Longevity Of Samuel Gawith Tins?

[Corcoran-Rooney]

As a newbie I have had trouble even getting some of these tins open, I can't believe they would lose pressure. About two months ago I got a tin of FVF. I got a coin between my finger and thumb, and twisted at the edge. Only the coin gave way, and the nail of my index finger inserted itself, with force, under the lip of the lid. Needless to say the lid didn't come off, but a large part of my finger nail did. Very painful. Well, good to know I just have to wait eight years and it will open itself lol

 

[autumnfog]

Thanks for the answers, gents!

 

[Snow Hill]

Also, a recent thread about SG tins - Warning Regarding Mylar Bag Storage.

 

[cigrmaster]

I will keep on saying it. You don't need mylar for your tins. I have never had a tin fail. I have never used mylar or any type of food storage. Years and years later my tins are fine and I don't use anything to put my tins in. I keep my house at 73-74 degrees and I keep the humidity in my house the same all year round. You don't need anything but just a stable environment.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

I will keep on saying it. You don't need mylar for your tins. I have never had a tin fail. I have never used mylar or any type of food storage. Years and years later my tins are fine and I don't use anything to put my tins in. I keep my house at 73-74 degrees and I keep the humidity in my house the same all year round. You don't need anything but just a stable environment.

You'd better be careful, Harris. Greg and Sable are going to go over to your house and hide your remote controls, ha ha.

 

[Mtlpiper]

I've found that quite a few SG tins from the last year have arrived in terrible condition. They had a shortage from their supplier and were using poor stock or sourcing elsewhere (I read at least).

I don't buy tins from G&H (just bulk) and any Samuel Gawith or Germains I get hold of go straight into jars. The stuff is often so wet that I've had tins that were 5 years old rust right through the can. Jars are just more of a reliable constant than those rectangular tins.

 

[jon11]

The only tins that I’ve had fail were some tins of Kingfisher. I have a bunch of old Samuel Gawith tins and all are intact. Other than Kingfisher nothing has failed. I have over 500 C&D type tins, many are swollen but not a one has ever popped. I have never and would never pop a tin to jar it unless I were going to smoke it. The failure rate is so low if kept in a stable environment that you are better off keeping it in its original tin.

 

[mingc]

The only tins that I’ve had fail were some tins of Kingfisher. I have a bunch of old Samuel Gawith tins and all are intact. Other than Kingfisher nothing has failed. I have over 500 C&D type tins, many are swollen but not a one has ever popped. I have never and would never pop a tin to jar it unless I were going to smoke it. The failure rate is so low if kept in a stable environment that you are better off keeping it in its original tin.

The old rectangular Kingfisher tins?

 

[FurCoat]

Wait until they turn round shaped and explode.

I have a few that may require calling in the bomb squad. More so the Low Country blends with 6 years on them.

 

[SmokeClouds]

Oldest SG that I have are 7 years old. Never had a problem with any of them. However, throughout the years some arrived dented due to poor packaging from the retailer. The content of those tins was transferred to jars or mylar bags.
If you are worried about the tin seals, I would suggest jarring as soon as possible.

 

[jon11]

The old rectangular Kingfisher tins?

Yes

 

[PipeIT]

Actually my Squadron is from 2012, and I opened it last year, so 8 years closed. It has a bit of rust on the edges and some inside, but it hissed when I opened it, and the tabac had nice moisture too, tastes sublime!

The Ennerdale has a few very faint specks, and the SJF, I have not opened, but I just took a good whiff and no smells coming out the tin, it’s January 2014, so is Ennerdale.

P.S. I can still smell the fruity Lakeland smell in the Ennerdale tin, and the nice smoke English in the SL.

 

[glpease]

I'm not arguing against what you've said, Sable....
but @glpease ...
If tins fail so often, why not sell your blends as bulks? Why keep selling us inferior packaging?

I'm not sure exactly what Sable is referring to, but apparently I was not clear with what I wrote, or I was referring to something specific, or I've just forgotten something. After over 20 years of writing about this stuff, there's a high probability of the latter...

There was a time when we were having a hell of a time with tin consistency, which is one of the reasons we moved to the current flat tins. (I'm terrible with dates, but I think it was about 2005-6 when we made the change - certainly before 2007.) Even with the older tins, it was only a couple of batches from ca. 2001, as I recall, that had serious issues. Since switching, I've been more than satisfied with the quality of these tins. They have been extremely reliable, both with holding their seal, and with plastic over-caps that actually fit. (THAT, too, was a recurring nightmare with the old ones. For some reason, the manufacturer of the original tins and maker of the plastic over-caps could not always agree on what 2-11/16" was, and the caps ranged from being impossible to put on to impossible to keep on. Must have had different rulers.) I have no problems at all recommending aging my blends in the tins at this point, and that's exactly what I do.

What I have had many problems with over the years is flat tins, especially the rectangular ones. While some have held their seals brilliantly, others have not. As the sealing compound dries over time, the absence of a solid mechanical crimp, such as on pull-top tins, can result in the seal being broken by the slightest knock, or even a sudden temperature fluctuations. The flat, round tins with the "semi-threaded" lids have fared better, but haven't been perfect. I know a few pipesters who routinely seal their flat tins in vacuum-bags to help guard against this. Seems to work.

I have always advocated, and still do, putting tobacco in jars once you've opened it, unless you're going to smoke through it within a month or two; though the current plastic caps do a pretty good job, they're not perfect, and for longer term storage, jars are best.

Did I miss anything?

 

[craiginthecorn]

RO Acadian Gold tins from (I think) 2017.

Some of those tins were packed dripping wet. Both of mine were moldy.

 

[craiginthecorn]

Everything Greg shared lines up with my experience.

The lack of any threads on the rectangular tins is their Achilles' Heel. I have also noticed that it's fairly common to open an older rectangular tin that's sealed, but after seeing the amount of corrosion on the lip, it's hard to imagine how they held their seal at all. The best thing about rectangular tins is how space efficient they are. It's a PITA to store tins after they've been sealed in bags, so I have chosen to selectively seal only a small percentage of my tins in bags.

The modern round, flat tins with the semi-thread are generally reliable. Still, my plastic storage bins containing them smell of tobacco. Something is leaking. I have chosen, however, to accept a certain amount of loss over time for the sake of convenience.

The taller 2-11/16" tins, like those used by C&D and McClelland are very reliable since they began being lined with plastic film sometime between 1985 and 1995. Unlined tins can be a crapshoot. Balkan Sobranie comes to mind. No plastic lining. No paper lining either, so the tobacco is in direct contact with the metal. Adds up to corrosion and wasted tobacco.

The paint can tins are probably the most controversial. I've heard Mike McNeil say on multiple occasions that those aren't intended for long-term storage, yet my experience has been very positive. My oldest such tins are Paul Olsen My Own Blend from the early 2000s. Brian Levine, who was working for Peter Stokkebye at that time was responsible for bringing them to the US market. They're all in excellent shape and good tobacco, too. My favorite HU blends come in those same tins. With some of them, I have heeded Mike's warning and sealed the contents into three small mylar bags, which I then store back in the tin. Others I'm figuring on smoking soon enough that I didn't bother repackaging.

All my Esoterica bags have been enclosed in heavy, heat-sealed mylar.

One last thought is that when storing in glass canning jars, take care to avoid leaving any tobacco on the rim of the jar. When bits of tobacco become embedded in the sealing compound of the lid, the seal may become compromised.

 

[Inspired Idler]

I'll add my anecdote to the discussion. In my last SG order, 5 of 12 tins had compromised seals. I put them in mylar, but after reading this, it seems like I should move them to jars.

 

[glpease]

The taller 2-11/16" tins, like those used by C&D and McClelland are very reliable since they began being lined with plastic film sometime between 1985 and 1995. Unlined tins can be a crapshoot. Balkan Sobranie comes to mind. No plastic lining. No paper lining either, so the tobacco is in direct contact with the metal. Adds up to corrosion and wasted tobacco.

By way of clarification, the old tall tins we used were 2-11/16". McClelland never used those. The ones currently in use, and that McClelland used, are 3-7/16". And, yes, the coatings are critical, which was the biggest source of headaches for us with the old steel tins ca. 2001. A couple batches were produced with inadequate coatings, and they tended to corrode, especially along the vertical seams. (We always specified coatings made for acidic food storage. The can company just screwed up...) Again, no issues with the current tins.

As for old UK tobaccos, I've actually been a bit surprised by how few of them have failed due to rust, considering most were never coated at all.

 

[sablebrush52]

I'm not sure exactly what Sable is referring to, but apparently I was not clear with what I wrote, or I was referring to something specific, or I've just forgotten something. After over 20 years of writing about this stuff, there's a high probability of the latter...

There was a time when we were having a hell of a time with tin consistency, which is one of the reasons we moved to the current flat tins. (I'm terrible with dates, but I think it was about 2005-6 when we made the change - certainly before 2007.) Even with the older tins, it was only a couple of batches from ca. 2001, as I recall, that had serious issues. Since switching, I've been more than satisfied with the quality of these tins. They have been extremely reliable, both with holding their seal, and with plastic over-caps that actually fit. (THAT, too, was a recurring nightmare with the old ones. For some reason, the manufacturer of the original tins and maker of the plastic over-caps could not always agree on what 2-11/16" was, and the caps ranged from being impossible to put on to impossible to keep on. Must have had different rulers.) I have no problems at all recommending aging my blends in the tins at this point, and that's exactly what I do.

What I have had many problems with over the years is flat tins, especially the rectangular ones. While some have held their seals brilliantly, others have not. As the sealing compound dries over time, the absence of a solid mechanical crimp, such as on pull-top tins, can result in the seal being broken by the slightest knock, or even a sudden temperature fluctuations. The flat, round tins with the "semi-threaded" lids have fared better, but haven't been perfect. I know a few pipesters who routinely seal their flat tins in vacuum-bags to help guard against this. Seems to work.

I have always advocated, and still do, putting tobacco in jars once you've opened it, unless you're going to smoke through it within a month or two; though the current plastic caps do a pretty good job, they're not perfect, and for longer term storage, jars are best.

Did I miss anything?

Hi Greg,

My source for that was a post you made to Mike Gluckler's YouTube Blog several years ago where you stated that you had changed your position and recommended jarring tobacco as soon as possible and aging it in the jar. This would have been around fall 2018, if I remember the time frame correctly. If this was someone impersonating you, you might ask Mike and see if he can send you the post.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Ok, thanks Greg.
I bend the knee, and the guys here will be happy that I no longer have a dog in the debate. While I still hold absolute faith in the tins and would never remove tobacco from a perfectly good tin to put into jars, myself, I will just remain quiet when questions of cellaring comes up.
the field is clear...

 

[smokeymo]

The rust gives it flavor. ?