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greysmoke

Starting to Get Obsessed
1969 Bruyere group 2 prince. When I bought it -- somewhere around 25 years ago -- there was a hairline crack on the shank (disclosed by the seller). I gave it to the late Dick Silverman, who sent it off to American Smoking Pipe Co. for a sterling silver band. It's a bit tarnished, and it does cover the nomenclature. But I've grown rather attached to this. My acquisition price was $50 as I recall due to the cracked shank.

DB69.jpg
 

Lyon0oq

Part of the Furniture Now
Jul 31, 2012
561
5,179
55
New Providence, NJ
OK, I am going to need some of you Dunhill sages to help me out with this one. Is this some super rare find, or has the seller been smoking more crack than Cumberland?



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Dec 10, 2013
2,317
2,943
Nijmegen, the Netherlands
Not sure if it is super rare, it is what it is ; a 1963 tanshell poker.
It is from a good Dunhill period and tanshell pokers are not thick on the ground.
Not my taste, but that is irrelevant.
Dirty pipe, but could clean up nicely . In my honest opinion way too expenxive.
At first glance the chamber looks to fine, mortise looks dirty .
Cheers .
 
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steinr1

Lurker
Jan 22, 2023
3
14
Now then...

I don't normally go for Dunhill pipes, and I'm not sure I have with this one. I collect Ropp pipes. However, I got this pipe some years ago. I don't know quite why but it intrigued me.

The pipe is a meerschaum footed billiard (I'm sure someone more knowledgeable could name the shape), silver band dated (IIRC) 1904 London with a maker's mark of "AD". It's got an old repair in the form of a silver band holding in a slighly cracked bowl - looks like it was dropped. The stem looks like an early White Spot (inlaid spot) with a round draw hole and a small rounded button. As I say, If I didn't know better (and I don't) it looks like a quite early Dunhill stem. It has a fitted case with no markings which fits very well .

Here's the conumdrum. The White Spot and maker's mark might excite you into believing it to be a very early Dunhill. But Dunhill didn't use the White Spot until 1912 (IIRC). The maker's "AD" mark style is not a known Dunhill mark to my knowledge.

So what is it? A "No Name" bowl mated to a sham Dunhill stem in an attempt to fool the unwary (like me)? A bowl of unknown manufacture with an old genuine Dunhill repair? A genuine Alfred Dunhill pipe (too early, I think) with a later repair/restem?

What do you think or know? It's a really nice smoker in any case, so no great matter.
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guylesss

Can't Leave
May 13, 2020
322
1,155
Brooklyn, NY
Like lost Leonardo paintings or a 13th first edition copy of Poe's Tamerlane, anything is possible. Although the possibility of any of us accidentally lucking into either is exceedingly remote.

The first difficulty is that Dunhill's earliest pipes remain a particularly murky subject, and insofar as I know (although I'd be delighted to be corrected), no example of an actual pipe with Dunhill markings (ie a Duke Street SW stamping) made before 1910-1912 survives. Nor apparently do any examples survive of the infamous Dunhill patented "windshield pipe" (although evidently a small number were made for Dunhill, as early as late 1905, in four different shapes including one with a silver military mount, and stamped "Dunhill" over "patent").

In theory, at least, other pipes of decidedly middling quality were made for and sold by Dunhill earlier than 1910. And John Loring's "The Dunhill Briar Pipe"--relying largely on Mary Dunhill's firsthand account of her father's various early business ventures--does a good job of summing up this period and what is known.

As for your pipe, you're definitely not the only person to speculate about early silver fittings with an AD silversmith's mark (but not in a diamond and not assayed in London). Although again--and perhaps someone here actually knows--my best blind guess is that anything else is very unlikely to have ever been used by Alfred Dunhill.

As to this, I have vague recollection of a calabash on eBay a couple of years ago that sold for a modest price. And there is a cased one currently for sale the past year or so (with the sobering buy-it-now ask of $4800) that has a "A.D" in a hexagon and a Birmingham hallmark with letter date for 1905. See scan below. Accordingly, it would be instructive to see a close up of the hallmark on your pipe.

As for your pipe's stem. There are certainly a couple of people here who have a very expert eye for Dunhill's stemwork (at least from the period post-1920 when Dunhill actually began making their own pipes). But again, close up photos of your pipe stem's tenon and button would be a big help. Whether or not anyone has ever actually seen a pre-spot stem, I don't know.

Obviously, whatever the facts or history of your pipe might be, if you're feeling flush, the Ebay calabash would be its perfect companion. Not Dunhill.jpg
 

georged

Lifer
Mar 7, 2013
5,491
13,920
Interesting.

The stem does not look like a replacement.

Three possibilities come to mind:

1) Some owner down the line saw the "AD" stamp on the band, and added a Dunhill dot to the pipe either as a private-joke or because he thought it was truly the right thing to do (so to speak) because the factory had omitted it.

2) Everything is legit as is. The band was simply an old one that had spent years in a workstation bin, and the hallmark date was never checked. Or maybe it WAS noticed, and the shop worker didn't care. His thinking being what difference could it make if the date didn't match? A proper fit is a proper fit. (And trust me, a good fitting band SOUNDS like it should be easy to find, but isn't.) And the production clock was ticking...

3) Both the bowl band and the shank band were put on at the same time, years down the road, by a repairman. The bowl strap to stabilize/stop the bowl damage, and the shank one added pre-emptively to keep the shank from cracking the same way the bowl had.
 

steinr1

Lurker
Jan 22, 2023
3
14
Thanks for the very speedy and detailed answers. I hoped that it would generate some debate.

The shank's band looks to me like it dates from time of manufacture. On closer inspection (my eyes are dim, I cannot see, I have not brought my specs with me...) it is clearly stamped for London 1904. The "AD" is without full-stops or surround. The repair band is clearly of different manufacture and not hallmarked. The tenon looks a much later addition. That does chime in with the repaired damage. The stem's dot is extemely well fitted; to sight and touch it is part of the stem. You need a loupe to see that it is not simply a splash of paint.

When obtained the meerschaum had practically no colouration. It is only now starting to gain a bit of staining. I've had it for probably 10 or 12 years and smoke it periodically. I never really had much faith that it was a lost masterpiece, but I do quite like it. I certainly would not have paid Dunhill money for it. (To the eventual puchaser of that reasonably priced calabash - I have a multi-tiered sales scheme in which they might have an interest. Guaranteed to make you millions. Simply contact ten similarly wise acquantances...)

My theory...

Bought in 1904 or thereabouts from Algernon Devall, silversmith - patriarch of the Devall family, now funeral directors in Nuneaton (please feel free to construct some similar nonsense), dropped to the cobbled street soon after purchase to the chagrin of its splendidly mustachioed owner (my imagination runs amuck), put in a drawer where it lay neglected for decades. On his death, his son - a bounder of the first water - ransacked the property and came up with a scheme to to make a bit of lolly. Noticing the fortuitoius "AD" imprint, a quick trip to a pipe repairer's workshop and the deed was done. Silver band repair, a new tenon and bit in the posh Dunhill style. Bish-bosh - loads of dosh!

Or maybe some other tosh. Who knows?

I'll attach some close-up views.


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Lyon0oq

Part of the Furniture Now
Jul 31, 2012
561
5,179
55
New Providence, NJ
Here's my one and only Dunhill for the moment.. A birth year 1969 Shellbriar #127..

We share a birth year, and I just posted up a Bulldog on this thread that landed today (only my second Dunhill). I will have to do a little research before I know its exact model number.
 
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guylesss

Can't Leave
May 13, 2020
322
1,155
Brooklyn, NY
If we're laying down bets I'll place one on Auguste Dreyfus.
Bravo Jon!

For a moment, Google misled me into speculating that perhaps the far more famous financier, art collector and Franco-Peruvian guano king of this name might have been a hobbyist goldsmith.

But then I found a query on the website of the ASCAS with pictures of an attractive silver mounted calabash hallmarked AD ("without frame") . They concur. Moreover, it seems that between 1885 and 1910, Auguste Dreyfus (unlike Alfred Dunhill) registered quite a number of "AD" hallmarks, variously at Chester, Birmingham and London.

What is arguably even more intriguing about the ASCAS entry is that the writer there suggests that the Dreyfus company's London address was 15-16 Featherstone Street. Perhaps, Jon and others here will know more, but this was for a very long period the address of BBB (aka Adolph Frankau & Co).


EDUARDODREYFUS3.jpg

In the meantime--with regard to the bargain calabash on Ebay--a very informative Italian website with an extensive illustrated database devoted to "Tobacconists', Pipe Makers', and Pipe Mounters' Silver Hallmarks" indicates that the Birmingham mark AD "in a lozenge" belongs to another, as yet unidentified maker.
 

simong

Lifer
Oct 13, 2015
2,532
15,280
UK
Dunhill Quaint from last year. Group 3 Cutty.B0106CF2-E413-4C92-8732-EFBCF8290622.jpegF9303BD5-20C6-4CB8-8B93-0351E0C8A10B.jpegThese next two aren’t mine but still worth showing off. This quaint from the 60’s belonged to late forum member Santi, I think.
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One of the best I’ve seen.
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