Estervals order response from C/S
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In late 2020, when the USPS intercepted my Esterval's order and sent it rocketing back to Germany, I contacted Esterval's about the situation, with an eye toward paying them to ship it again.
Instead, I got an insulting letter, blaming me for the problem and stating that the return shipment would be impounded by German Customs, Esterval's would never actually receive it, and that Esterval's would be charging me for any Customs charges related to the impounded tobacco.
I decided fuck 'em for their attitude toward a regular customer, contacted my credit card company, and filed a dispute. They asked both Esterval's and me for all copies of our email as well as details of the purchase, and also the USPS shipment tracking record. After a week of so, my purchase was refunded and that was that.
No guarantees, but keep records in case anything goes pear shaped. And, NEVER pay cash with a bank transfer unless you are willing to take the loss, because you will have no leverage.
I wish Estervals would have provided that advice, or simply not allowed UPS as an option. I have had many issues with DHL in the past, but had I known this would be an issue, I’d have surely selected DHL.Because we see all your pretty pipes filled with Hans' goodies on the WAYS thread. And we're insatiable!
Besides, refusing to pay UPS' ridiculous fees was no trouble. Reshipping with DHL was also no trouble. Just an email and a little longer of a wait. But my cellar looks a heck of a lot better with it than without it and every time i load a bowl, it's with a smile and a story. Finding new loves is part of the adventure and the handful of HU blends i enjoy today on a regular basis: yep, worth it.
This is also Esterval's advice. If this is a recurrent problem, they should just take UPS off the shipping options list for the U.S.A. I have yet to hear of anyone having this happen with DHL.
Funny because previous advice on this forum and others recommended UPS. Their practices must change regularly.
Wow… they haven’t responded to me yet, but if they respond in a similar manner to my issue, I will be sure to post here.
Updates will come as soon as I receive their reply.
I just recently had good success with UPS shipping to PA. I also had very good response with Esterval C/S. Lukas from Esterval was very prompt and responsive.
I imagine that since you just rejected the shipment, Esterval will have to wait to see if the shipment is returned to them before being able to act.
It seems both UPS and DHL can have issues with their respective employees knowledge of the customs requirement for private party purchasing. You're not to blame for sure and I honestly dont think Esterval's is either. Ideally, UPS is made aware of their error and fulfills their shipping responsibility without either you or Esterval having to eat any more costs.
I imagine that since you just rejected the shipment, Esterval will have to wait to see if the shipment is returned to them before being able to act.
It seems both UPS and DHL can have issues with their respective employees knowledge of the customs requirement for private party purchasing. You're not to blame for sure and I honestly dont think Esterval's is either. Ideally, UPS is made aware of their error and fulfills their shipping responsibility without either you or Esterval having to eat any more costs.
White horse and Nashville, good selection! Would also like to have so feedback on the new version of Flannagan, now produced by Kopp
I haven't opened a tin of the new Flanagan yet. The couple of tins I've had were from some years ago and Dan tobacco produced?
Yes, they’ve switched production only recently. Glad you’ve tasted the older version to compare!
Any time you send something with any degree of sensitivity across a customs border it is subject to becoming a mess. No one is sitting and pondering your package. If you look at the detailed tracking you will typically see that it spent brief minutes being processed. So its a snap judgement by someone who may or may not know enough and may mke certain incorrect assumptions. Also, if in doubt they will charge fees.
Well, I had mine shipped UPS also. This might get interesting. I am not willing to pay anything more than what I have already agreed to pay via the order process.
I have never ordered baccy from Estervals. I did buy several amazing English pipes from him about 15 years ago when he had a great selection of pipes. They all arrived DHL no problem.
I believe to get some bags of Dan Tobacco blends I'm eying on his site I will need to fly to Germany and make a vacation out of it and bring the stuff back in my luggage.
I believe to get some bags of Dan Tobacco blends I'm eying on his site I will need to fly to Germany and make a vacation out of it and bring the stuff back in my luggage.
Well, this is not going well. I got an email from Estervals. They are saying I can pay to have it shipped again (with no guarantee it won’t happen through DHL) or I can get refunded minus shipping and unspecified return costs (!).
Frankly, this is exhausting and highlights the risks of ordering from Estervals and abroad generally. The options are simple: pay a highway robbery amount of random fees, accept imposition of extra return charges and loss of shipping costs, or gamble on a second shipment with DHL that could start the cycle all over again.
Yuck. I’ve ordered many things from abroad but this is the first time I have run into this issue.
Frankly, this is exhausting and highlights the risks of ordering from Estervals and abroad generally. The options are simple: pay a highway robbery amount of random fees, accept imposition of extra return charges and loss of shipping costs, or gamble on a second shipment with DHL that could start the cycle all over again.
Yuck. I’ve ordered many things from abroad but this is the first time I have run into this issue.
The thing you have to decide is if lightening strikes twice. I have to add my house was struck twice when I was a kid. Unfortuantely you cant control how the sender labels things. There are some legal ways around certain customs confusion but they vary from country to country and a shop is just going to do forms the way they do forms.
Just an example, I get raw goods to make my saxophone mouthpieces from the US. They shipped to me as a business in the past. DHL insisted that I provide them with a VAT number. Well, some registered small businesses in France dont get assigned a vat number. It took a zillion phone calls and a lot of anxiety to convince them of this. Once they finally understood I was happy to pay the VAT on the import they billed me and I paid. Keep in mind shipping alone for this was over 300 bucks and they were threating to send it back to the US.
Other times they have wanted an extra piece of paper that DHL in the US didnt provide. That took days.
Now I have my shipper send it to me as a person, not a business. They bill me my 20 percent, I pay and I get the package.
International shipping can go very smoothly or it can be a freakin mess. Trust me, its worse getting things on this end becuase there is almost always money attached to an import.
My guess is that there just isnt enough tobacco being legally brought in by the public for customs workers to know how to properly handle it.
Just an example, I get raw goods to make my saxophone mouthpieces from the US. They shipped to me as a business in the past. DHL insisted that I provide them with a VAT number. Well, some registered small businesses in France dont get assigned a vat number. It took a zillion phone calls and a lot of anxiety to convince them of this. Once they finally understood I was happy to pay the VAT on the import they billed me and I paid. Keep in mind shipping alone for this was over 300 bucks and they were threating to send it back to the US.
Other times they have wanted an extra piece of paper that DHL in the US didnt provide. That took days.
Now I have my shipper send it to me as a person, not a business. They bill me my 20 percent, I pay and I get the package.
International shipping can go very smoothly or it can be a freakin mess. Trust me, its worse getting things on this end becuase there is almost always money attached to an import.
My guess is that there just isnt enough tobacco being legally brought in by the public for customs workers to know how to properly handle it.
A further thing to remember is that most shipments make it to their destination as intended. There is a bit of a selection bias as we generally hear about the problematic shipments.
Yes, much like reviews. People who are angry or people who love something do product reviews. Those generally pleased are often not motivated to write anything.
I would have posted either way, but sure! Would have loved nothing more than to say, “No issues!”
Estervals CS made it clear to me upfront that it may be returned to them and I could pay for shipping again to resend. I took that slight gamble and had a flawless delivery. I think most orders are fine but I don't know the ratio but if there were more problems than not they probably would shut us down completely.
Did you use DHL? I wish they had been more communicative with me.
I live in Virginia and never had a shipment problem. I suspect it’s not a state issue, especially since we are still fairly tobacco friendly. That said, I have never made any foreign orders.