Escudo Discontinued?
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Yes duckfat, the auction in question is the older and discontinued AC Peterson production Escudo. The tin is from the Mike and Mary McNiel (owners of McClelland Tobacco Company) collection of rare tobacco tins that they have consigned with me for sale on eBay and my private tobacco website.
Best,
Pipestud
Best,
Pipestud
It looks, Orlik/STG are streamlining their production. All of these tobaccos were produced at Orlik, and as they are now bringing Dunhill Elizabethan Mixture back, a few other blends, like Capstan and 3N seem to be moved to Macbaren. Word has it in a German forum, that at least Capstan Blue is only a shadow of it's former self since the move.
As far as i know, Bullseye Flake, Davidoff Flake Medaillons, Escudo and Dunhill Navy Rolls are all produced at the same place at Orlik. I wonder, if only the Brand Escudo will vanish, or also the other 3, too. There aren't too many tobacco producers left in Europe, Orlik/STG, Samuel Gawith, MacBaren, Planta, Pöschl and DTM. K&K does not do Flakes anymore and outsourced them to Orlik, who have taken over most of the discontinued productions.
Best Regards,
Peter
As far as i know, Bullseye Flake, Davidoff Flake Medaillons, Escudo and Dunhill Navy Rolls are all produced at the same place at Orlik. I wonder, if only the Brand Escudo will vanish, or also the other 3, too. There aren't too many tobacco producers left in Europe, Orlik/STG, Samuel Gawith, MacBaren, Planta, Pöschl and DTM. K&K does not do Flakes anymore and outsourced them to Orlik, who have taken over most of the discontinued productions.
Best Regards,
Peter
Hopefully Kevin will investigate for us as he has done in the past.
Seems to me there are a number of key questions:
1. What is the status of Escudo?
2. Will any change to Escudo affect the other coin cuts (Flake Medallions, LBF, DNR etc)?
3. What is the status of Capstan and 3 Nuns.
4. If, as rumored, Mac Baren has picked up rights to Capstan, when will the switch occur?
5. Might Capstan and 3 Nuns be available in the US at some point?
I would be very surprised if K&K in Germany outsourced their flakes. They make a lot of flakes and I don't see that happening.
Seems to me there are a number of key questions:
1. What is the status of Escudo?
2. Will any change to Escudo affect the other coin cuts (Flake Medallions, LBF, DNR etc)?
3. What is the status of Capstan and 3 Nuns.
4. If, as rumored, Mac Baren has picked up rights to Capstan, when will the switch occur?
5. Might Capstan and 3 Nuns be available in the US at some point?
I would be very surprised if K&K in Germany outsourced their flakes. They make a lot of flakes and I don't see that happening.
Can't see it happening. It's a top seller and IF any of it is true, a way will be found. Forum panic buying, hmmm never saw that before.
craig, Three Nuns was a top seller for years and that one went the way of the dodo. If something costs too much to mfg for the profit available, I can easily see the mfg dropping it. It would not surprise me in the least if it got discontinued or was drastically changed.
I am not taking any chances, I just ordered 40 tins to bring my total to 110. I do not trust any of the European mfgs, they have shown a history of not being able to keep up with demand, discontinuing popular blends and basically not giving a shit about their customers. I wish my favorites were not from these clowns and I could smoke McClellend Virginia's.
I am not taking any chances, I just ordered 40 tins to bring my total to 110. I do not trust any of the European mfgs, they have shown a history of not being able to keep up with demand, discontinuing popular blends and basically not giving a shit about their customers. I wish my favorites were not from these clowns and I could smoke McClellend Virginia's.
The switch regarding Capstan has already happened. You can see the different tins and tobacco here (might be you have to be registered):
http://www.pfeife-tabak.de/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=9460&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=10
The info regarding K&K not making flakes themselves comes from a trustworthy member of the same forum, who talked with the owner of K&K.
Best Regards,
Peter
http://www.pfeife-tabak.de/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=9460&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=10
The info regarding K&K not making flakes themselves comes from a trustworthy member of the same forum, who talked with the owner of K&K.
Best Regards,
Peter
Well one thing for sure, this forum will wipe out the majors. Jesus Harris, now I had to place an order for a dozen -- thanks 
Just let me add, that not all European tobacco companies don't give a shit about their customers, but it is STG, who are first to shoot down a product, because it generates not enough profit. What do you expect from a company, which moved Stanwell production to Italy, which turned the quality down a few notches.
Best Regards,
Peter
Best Regards,
Peter
K&K produces many flakes, from Peterson's Irish Flake and University Flake to Rattray's Marlin Flake to F&T Cut Virginia Plug, etc. Moving all of those flakes would be a very big change to the entire industry and affect many different companies and importers. Think we need more confirmation before believing that.
K&K hasn't produced any flakes themselves for quite some time.
Just look at the Dunhill debate: Being mentioned on the K&K homepage or having a K&K tax
number doesn't necessarily mean that they are acutally manufactured by K&K.
Flakes are just a micro-segment of the small segment "pipe tobacco", producing a
large number of flakes requires a lot of machinery and storage space (just think of the time some flakes
spend in the press), so it is probably cheaper to give it to one of the few/two manufacturers who have the
sufficient capacity.
Just look at the Dunhill debate: Being mentioned on the K&K homepage or having a K&K tax
number doesn't necessarily mean that they are acutally manufactured by K&K.
Flakes are just a micro-segment of the small segment "pipe tobacco", producing a
large number of flakes requires a lot of machinery and storage space (just think of the time some flakes
spend in the press), so it is probably cheaper to give it to one of the few/two manufacturers who have the
sufficient capacity.
I posted this in the WAYS thread, but I'll also post this here since there is a debate about Escudo:
I wasn't going to smoke this now, but my curiosity over whether or not the current version of Dunhill Navy Roll is really Escudo got the best of me. I know the Murray's version was not the same thing. Now I'll test this for myself. Having recently smoked Escudo and the Murray's DDNR, I'll know if there's a difference. Dunhill Deluxe Navy Rolls in a very early Ascorti straight New Dear KS billiard with a smooth shank.
I wasn't going to smoke this now, but my curiosity over whether or not the current version of Dunhill Navy Roll is really Escudo got the best of me. I know the Murray's version was not the same thing. Now I'll test this for myself. Having recently smoked Escudo and the Murray's DDNR, I'll know if there's a difference. Dunhill Deluxe Navy Rolls in a very early Ascorti straight New Dear KS billiard with a smooth shank.
Jim, don't let this sway you, but as a newbie I asked this same question some time back: http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/escudo-vs-dunhill-deluxe-navy-rolls
Peck: I had read that earlier - and even had a comment on that thread - but I'm going to check out my taste buds just the same on the batch I just got from the P&C sale. I'm going to smoke a couple of bowls of the new NR, then Escudo, which I've smoked the last couple of days. The difference in the old days was very obvious to me. Now, I need to know what's what while the NR are still on sale.
I just exchanged emails with Steve Monjure, the US distributor of Reiner and Solani tobaccos. He tells me K&K still make Reiner Long Golden Flake. He says there has been no change.
All this being said, as I'm already late to the party I decided to stock up since I've finally found some tobaccos that I like. I ordered 10 tins plus a 24oz box of LBF before there's a run on that too.
Yeah, seems like a lot of folks are ordering Escudo. I ordered 23 tins as well. That will give me 180 so I'm not too worried about this development if it proves true (and my hunch is it likely will).
Well it only gives me 15,.like I said I'm always late to the party. I'll try to order some more in another couple of weeks to see what happens. Thank goodness I like the LBF almost as much as Escudo.
Here's my take on Escudo versus Dunhill Deluxe Navy Rolls:
The difference between the two is not much. It used to be, but not now. They look exactly the same. Today's Navy Rolls have a little more lighter Virginia in the rolls than they used to. Today's NR is a little less sweeter, slightly more muddy in taste, and a little less full. And just a little less perique now. Those the distinguishing factors between new NR and the Murray's version. Today's Escudo is a little different than it was 12 years ago, and is closer to NR than before. I notice the same slightly drier, less sweet taste in both versions, but the new Escudo is a little more muddy, more like the NR. The old Escudo had more of a grassy, hay-like taste than the old NR. The new Escudo has less of that flavor; only a touch of it is there now. So, they are not exactly the same tobacco because the NR doesn't have that very light grass and hay note that today's Escudo does, which gives it slightly less of a full taste. I'd say the difference is very small, not quite the same, but you'd hate to hang on the difference. There's something minor in the NR that isn't in Escudo that I can't put my finger on. Upshot: Escudo and Dunhill Navy Rolls are about 95% the same.
In other words, though I need more evidence before I believe Escudo will no longer be produced, if it isn't, buy the Navy Rolls.
The difference between the two is not much. It used to be, but not now. They look exactly the same. Today's Navy Rolls have a little more lighter Virginia in the rolls than they used to. Today's NR is a little less sweeter, slightly more muddy in taste, and a little less full. And just a little less perique now. Those the distinguishing factors between new NR and the Murray's version. Today's Escudo is a little different than it was 12 years ago, and is closer to NR than before. I notice the same slightly drier, less sweet taste in both versions, but the new Escudo is a little more muddy, more like the NR. The old Escudo had more of a grassy, hay-like taste than the old NR. The new Escudo has less of that flavor; only a touch of it is there now. So, they are not exactly the same tobacco because the NR doesn't have that very light grass and hay note that today's Escudo does, which gives it slightly less of a full taste. I'd say the difference is very small, not quite the same, but you'd hate to hang on the difference. There's something minor in the NR that isn't in Escudo that I can't put my finger on. Upshot: Escudo and Dunhill Navy Rolls are about 95% the same.
In other words, though I need more evidence before I believe Escudo will no longer be produced, if it isn't, buy the Navy Rolls.
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