Stain Coming Off On My Hands

[georged]

You guys crack me up.

The obvious solution is to have your hands surgically removed, Winnipeger. Then stain CAN'T get on them.

Like duh.

Amazingly, finally, people are starting to think straight about situations like this.

In Oregon, for example, the frustrating problem of too many kids failing in school has been solved by eliminating the tests that are responsible for causing the failures.

I never thought I'd live long enough to see Humanity save itself, but it looks like I needn't have worried.

So get rid of those hands, Winnipeger, and report back how much you appreciate your perfectly finished pipe. (Threads here stay open for several years, so you'll have plenty of time to heal up.)

 

[Sigmund]

My suggestion to contact the maker was not for a return or compensation. They made it so perhaps they might have some insight into solving the problem. Never hurts to shoot an email over.

 

[Winnipeger]

And yet you start a fire in it every time you smoke it...

Correct. I use the pipe the way it was designed; to burn tobacco inside the briar chamber. If you think it's a good idea to bake your bamboo-shanked stummels in the oven, be my guest. Maybe it's a good idea. I don't know. I lack evidence. Please report the results back to me, with pictures, and in 5 to 10 years when you've encountered no issues, I'll put it in the maybe pile.

 

[Winnipeger]

My suggestion to contact the maker was not for a return or compensation. They made it so perhaps they might have some insight into solving the problem. Never hurts to shoot an email over.

@Sigmund, I move slowly, but when I get around to emailing Musico, I'll definitely report back here with their reply.

 

[UB 40]

Title says it all. I've had this Musico for a couple of years. I love this pipe and basically ignored the issue at first, but my wife started catching me red-handed every time I smoke it. The red stain has migrated to the bamboo as well, which is the only thing that irks me a little. Not sure how to clean up the bamboo without removing the finish.
View attachment 255533
Weird it left the workshop like this. Any advice on sealing the stummel to stop the stain coming off on my hands?

Stain used for in pipe making usually is pigments solved in ethanol. The solution transfers into the pores of the wood. When the ethanol dries of there are pigments in the pores and a certain amount of powder still left on the surface.

Normally the excess pigments are wiped off by the carver, when getting ready for the next step of staining maybe contrast staining or buffing and finishing with carnauba. And sometimes not, maybe to achieve a certain deeper hue, maybe it’s a Friday pipe.

You can rub it off with a microfibre cloth, or with micromesh. Or you use again ethanol - also on the bamboo - at the Risk to take away to much of the stain on the stummel.

I once had the same feature on a pipe, I buffed it on a wheel and it got significantly brighter, but my fingers stay clean now.

Baking doesn’t help, because the stain already dried up to powder. That’s the meaning of a solution anyways. Just rub the pigments off.

 

[Dave760]

Does the stain come off if you handle it when it's cold, or only when you smoke it? If the former then a lot of wiping with soft cloths might eventually remove any excess stain. If the latter, then I'm stumped. Although wiping it while it's warm might help.

Edit: @$#%ing autocorrect

 

[georged]

Red is a problematic color, period. Whether houses or cars or T-shirts or pipes, it fades fast and likes to bleed.

How I'd deal with your pipe is:

1) hard scrub with paper towel thoroughly dampened with alcohol

2) Do a "wash" type re-stain to bring back the color

3) Thoroughly polish-scrub the stummel on a VERY slow speed stitched wheel touched with red rouge

4) Hard-polish the stummel on a full speed (1800 rpm) stiched wheel that been deliberately overloaded with micro-crystalline wax and/or carnauba. Talking high pressure, here.

5) Zap the seam-filled deliberate "over-wax" job with a heat gun until shiny, then hit with a high speed flannel wheel, one section (zone?) at a time. (The stummel will cool too fast to do all at once)

 

[Winnipeger]

Baking doesn’t help, because the stain already dried up to powder.

Thank you. I'll go with that theory. Can't see the point of baking the stummel.

 

[Winnipeger]

Red is a problematic color, period. Whether houses or cars or T-shirts or pipes, it fades fast and likes to bleed.

How I'd deal with your pipe is:

1) hard scrub with paper towel thoroughly dampened with alcohol

2) Do a "wash" type re-stain to bring back the color

3) Thoroughly polish-scrub the stummel on a VERY slow speed stitched wheel touched with red rouge

4) Hard-polish the stummel on a full speed (1800 rpm) stiched wheel that been deliberately overloaded with micro-crystalline wax and/or carnauba. Talking high pressure, here.

5) Zap the seam-filled deliberate "over-wax" job with a heat gun until shiny, then hit with a high speed flannel wheel, one section (zone?) at a time. (The stummel will cool too fast to do all at once)

I don't have a bench buffer. I might buy one one of these days. Then I would do as you recommend. What are you using to re-stain the pipe? Leather dye, or some other secret sauce?

Short a buffing wheel, I'm thinking Renaissance wax might be the way to go. What do you think?

[BTW this advice is more helpful than your previous suggestion. Thanks for chiming in. I know you're the man when it comes to this kind of sheeit.]

 

[lonestar]

Red is problematic on a Smooth finish. Some briar accepts it well, and some just doesn't. It's whatever particular ingredient they use to create the red color that causes the problem. But it's very difficult to create a brilliant red stain, and keep it from bleeding. There absolutely must be some sort finish on top of a red stain to Set it in place and keep it from bleeding like that. Whether it's Danish Oil, or Shellac, something other than dye must be used to dry the stain fully and set it in the wood. I won't let a red smooth pipe leave my shop until it's had a few days to dry, AND been tested for bleeding. I take a Kleenex, wrap it around the bowl and twist it back and forth on the pipe for a good 30 seconds. If any dye comes off on the kleenex, I'll start all over on setting the finish.

If you use alcohol on the bowl, you'll definitely take some of the lustre away from the finish. And you'd really need to reapply a finish like shellac or danish oil to seal it back up anyway, so I don't recommend that.

Best bet is to clean the Bamboo as well as you can with alcohol soaked Q tips (trying not to get alcohol on the pipe itself). And then go to home depot and buy the smallest can of Danish Oil they have. Wipe the entire outside of the pipe with a coat of Danish Oil, let it sit for maybe 4 or 5 minutes, and then wipe off all the excess with a clean paper towel. Let the pipe sit for a day or two to dry, and then add another coat the same way. Let that dry for a few days, and then give it the tissue test (rub briskly) to see if the stain is still bleeding. Don't worry about getting oil on the bamboo, it will be fine with a coat of oil on it. But try as hard as you can to keep it out of the tobacco chamber, you won't enjoy smoking it.

Shellac would probably do a better job of setting the stain, but it's going to be more difficult to do correctly. You could buy a can of Zinnslers spray shellac, put that on a pipe cleaner, wipe the pipe down very quickly and then wipe the excess shellac off as quickly as you can, before it sets up. You could do that, but if you leave any smears in the finish it would really need to be buffed out.

Danish Oil should fix the problem though, if you'll do 2 or maybe 3 coats and let them air dry a few days in between.

 

[JackOrion]

It was temporary on a couple of a Petes for me a year or two ago and eventually settled on its own. Same on one Nording. I used some warm, damp paper towels and that seemed to help. As always YMMV.

Same. My Pete was a deluxe classic with a terracotta stain. It doesn’t really do it anymore. New it was more of a matte finish than gloss. I’ve done the nose oil thing on it a few times and it’s shined up a bit.
The good thing is it never really effected the overall stain. Didn’t lighten up or get splotchy.

 

[Winnipeger]

Red is problematic on a Smooth finish. Some briar accepts it well, and some just doesn't. It's whatever particular ingredient they use to create the red color that causes the problem. But it's very difficult to create a brilliant red stain, and keep it from bleeding. There absolutely must be some sort finish on top of a red stain to Set it in place and keep it from bleeding like that. Whether it's Danish Oil, or Shellac, something other than dye must be used to dry the stain fully and set it in the wood. I won't let a red smooth pipe leave my shop until it's had a few days to dry, AND been tested for bleeding. I take a Kleenex, wrap it around the bowl and twist it back and forth on the pipe for a good 30 seconds. If any dye comes off on the kleenex, I'll start all over on setting the finish.

If you use alcohol on the bowl, you'll definitely take some of the lustre away from the finish. And you'd really need to reapply a finish like shellac or danish oil to seal it back up anyway, so I don't recommend that.

Best bet is to clean the Bamboo as well as you can with alcohol soaked Q tips (trying not to get alcohol on the pipe itself). And then go to home depot and buy the smallest can of Danish Oil they have. Wipe the entire outside of the pipe with a coat of Danish Oil, let it sit for maybe 4 or 5 minutes, and then wipe off all the excess with a clean paper towel. Let the pipe sit for a day or two to dry, and then add another coat the same way. Let that dry for a few days, and then give it the tissue test (rub briskly) to see if the stain is still bleeding. Don't worry about getting oil on the bamboo, it will be fine with a coat of oil on it. But try as hard as you can to keep it out of the tobacco chamber, you won't enjoy smoking it.

Shellac would probably do a better job of setting the stain, but it's going to be more difficult to do correctly. You could buy a can of Zinnslers spray shellac, put that on a pipe cleaner, wipe the pipe down very quickly and then wipe the excess shellac off as quickly as you can, before it sets up. You could do that, but if you leave any smears in the finish it would really need to be buffed out.

Danish Oil should fix the problem though, if you'll do 2 or maybe 3 coats and let them air dry a few days in between.

Hey! Advice I can use. Thanks so much Mr. Alden. Danish oil it is then. Just out of curiosity, is Tung oil ever used for finishing pipes? I've used that on cabinets and have some on hand. I understand the Tung oil finish is more matte and the Danish oil is a bit more lustrous. I'm not opposed to buying a tin of Danish oil. Just asking out of curiosity.

 

[lonestar]

Tung Oil on its own doesn't really dry. When you use it on an open grained wood, it's going to soak right into the pores and so that's not a big deal. It's dry to the touch because it's mostly inside the wood itself.
Briar has such a hard grain that very little oil is going into the wood, most of it is staying right on the surface. That's where the never drying part is a problem.

Danish oil is typically Tung oil mixed with some other ingredients. Chief among them is going to be a drying agent to actually harden and set the Tung oil. It's a slower hardening process than something like Shellac, so that's why you'll want to let each coat dry for a day or two in between. And actually, it probably doesn't fully set for weeks, but a day or two between coats should be enough for what you're trying to do, which is using it to set the red dye in place.

I have a feeling the Danish Oil is all you're going to need, but if 3 coats (with drying time between them) doesn't fully set the color in place, I wouldn't recommend more coats than that. At that point I'd switch to a very very thin coat of shellac. But definitely try the Oil first.

 

[Winnipeger]

Tung Oil on its own doesn't really dry. When you use it on an open grained wood, it's going to soak right into the pores and so that's not a big deal. It's dry to the touch because it's mostly inside the wood itself.
Briar has such a hard grain that very little oil is going into the wood, most of it is staying right on the surface. That's where the never drying part is a problem.

Danish oil is typically Tung oil mixed with some other ingredients. Chief among them is going to be a drying agent to actually harden and set the Tung oil. It's a slower hardening process than something like Shellac, so that's why you'll want to let each coat dry for a day or two in between. And actually, it probably doesn't fully set for weeks, but a day or two between coats should be enough for what you're trying to do, which is using it to set the red dye in place.

I have a feeling the Danish Oil is all you're going to need, but if 3 coats (with drying time between them) doesn't fully set the color in place, I wouldn't recommend more coats than that. At that point I'd switch to a very very thin coat of shellac. But definitely try the Oil first.

That's great information. Thanks! I'm going to follow up on that. The only part that gives me pause is cleaning up the bamboo! Oh well. I'm sure the pipe will still smoke ok if I fuck up the finish on it.

 

[lonestar]

That's great information. Thanks! I'm going to follow up on that. The only part that gives me pause is cleaning up the bamboo! Oh well. I'm sure the pipe will still smoke ok if I fuck up the finish on it.

In my experience, it's fairly easy to get stain off of bamboo. Usually it's when I'm staining a bamboo shanked pipe and get just a little on the shank, so I'm cleaning it immediately after it hits the bamboo. If it has some time to set into the pores, it may be more difficult to remove. But I think you can at least make it less noticeable by scrubbing it with a Qtip and alcohol. And don't sweat it too much if you touch the stain a little with the Qtip, just try not to hit the briar any more than you have to. And you'll likley want to switch to a clean Qtip a few times if it does pick up some red stain.

 

[Winnipeger]

In my experience, it's fairly easy to get stain off of bamboo. Usually it's when I'm staining a bamboo shanked pipe and get just a little on the shank, so I'm cleaning it immediately after it hits the bamboo. If it has some time to set into the pores, it may be more difficult to remove. But I think you can at least make it less noticeable by scrubbing it with a Qtip and alcohol. And don't sweat it too much if you touch the stain a little with the Qtip, just try not to hit the briar any more than you have to. And you'll likley want to switch to a clean Qtip a few times if it does pick up some red stain.

I think the stain mixed with my sweat and spread onto the bamboo and I didn't notice it at first. It set on there for a while—several smokes—before I tried wiping it with a wet towel, to little avail. We'll see what iso does. Thanks again for your considered replies!

What do you figure is the best way to mask the briar against alcohol?

 

[lonestar]

Honestly, just don't touch the briar any more than you have to. If you tape it off you'll create a worse problem as the alcohol seeps under the tape and soaks into the wood. A light touch with the Qtip on the wood won't be the end of the world, though it might pick up some stain and dirty up the Qtip. Just leave the bamboo closest to the wood for the last, and be as careful as possible as you clean that last little bit of bamboo.

 

[Winnipeger]

Honestly, just don't touch the briar any more than you have to. If you tape it off you'll create a worse problem as the alcohol seeps under the tape and soaks into the wood. A light touch with the Qtip on the wood won't be the end of the world, though it might pick up some stain and dirty up the Qtip. Just leave the bamboo closest to the wood for the last, and be as careful as possible as you clean that last little bit of bamboo.

That makes sense. I guess pure alcohol would have no trouble seeping under any kind of tape you could use, and osmosis would just spread the problem. Thanks again. I'm learning a lot from this thread! Time to start refurbishing pipes, then I just need to get a lathe and watch out.

 

[UB 40]

I don't have a bench buffer. I might buy one one of these days. Then I would do as you recommend. What are you using to re-stain the pipe? Leather dye, or some other secret sauce?

Short a buffing wheel, I'm thinking Renaissance wax might be the way to go. What do you think?

[BTW this advice is more helpful than your previous suggestion. Thanks for chiming in. I know you're the man when it comes to this kind of sheeit.]

You don’t need a bench buffer if you’ve got a drill, just buy a buffing wheel to put into, and fix the drill to work top.

 

[Winnipeger]

You don’t need a bench buffer if you’ve got a drill, just buy a buffing wheel to put into, and fix the drill to work top.

Actually now that you mention it, I bought a buffing wheel for my drill press a while ago. I guess I forgot about it. It's in the basement somewhere. Thanks for the reminder!