Massachusetts Flavored Tobacco Ban

[jeff540]

These laws are written and passed with the underlying assumption that law-abiding citizens will voluntarily comply regardless of the effects to their persons or business.

Time to re-read Atlas Shrugged again.

 

[briarbuck]

while you’re respecting the other persons point of view, are they respecting yours? This entire thread exist because a mob doesn’t respect our point of view.

Nope, they don't. There was some guy a long time ago that said something about turning the other cheek.

 

[anantaandroscoggin]

Which often results in one obtaining four bruised cheeks.

 

[oldgeezersmoker]

while you’re respecting the other persons point of view, are they respecting yours? This entire thread exist because a mob doesn’t respect our point of view.

“The mob” = the overwhelming majority of people that I live amongst in a county that is part of a Congressional District that has never sent a Democrat to Congress since before the civil war. In another thread, I mentioned that of the dozens of locally owned eating establishments we have, only three that make any accommodations for smokers. All could and be in compliance with state law and local ordinances. Why? Their patrons don’t want to be exposed to second hand smoke.

Nor does this same “mob” want to have to give their children nicotine blood tests every night to make sure that they aren’t Juuling. Juul is a company that intentionally marketed to youth, and as the recent New York Times article showed, planned to get in bed with big tobacco as their cash out strategy. And they did, with Altria. . Big tobacco simply can’t resist youth marketing. It works in that age group.

I live between a middle school and high school in a residential area and every day I see middle and high school aged kids walking from school to home puffing their Juuls. Where are the parents, you ask? Isn’t it their responsibility? Well yeah. You can frisk your kid every time he or she enters the house. Or you can do what some parents in my conservative community have done- raise hell with their state representative. I know the man, and he has heard about it.

I know I come up short on the injunction to love my neighbors as myself, but I refuse to characterize them as a mob.

 

[olkofri]

Nope, they don't. There was some guy a long time ago that said something about turning the other cheek.

Same Guy who whipped the materialists and chased them out when they crossed a certain line. We're not s'posed to be turning the other cheek forever (Eccles. 3:7-8).

 

[briarbuck]

It's all tribal crappola. I choose not to play that game.

 

[ron123]

It's all tribal crappola.

I don't disagree

I choose not to play that game.

Seems like you already shook the dice, though ;-)

 

[Worknman]

I continue to watch tobacco legislation closely, 1. Because it's sort of my thing to watch legislation progress regarding things I care about, and 2. Because I truly enjoy (as you all do) pipes and cigars, and I stand with all of you who wish to be able to carry on the free practice of a time honored tradition. My worry with the entire flavoring ban, is, as you might guess, that this will result in a ban of ALL pipe tobacco, given that per GL Pease, all pipe tobacco is cased with SOME sort of flavoring agent. I understand the difference between topping and casing, and perhaps they only mean TOPPED pipe tobacco, but I see this as a distinction probably lost on the gov'mint.

With the approaching bill banning internet sales of all tobacco products (except "premium" cigars costing more than $12), we must mobilize like the CRA (though I realize we're fewer in numbers and have less clout). I continue to build my cellar and humidor via our local B&M as my state already has this ban. It behooves us (and I'm sure we've tried) to join with the CRA to work on this problem.

From part of the bill found here https://malegislature.gov/Bills/191/H4089

Section 28. (a) As used in this section, the following words shall have the following
4 meanings unless the context clearly requires otherwise:
5 “Characterizing Flavor”, a distinguishable taste or aroma, other than the taste or aroma of
6 tobacco, imparted or detectable either prior to or during consumption of a tobacco product or
7 component part thereof, including but not limited to, a taste or aroma relating to any fruit,
8 chocolate, vanilla, honey, candy, cocoa, dessert, alcoholic beverage, menthol, mint, wintergreen,
9 herb or spice; provided, however, that no tobacco product shall be determined to have a
10 characterizing flavor solely because of the provision of ingredient information or the use of
11 additives or flavorings that do not contribute to the distinguishable taste or aroma of the product.

To me the last three paragraphs means that toppings that dont impart a "distinguishable" flavor aren't included in the provision. Therefore non aromatics arent included even though they may still be lightly topped with something.

 

[oldgeezersmoker]

From part of the bill found here https://malegislature.gov/Bills/191/H4089

Section 28. (a) As used in this section, the following words shall have the following
4 meanings unless the context clearly requires otherwise:
5 “Characterizing Flavor”, a distinguishable taste or aroma, other than the taste or aroma of
6 tobacco, imparted or detectable either prior to or during consumption of a tobacco product or
7 component part thereof, including but not limited to, a taste or aroma relating to any fruit,
8 chocolate, vanilla, honey, candy, cocoa, dessert, alcoholic beverage, menthol, mint, wintergreen,
9 herb or spice; provided, however, that no tobacco product shall be determined to have a
10 characterizing flavor solely because of the provision of ingredient information or the use of
11 additives or flavorings that do not contribute to the distinguishable taste or aroma of the product.

To me the last three paragraphs means that toppings that dont impart a "distinguishable" flavor aren't included in the provision. Therefore non aromatics arent included even though they may still be lightly topped with something.

Carter Hall? Bob’s Chocolate Flake? Sutliff Mocha Strips? The regulations implementing that bare bones language will be written by people who have no understanding of pioe tobacco at all Those drawing the lines won’t be our friends.

 

[oldgeezersmoker]

Time to re-read Atlas Shrugged again.

“There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs."

John Rogers

 

[brian64]

I loved the Orc section in Atlas Shrugged.

 

[jaytex1969]

I got an email auto-reply from the mighty leader of Massholio today. It, of course, does not actually address any issue.

Dear XXXXXX,


On behalf of Governor Charles D. Baker, thank you for your recent correspondence. The Baker-Polito Administration values your input and we are grateful to have your voice as part of the discussion.
Again, thank you for contacting Governor Baker’s office and please feel free to contact our office in the future with any questions or concerns you may have regarding other matters.



Sincerely,

Constituent Services Aide
Office of Governor Charlie Baker

 

[perdurabo]

“There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs."

John Rogers

Damn, that’s a great summary of Mr. Thompson and his government cronies. You think Rand was talking about Wilson and Co. or divining the future of brainless intellectuals Like Warren and Soros?

 

[perdurabo]

“The mob” = the overwhelming majority of people that I live amongst in a county that is part of a Congressional District that has never sent a Democrat to Congress since before the civil war. In another thread, I mentioned that of the dozens of locally owned eating establishments we have, only three that make any accommodations for smokers. All could and be in compliance with state law and local ordinances. Why? Their patrons don’t want to be exposed to second hand smoke.

Nor does this same “mob” want to have to give their children nicotine blood tests every night to make sure that they aren’t Juuling. Juul is a company that intentionally marketed to youth, and as the recent New York Times article showed, planned to get in bed with big tobacco as their cash out strategy. And they did, with Altria. . Big tobacco simply can’t resist youth marketing. It works in that age group.

I live between a middle school and high school in a residential area and every day I see middle and high school aged kids walking from school to home puffing their Juuls. Where are the parents, you ask? Isn’t it their responsibility? Well yeah. You can frisk your kid every time he or she enters the house. Or you can do what some parents in my conservative community have done- raise hell with their state representative. I know the man, and he has heard about it.

I know I come up short on the injunction to love my neighbors as myself, but I refuse to characterize them as a mob.

They’re still a mob.

 

[olkofri]

They’re still a mob.

Yeah, part of loving your neighbour is calling a spade a spade and warning them against noxious people.

I got an email auto-reply from the mighty leader of Massholio today. It, of course, does not actually address any issue.

Dear XXXXXX,


On behalf of Governor Charles D. Baker, thank you for your recent correspondence. The Baker-Polito Administration values your input and we are grateful to have your voice as part of the discussion.
Again, thank you for contacting Governor Baker’s office and please feel free to contact our office in the future with any questions or concerns you may have regarding other matters.



Sincerely,

Constituent Services Aide
Office of Governor Charlie Baker



View attachment 10077

The typical, standard canned response, before the correspondence gets put through the digital incinerator. That's why I don't really bother with 'writing my representatives'.

 

[jaytex1969]

Despite the response being a typical, vague, political one, I believe they still tally how many pro and con responses they get and it does factor into decision making, particularly if they perceive a loss of votes.

 

[logs]

I agree a tally is kept of the types of responses received and that, in aggregate, it can have an effect on how a representative votes. No, they're not going to craft a personal response to voter emails. No congressperson has time for that. It doesn't mean it's not worth the trouble writing.

 

[ssjones]

Time to take this one to Facebook, Reddit, talkaboutpolitics.com, etc.