Cosmic Crop 2018

[rajangan]

Cosmic, there's a subtle vibe I already get from you that you're a relaxed individual with nothing to prove. I don't think you need to worry about coming across as a know it all. I've read a few discussions about red Virginia, and I am under the impression, but not convinced, at all, that it's created by a certain amount of luck in the curing shed, a nexus of leaf maturity and slightly elevated humidity and temperature. It might also have something to do with fermentation. But. There are tobacco which lend themselves more readily to turning red. For example African Red

http://nwtseeds.com/African%20Red.htm or Cherry Red http://nwtseeds.com/Cherry%20Red.htm or probably varieties with darker green leaves to begin with, no hope in hell for Russian and Ukrainian varieties or anything named yellow or lemon.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Crap, the Ukrainian was the fastest to germinate. But, I at least still have plenty of VA Gold. I may have to order some of those you mention for next year. None of the cigar varieties are germinating yet. Still waiting...

 

[rajangan]

I've got a Canadian bright variety called Delhi-34 that grows substantially faster than anything else. I can send you seed if you like. Pm me your address if so.

 

[PaulTheScandinavian]

Here my question, speaking generally is it easier to grow and get a smokable final product out of Brown /Rustica Burleys in comparison to Virginia type.?

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Paulie, it’s all in what you want. While air and sun curing are way easier, rustica by itself is NOT very enjoyable to me. However, you can air cure brightleafs like a Canadian Virginia and get something you might enjoy better. The combinations of varieties, cures, processes makes for exponential amounts of different blends. However, you may have to wait a few years for the air cured Virginias or even some burleys to lose their ammonia and become more enjoyable. I enjoying cooking, so using a kiln to speed up the process appeals to me. Because it is so much like cooking. And, once you have the kiln, besides being slower, it’s not really that much different from making a great dish.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

BTW, PM sent

 

[deathmetal]

The other is the "I'm a pipe maker so I know everything, and only smoke natural tobacco, and can you grow red Virginia (aka, I have no interest in doing it myself) and tobacco with sugar precipitate crystals-although there's literally only one brand that does it-is a sign of extreme quality, and check out how big my beard is, bruh... Oh, and I only drink IPA."

Do you mean... HIPSTERS?!

 

[rajangan]

Do you mean... HIPSTERS?!

Umm.... Maybe?

 

[coyja]

Get s sprayer and mix equal parts neem oil and Dr. Bronner's Peppermint liquid soap. Mix with water.

Spray as often as you like (it will wash off with rain and watering), and it will do a very good job as an organic, food safe pesticide.
For fertilizer, get some soluble kelp. That stuff is magical. Mix with water and water at soil level or spray on leaves, plants love it.

 

[rajangan]

Oh, and you bring up kilns. I previously did it with leaves stacked and open with a separate humidifier and heater and ran it at 75% and 120ish F. But i experimented with my last run, instead not using a humidifier, but sealing the tobacco in bags within bags within bags, and adding water directly to the tobacco and making it around 25% water by weight, and 132 F instead. Trying to make it more like a pilone. The results were, I can't necessarily say better, but more dramatic. What sort of kiln setup do you have?

 

[cosmicfolklore]

I had been using mu shed, with crock pots of water and a radiator, but the last few years The radiator bately came on, because it got up to 120F naturally inside there. I also hang them both by hands and whole stalk. However, Mrs Cosmic inherited a whole bunch of antiques and took over my shed, despite my asvising her that it got too hot. I had no automation, and just monitored it day in and day out manually. This year, I am designing and building a better one with an electric pellet smoker.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

BYW, coyja, if you get ants in the garden, take an old 2 liter bottle and put a tablespoon of Dr Bronners peppermint soap inside. They will nearly fill up the bottle, and the rest of the ants will die from taking it to the queen. They can’t resist it.

 

[coyja]

Good tip, thanks!

 

[rajangan]

I wonder if leaving it to natural fluctuations of temperature like yours gives it a broader spectrum of fermenting organisms, or if you don't believe in microorganisms, just more fermentation products.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Rajangan, in just knowing to ask that question, shows how much more you know than me. I don’t have a response to that, that wouldn’t just be me making stuff up, ha ha. ::

 

[woodsroad]

It’s all really fascinating to me, thank you both for sharing your insights and process details!

 

[jvnshr]

Amazing thread. Thanks for it Michael.

 

[PaulTheScandinavian]

Cosmic, Thank you for the clarification, as for the PM,did you happen to address it to the undersigned?If so,I ain't gotten it

Best Greets, Paul

 

[PaulTheScandinavian]

One more dummy question about curing,what properties sun-curing brings to leaves?,quite often I have come across the term sun cured Leaf of India or Malawi for that matter,I'm assuming it's pretty much the same process as air curing?

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Sorry Paulie, the PM was to Rajangan.

Air curing is done slowly in the shade, but no added heat. Sun-curing is obviously done more quickly using the sun to dry it out. Flue curing is a controlled cook of the leaf.
Air curing will give burleys a deeper robust flavor, while sun-curing can be harsher. Bright leafs can be cured by these methods, but never reach a truly sweetened state, and are more earthy in flavor, but no hay-like or citrus notes.

Bright leafs have a lot of carbohydrates in the leaf, think "tomato". Tomatoes are tasy off the vine, but if you stew them, they turn the carbs to sugars and get sweeter, and as you keep cooking them, they get even sweeter.
Anyone with more knowledge, feel free to correct me...

The leaf is still alive when it is picked. And, even dried it is still a living thing full of ammonia that makes it harsh to smoke. Any tobacco is going to need to be sweated or socialized, curing it to gas off the ammonias and other living chemicals that cause harshness. Aging in a barn was how my family used to do it. Sometimes, even burying the crop to keep it warm during the cold North carolina winters. Some people will cavendish the leaf. Stacking and allowing the natural heat of the leaf to cure it is typical also. But bright leafs were developed to give a sweeter smoke using controlled heating, and color curing for a quicker turn around. Mark Ryan told me that typically three years was the amount of time farmers would wait for a natural sweating of the leaf. Pressing into plugs, twists, toasting, Blackeny's processes, cavendish, or just casing them, blending them, or even fire curing are commercial ways to speed up the process of making a smokable product.

All in all, there are many variations that can make a leaf more palatable. And, apparently, none are really wrong, unless a barn load gaums up or molds. But, this is also how a seed stock called Virginia Gold can end up tasting like 5100, FVF, Brown Flake, Tilbury, LTF, Virginia #1, Kendal, or Hombergers. Such a huge variation in flavors from one plant seed. All top grade leaf, just processed differently.
Rustica... I grew rustica my first year. It is a neat prehistoric plant, but I ended up using just a smidgen of it in blends, because it is SOOOOO powerful. As an air-cure without aging or color curing, it made me sick, and I don't get sick easily from smoking. I suspect Cotton Boll Twist is aged very well before selling and it is still the strongest thing I can smoke. So, if you just want to "ride the dragon" that one would do, ha ha.