document; thanks for sharing it. How did you find out to which tobaccos the codes referred?

 

[OzPiper]

"Civet extract"
Don't Google it!

Those damn civets... they also produce the most expensive coffee in the world if I am not mistaken. You brew their shit.

Growing up in Malaysia, my father was a keen huntsman in his younger days. He used to come back occasionally with a civet (“musang” in Malay”) or two. You can smell them from quite a way because of the “musk” they produce from their perianal scent glands.
I was never fond of civet soup

Civets love coffee berries, but the beans pass through their digestive tracts in their poop untouched. Kopi luwak is mainly “farmed” these days but still fetch a premium.
And no, I have not been tempted to try

 

[BingBong]

"Civet extract"
Don't Google it!

It's the cat's whiskers, old chap.

 

[condorlover1]

Yes I have smoked it. It had vanished from the U.K about or soon after I had left the country for the states. To be frank with you I cannot recall what it tasted like since it was something I purchased once or twice because the shop had no Condor RR on hand probably.

 

[Mrs. Pickles]

What a fascinating document; thanks for sharing it. How did you find out to which tobaccos the codes referred?

Searching around in the archive you’ll find company communications that reference the codes in conjunction with the tobaccos.

Here's one that associates BONBAC and JESTER with St Bruno and St Julien:

Industry Documents Library

www.industrydocuments.ucsf.edu

This is a much more extensive list of codes.

Industry Documents Library

www.industrydocuments.ucsf.edu

BONBAC and JESTER are defined on page 22:



Interestingly, page 23 also mentions BRUNSAN and JULESET as separate codes for St Bruno and St Julien's flavors. Looking at other memos, those seem to be alternative formulations that replaced BONBAC and JESTER for a time.

No doubt some codgers were pissed when that happened. It's too bad they didn't have a pipe forum to share their grievances.

 

[Terry Lennox]

Searching around in the archive you’ll find company communications that reference the codes in conjunction with the tobaccos.

Here's one that associates BONBAC and JESTER with St Bruno and St Julien:

Industry Documents Library

www.industrydocuments.ucsf.edu

This is a much more extensive list of codes.

Industry Documents Library

www.industrydocuments.ucsf.edu

BONBAC and JESTER are defined on page 22:

View attachment 352525

Interestingly, page 23 also mentions BRUNSAN and JULESET as separate codes for St Bruno and St Julien's flavors. Looking at other memos, those seem to be alternative formulations that replaced BONBAC and JESTER for a time.

No doubt some codgers were pissed when that happened. It's too bad they didn't have a pipe forum to share their grievances.

What I took away from reading many of the correspondence back and forth is that BAT licensed the manufacture of blends (and cigarettes) to different regions, and then would ship the flavorings in steel drums around the world. The flavorings is how they controlled the brands in factories that they didn't fully own, in say, India or Denmark. As each country's laws changed they had to develop new formulations for those regions, and thus new code names.

 

[greeneyes]

@simong and I recently had the chance to pick up a few pouches of some of the old Ogden's blends, including St Julien. St Julien was an incredibly popular tobacco in the UK, and makes up by far the majority of empty tins you find in junk and antique shops. I know a fair few pipe smokers who say 'my father/grandfather smoked St Julien'.

Having said that, I have never met anyone who has ever smoked it. So I thought I'd ask the forum! Has anyone smoked it? View attachment 352025

This is exciting, J!! I'd love to see what the flake looks like when you've opened it! It was such a famous brand!

 

[jaingorenard]

This is exciting, J!! I'd love to see what the flake looks like when you've opened it! It was such a famous brand!

I think it's ready rubbed, but you'll definitely get to see it when it's opened! Not quite as exciting, but I managed to pick up these today from a junk shop