C&D From Beyond

[isaac]

The blend is not made with super old tobacco. And there is no way to "speed age" components or blends. Most of the components in From Beyond are used in lots of other products we make. The experiment was to use the components at hand to try and come close to the flavor of the 80's era tin of Nightcap, and that was mostly achieved by proportions. And by the use of Pure St. James Parish Perique. Even when taking the pressure off a barrel of Perique, before the Perique process is completed, you will often see tobacco around the edges of the pressing block that have been exposed to air for several days, and dried out. These dry edges appear white. The reason for this is, as I said, that the buildup of carbohydrates is a side effect of the pressure fermentation. While Acadian Perique also exhibits this whitish color when dry, it is not as pronounced as the St. James leaf, which is overall, thinner, and sweeter than the imported leaf used to produce the Acadian blended Perique.

thank you so very much for setting time out of your day to respond in detail. I’m sure I can say for most of us, it speaks volumes. It is also a reason I confidently buy your products.

 

[jeremyreeves]

thank you so very much for setting time out of your day to respond in detail. I’m sure I can say for most of us, it speaks volumes. It is also a reason I confidently buy your products.

My pleasure. Thank you so much!

Awesome!! I've been to La Poche. Of course I wasn't paying attention for this. I definitely remember the black goop. Maybe Mark will have us down again, and I'll check this out.

I will be looking forward to popping a tin of this as the weather cools down. Thank you, Jeremy, for your replies and discussing this art.

Happy to be of service, Cosmic. I hope you enjoy it as much as I have been.

 

[CareerVictim]

What business have you worked for where you have disclosed their information of such nature to the public? What is your real name? ?

I understand the point you are making but at the risk of oversimplification, the legos only go together so many ways. Very rarely is a brand new, never-before-seen process implemented. For example, narrowing down to calcium propionate as a likely candidate for the anti-fungal agent employed by C&D... this is well known to be used in all of the industries he mentioned earlier.

If Jeremy does not feel comfortable with addressing my points publicly, he can say so himself.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

There is also another phenomena occurring alongside any issues C&D has had, and that is the magnifying glass effect of the optics when posts are made about mold. Before the forums allowed pictures and open posts, mold went as a problem between the buyer and retailer, then maybe the tobacco companies. But, when we have…. lets say, five posts about mold, the optics of this makes the issue look way larger than the actual scale.

Jeremy is an artist for this company. Sure science is involved as with any art. But, your asking the designer questions that might be better addressed with the numbers people at Laudsi. Shoot Ted an email if this is really something bothering you.

I am not a mod or official, but just another member making a suggestion.

 

[jeremyreeves]

I'm curious about a few things based on your post:

1) What, if any, changes were actually implemented following the researching, working with labs, chemists, etc? You mention that you were trying to understand what happened, but you did not share the outcomes.

2) What is your process for confirming mold? Are there audits of this process to insure accuracy?

3) Ted Swearingen in an email discussion with me in May 2019 stated that C&D had no real defect tracking processes prior to the 2016 mold explosion, limited defect tracking (basically customer reporting) in late 2016 which produced data suggesting your defect rate was 1:50,000, and by 2019 still only very basic defect tracking which involves logging defective tins- based on year of production- for an ever-evolving, but more clear history of defects. At the time of this email conversation, the defect rate was 1:1200, per Ted. While the historical tracking is certainly valuable, what in-process defect detection have you implemented and how are you arriving at your claim of a current .000239% defect rate?

All cards on the table, I do process engineering for a living and I have a background in QA/QC.

I look forward to your response. Thanks.

We are a business and we are not all required to provide any of this information. We are, in general, far more transparent than any of our fellow manufacturers, but there are limits to what we can or will share and particularly on a hobbyist public forum. We spend a lot of energy producing a quality product and we have spent a lot of time and money specifically addressing the issue of mold, not only for the quality of our product but for our customers and for the continuation of the hobby.

Now, here are my responses:

1) Several. You don't hire consultants and employ laboratories and chemists in order to then not take their advice. We added air filtration equipment, reconfigured drying space and pre-and post blend protocol, and re-addressed our anti-fungal approach and application. We also monitor air quality regularly with a particulate counter.

2) Mold is not invisible, and is easy to detect visually. Mold spores on the other hand, are not only invisible but they are everywhere. When a customer complains of mold, they are complaining of mold fruiting bodies, that is a mold spore has found a host material from which to consume water and is growing. In all instances of mold reports, we request pictures and we often send a return label so that we can physically assess. Mold is, in general not subtle. That said, we have utilized the mycology laboratory at Clemson, which also has a fantastic Tobacco Agriculture program, and they have helped us to identify the types of mold we commonly see, and helped in diagnosing and addressing possible causes.

3) I don't know of your conversation with Ted and I am disinclined to comment on your private correspondence with a colleague of mine from 2 years ago. The data tracking system that we have is more robust than it was then, and we have been able to build out more retroactively through various data inputs. The number I gave is literally the number of reports of ANY quality issue whether mold, cut, moisture or otherwise, divided by the total number of units produced since 2016.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

^^This is why I am a C&D fanboy right here. I want tobacco, not a bunch of flavorings and chemicals in my smokes. Thanks Jeremy!!

Damn, new members coming out of the woodwork to grill the artist that is being forthright to his fans. I’m more than a little suspicious. Agenda much?
Chip on shoulder much?

 

[cosmicfolklore]

We have a rule that Kevin makes clear in the rules…. Before you post about a grievance with a company, contact them first to give them an opportunity to make good on it before it becomes dogpile.

Read the rules!

It’s just a shame if these newbies can come in here and get a thread shut down by breaking these rules.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

When a tobacconist comes on here, to respond to questions, he does so with great risk. And, he deserves the same respect any other member is entitled to. We are fortunate to have a venue like this where we can talk with them. And, I would stand up for any other member being mistreated as well. If you have been around, you’d have seen as much.
If you have some research to do, give them a call. He’s answered the questions. If that’s not enough…. Jeremy and Laudsi might not agree with me…. but if you don’t want their products, don’t buy them.
There are a few companies I don’t like, and I just don’t buy their stuff, but if Sutliff or Peterson came on here, I wouldn’t be disrespectful. Some people just aren’t right.

 

[didimauw]

Thanks to @jeremyreeves for the responses. However some aren't playing nice, so shutting this one down.

 

[ssjones]

I have to be honest, @CareerVictim seems like more of the saint for asking these questions! I, for one, certainly don't think it's unreasonable to question a company who provides a consumable product detailed questions about how they are remedying a problem that not only affected customers financially, but because it is consumable effects our bodies. I don't think you'd have a problem with someone questioning a food company who had a public mold problem would you?

They certainly aren't rude questions to ask. I like where @CareerVictim is going with this.

What public company participates in an open member forum for discussion on their practices? I certainly don't get on a public forum to discuss my companies internal practices.