When to Not Restore? "Selected by Sasieni" Double One Dot

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J2design

Lurker
May 22, 2022
15
34
Arlington, Virginia - USA
I'm curious where other restorers draw the line when it comes to a pipe's age and value. I have just received a badly caked and bit through "Selected by Sasieni" double single dot with patent. I understand this pipe may be quite old and valuable and I am scratching my head as to whether or not to clean up the bowl and reshape the stem button.

I've had pre-1910 pipes come through that I left in original condition because they are verging on historical artifacts at this point. When do you all leave a pipe as is?
 

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greeneyes

Lifer
Jun 5, 2018
2,273
12,633
I think this depends on whether you're selling it or keeping it. If you're keeping it I'd say do whatever you're comfortable with (I'd send it to a master like George Dibos, personally, given the historical value).

If you're selling it, I'd say sell it as is, and let the eventual buyer decide, rather than try to "spruce up" the pipe to your taste to enhance the hammer price.
 

grimpeur

Starting to Get Obsessed
Oct 30, 2015
117
425
Toronto, ON, Canada
I like @greeneyes 's answer. I'm looking forward to seeing replies from the few who are familiar with the market for pipes such as this.

That latter statement is somewhat the point though: the pipe is valuable only to a very few pipe smokers, and to no-one else. An unsmoked one-dot Sasieni from the first year or two of manufacturer, with the original box, recently sold on eBay for a bit more than a thousand dollars. So what's this worth, either as-is or repaired?

A basic cleaning and reaming would seem a good idea no matter what, if only to ensure the chamber walls are undamaged.
 

kcghost

Lifer
May 6, 2011
15,138
25,713
77
Olathe, Kansas
To me depends in whether or not you have to replace something. If you had to top a bowl on a valuable pipe I'd have to talk it over with the owner. If I had to do a major stem repair same deal. If I had to replace a stem, I'd be very sure the owner gets back the original.
 
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J2design

Lurker
May 22, 2022
15
34
Arlington, Virginia - USA
To me depends in whether or not you have to replace something. If you had to top a bowl on a valuable pipe I'd have to talk it over with the owner. If I had to do a major stem repair same deal. If I had to replace a stem, I'd be very sure the owner gets back the original.
Thanks for your thoughts. I am the current owner and would be restoring for the purpose of selling the pipe.
 

greeneyes

Lifer
Jun 5, 2018
2,273
12,633
Thanks for your thoughts. I am the current owner and would be restoring for the purpose of selling the pipe.
I think the point I wanted to make is that if you restored it incorrectly, or even in a way that a potential buyer is unhappy with, it may lose value--not gain it. If you're selling it, I'd leave it alone. I know I would bid on it on eBay as-is, knowing I could have it restored to my preferences. I would be less inclined to do so if I had to pay further to undo or alter any of your restoration attempts.
 

J2design

Lurker
May 22, 2022
15
34
Arlington, Virginia - USA
I think the point I wanted to make is that if you restored it incorrectly, or even in a way that a potential buyer is unhappy with, it may lose value--not gain it. If you're selling it, I'd leave it alone. I know I would bid on it on eBay as-is, knowing I could have it restored to my preferences. I would be less inclined to do so if I had to pay further to undo or alter any of your restoration attempts.
Yeah I think that's where I'm landing on this one. Rare is the pipe that I don't take a shot at restoring, but this one and a 1909 GBD with straight grain are the only two that have given me pause.
 

georged

Lifer
Mar 7, 2013
6,087
16,683
I would be less inclined to do so if I had to pay further to undo or alter any of your restoration attempts.
Provided it's even possible. Most of the time restoration work gone wrong CAN'T be un-done.

An untouched, found as-is specimen can almost always be set right. Up to and including having been chewed on by mice:


A pipe that has been buffed to hell---with nothing but good intentions---is just another basket pipe, regardless of the brand or rarity.
 

Hupp

Lurker
Jan 21, 2024
8
21
Florida
It’s not that rare, it’s actually kind of common, there’s another pipe exactly like it on ebay right now.
Just kidding, it’s a good decision to leave as is.
 

sablebrush52

The Bard Of Barlings
Jun 15, 2013
20,978
50,227
Southern Oregon
jrs457.wixsite.com
A lot of people sue the term "restoration" as a synonym for cosmetic cleaning. That's not restoration. Returning the object to a condition similar to original, as in fix structural damage, is restoration. I've cleaned up a lot of pipes:

qu0JQs1.jpg

W9I9CK1.jpg


and this is not a restoration, just a cleaning.

George has done work on a number of my pipes and we agree that the process should be as minimally invasive as possible while addressing any functional concerns. For example, one of my pipes had some significant tapping wear to the rim. Rather than remove all of it, George removed just enough to restore the rim while leaving some tapping marks and wear, though reduced. The result is invisible and doesn't erase the pipe's history.

Condition matters to collectors and faking condition is just wrong. But the life story of a pipe is mostly a mystery and we often don't know what has been done to it before we obtained it.

George's stem work is as good as it gets, and he can reproduce a period correct shape for a specific make of pipe. The difference, to the extent that there is one, is that George's work will be superior to the original, even if it looks identical. In a logical world this would increase the value, but to collectors, condition and original equipment matter more. So, a replacement stem would be a minus.

But reality with regard to stems is much more complicated. Companies like Barling, Dunhill, Comoy, etc, also offered pipe repair and maintenance, including making replacement stems, which leaves the question of the stem of a vintage pipe being "original" somewhat dubious in many cases. But let's not confuse supposition with reality. It makes people's heads hurt.

I want to be able to smoke my pipes and if there's some sort of structural damage, to have the pipe's structure restored to as close to original as possible so that they can be enjoyed. I detest a botoxed pipe, and can spot one in a second. If the pipe has some dings or wear, I really don't care. That's part of its history. They're beauty marks.
 
Apr 2, 2018
3,385
40,876
Idong,South Korea.
I'm curious where other restorers draw the line when it comes to a pipe's age and value. I have just received a badly caked and bit through "Selected by Sasieni" double single dot with patent. I understand this pipe may be quite old and valuable and I am scratching my head as to whether or not to clean up the bowl and reshape the stem button.

I've had pre-1910 pipes come through that I left in original condition because they are verging on historical artifacts at this point. When do you all leave a pipe as is?
Wortth a try.I had a large Charatan Executive from a pipe show some years ago that looked like a previous owner used a blow torch on to light it up.It was alot worse than yours.
 
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AroEnglish

Rehabilitant
Jan 7, 2020
5,177
15,233
#62
I'd love to see George or Rustie restore that as it would be pretty much brand new after they were done with it.
 

runscott

Lifer
Jun 3, 2020
1,292
2,838
Washington State
We see a lot of hack restoration jobs on ebay, so I get why you are getting the advice you are seeing here, but when I re-sell I'm trying to maximize profit, so I'd restore it.

As someone who enjoys 'intense' restoration projects, it makes me want to cry when I see a rare pipe that's been restored poorly. I contacted one ebay seller long ago and told him that if he came across pre-wwii Petersons, I'd probably pay him just as much if he didn't restore it, saving him a lot of work and sandpaper. I tried not to be insulting, but I never heard back from him and he continued to sand all sharp edges off of his pipes and sell them for about what I would have paid him if he had let them be :(
 

sablebrush52

The Bard Of Barlings
Jun 15, 2013
20,978
50,227
Southern Oregon
jrs457.wixsite.com
We see a lot of hack restoration jobs on ebay, so I get why you are getting the advice you are seeing here, but when I re-sell I'm trying to maximize profit, so I'd restore it.

As someone who enjoys 'intense' restoration projects, it makes me want to cry when I see a rare pipe that's been restored poorly. I contacted one ebay seller long ago and told him that if he came across pre-wwii Petersons, I'd probably pay him just as much if he didn't restore it, saving him a lot of work and sandpaper. I tried not to be insulting, but I never heard back from him and he continued to sand all sharp edges off of his pipes and sell them for about what I would have paid him if he had let them be :(
Some people cannot be taught.