STG Enough Already, Chicken Little, Or What?

[Pipe & a walk]

I apologize to @Pipe & a walk and any other members that I offended with my post.

I appreciate that sir, thank you.

I think I'm a bit overly sensitive about this subject after having the same discussion at my local cigar/pipe shop with a pair of Captain Black only smoker's who were less than sympathetic.

 

[Pipe & a walk]

Nope - you said his invoking said logic was “beyond pathetic”, not the logic itself. Later the forum members apathy “sickening” and this and that amping up the rhetoric. Maybe dial it down just a tad - “yelling” and insulting folks is pretty much “your mother wears army boots”.

Try to keep things in perspective

 

[HawkeyeLinus]

I think I'm a bit overly sensitive about this subject after having the same discussion at my local cigar/pipe shop with a pair of Captain Black only smoker's who were less than sympathetic.

Sounds terrifying.

 

[Pipe & a walk]

You know, I like @Pipe & a walk , he’s got thoughts and he gets them out there.

Don’t get chummy now.

 

[Pipe & a walk]

Sounds terrifying.

You mean smoking Captain Black exclusively? I agree.

 

[NookersTheCat]

Yeah at a lot of places that's all the "pipe tobacco" they have that isn't Borkum Riff or Captain Black. I know it used to be common for tobacco to be designed for both pipes and RYO but this stuff is pretty clearly just cigarette tobacco. One time I was at a place that had several Stokkebye pouches and I got excited but I looked closer and it was clearly RYO so I passed on it. One time my brother bought a big ass bag of either Largo or Gambler, can't recall, and I had to explain to him just because it says it's pipe tobacco doesn't mean it is. He got some Captain Black and found it boring and difficult to smoke so now he's written off pipe smoking and just sticks with cigars. I gave him a jar of English but I don't think he's ever tried it.

Yeah I enjoy the occasional death-stick here and there (less than a pack per year now, just the rare treat) and I've bought a few packs of the Stokkebye RYO tobacco.. ones like the Turkish I think are essentially the same as their old no84 Turkish export pipe but just more of a cig cut.
In general it's nice to have "dual use" tobacco coming back...

@BriarLee has been extolling the virtues of Buoy lately and there are many who enjoy Daughters & Ryan both in a pipe and cig... ofc not all are created at the same level of quality but in general it's almost like history is beginning to repeat itself in a way...

 

[WirelessSmoke]

I am one of the people who are a bit worked up over this STG fiasco, but I am mindful of the people who are losing their livelihood with the shuttering of Sutliff.

Yeah I get that, having been through some companies' "business decisions" I understand it's unfortunate. I don't think anyone here was trying to minimize the loss of jobs and livelihood.

For consumers losing our favorite blends(Seattle Pipe Club, Per Jenson's Pipe Force) we don't need our concerns put into perspective with world hunger, thank you

Maybe I don't qualify as part of the consumers you speak of, but more than half of my tobacco is from Watch City Cigar, which includes several of my favorites. As a result of all this STG business, it will just about all be unavailable. Some might get re-blended but almost everything I buy won't be. Is it a bummer? Yup, but for the price of a cup of coffee....

 

[Pipke]

You may not have cared for the tactic he used, but it did drive home his point regardless....

But he didn't make a point. He engaged in a logical fallacy, which was to say that because there are worse problems in the world then lesser problems are unimportant. We should always be free to to fix or talk about any problem that arises, big or small. THAT was @Pipe & a walk 's point. The OP's point? Stop discussion of a tobacco supply problem on a pipe smoking forum?

Edited to add: But IMHO you loose the debate when using language like "pathetic" or "disgusting" to shout down your opponent.

 

[HawkeyeLinus]

But he didn't make a point. He engaged in a logical fallacy, which was to say that because there are worse problems in the world then lesser problems are unimportant. We should always be free to to fix or talk about any problem that arises, big or small. THAT was @Pipe & a walk 's point. The OP's point? Stop discussion of a tobacco supply problem on a pipe smoking forum?

Edited to add: But IMHO you loose the debate when using language like "pathetic" or "disgusting" to shout down your opponent.

Wrong - the first part.

The so-called logical fallacy would suggest that because there is some worse problem it renders another problem irrelevant, cancels it out, suggests no further action or discussion is called for, something is right and something else is wrong by invoking some greater issue. Not what happened. It was not said that worries about a blend disappearing were unimportant, not at all. That concern was validated, empathy expressed for those affected. Pointing out there may be bigger issues out there is simply an opinion of perspective -- also 100% valid to possess and express. A suggestion to consider the significance of an issue in any context isn't what is meant by the "fallacy". And the OP didn't attempt to "stop" discussion, lol, he literally started it, with . . . an opinion. And plenty of context supplied as the thread as progressed. Classy move to issue an apology on one person's part (especially where one wasn't needed, called for or required, and nothing offensive at all about expressing an opinion and inviting comment). Hmmmm, seems like how a forum ought to work, not little guns blazing, worrying about who has the biggest fallacy, amping up rhetoric, taking after people you don't even take a minute to know, as you've rightly acknowledged.

It's pretty basic that you can't make interpersonal comparisons of utility - I may value a tin of Nanny's Shoe Aroma more highly than you may value your car. Doesn't mean someone's "wrong" and doesn't meant it shouldn't be able to be discussed without resort to personalizing the issue in a negative way.

 

[sablebrush52]

Cathartic as grieving may be there comes a point where it starts to resemble mental masturbation. Everyone is focused on the problem and no one is focused on solutions. Since this is a dead end approach it eventually becomes repetitive and not a little self defeating.

It's probably something in my make up that thinks all of this has become somehow weaker and self indulgent and I would have to own that events in my own life have pushed me in the direction of "a minute on the problem and two minutes on the solution".

Sure, I'm saddened for the loss, I was a big Sutliff booster here, I'm sorry for the loss of jobs, but as I'm someone who's been there, literally hundreds of time in a career that is project based, get on with finding other employment. Stability is a nice illusion, one I have never had the luxury in which to share.

If continued woe, rage and victimhood is cathartic, great. For me, it wears thin after a little while.

The OP had a legitimate point.

People will do what they do and the world will continue to spin, regardless, at least for the time being.

 

[bpinkstaff]

I think we need a Karen thread for the cry babies!

 

[bpinkstaff]

Man, when you splash cold water on it like that....lol...like I tell my kids all the time when they complain when something doesn't go their way and they stomp up the stairs shouting "WORST DAY EVER!!!!"......First world problems, kid!

Yeah, it still sucks, as does losing the nostalgia of a company that's been around for almost 2 centuries, but I feel more for all those employees that now have to find new employment and even more so for those that have/had very tobacco-related positions. But all that said, when you compare that with all the utter bullshit going on in the rest of the world, it's kinda hard to not shrug at this and think of how many people in this world that would give anything to trade lives with any of us.

Well said!

 

[Mr. Stubb]

I agree that it’s saddening to lose Sutliff, but there are many other blends available and our hobby is a small and somewhat obscure one. I plan to just be happy with what exists for my time here.

 

[JoburgB2]

Does someone need a hug?

I don’t think so, but thanks for asking. I just need a bowl of Virginia No. 1 and I should be okay.

 

[DedHed Piper]

Only thing I can think of is if there's any nice "world Hunger" forums around to enjoy for those tired of reading a lot of nagging about lost tobaccos or evil tobacco companies and such trivial crap.