Sell me a Dunhill.
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That is a pretty interesting analysis and observation George. I would tend to agree. My British classic tenons aren't typically as finely detailed as one of your stems, Chris Asteriou, Ryan Alden, etc.
I am surprised that the NYC Dunhill salesperson was so well informed. I doubt she would have answered, but I wonder many pipes are sold annually thru that store? (my bet is a handful at best)
When Churchill said "Never was so much owed by so many to so few.", he was actually talking about Dunhill factory workers.
Here's an example of the sort of thing I was referring to. In this case, an English pipe's owner didn't want a new stem that matched the old one, workmanship-wise, but wanted it made to modern, "Young Lion" standards. (Pretty funny since I'm an old guy, but I knew what he meant. :lol: )
http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/new-stem-for-a-gbd-prince
Hi George,
Thanks for the thoughtful and considered reply.
Can you clarify a couple of points?
Specifically what do you find not to be precise about the stems on (older?) Dunhills (other brands too?) so that you have to ‘throttle back’. Are you referring to the stem join, the stem itself, out of round (shank), something else or a combination?
Can you be specific about what tolerances are you referring to?
I was about to post when I saw further posts regarding ‘Lion’ tenons. Can you detail the differences?
Thanks. Awaiting your reply.
@Crusader, back to your original topic...
From 1980 to 1983 my store was the largest Dunhill pipe dealer in the world (per Dunhill). I sold some like this:
Dunhill is the quintessential English pipe, a reminder of a more elegant age where masculine refinement was the fashion and the simple statement of a fine pipe declared who you are. Each flawless Dunhill bowl is fitted with a custom made, hand-cut stem fashioned from extruded rod vulcanite for durability and perpetual excellence. It’s one thing to smoke a pipe but quite another when people see the singular, small white dot on your Dunhill stem, that quietly says that you know the best and you demand it. Perhaps nothing you will ever buy says more about who you are than a Dunhill pipe.
No lies, lots of adjectives and I never mentioned smoking quality.
Thanks for the thoughtful and considered reply.
Can you clarify a couple of points?
Specifically what do you find not to be precise about the stems on (older?) Dunhills (other brands too?) so that you have to ‘throttle back’. Are you referring to the stem join, the stem itself, out of round (shank), something else or a combination?
Can you be specific about what tolerances are you referring to?
I was about to post when I saw further posts regarding ‘Lion’ tenons. Can you detail the differences?
Thanks. Awaiting your reply.
@Crusader, back to your original topic...
From 1980 to 1983 my store was the largest Dunhill pipe dealer in the world (per Dunhill). I sold some like this:
Dunhill is the quintessential English pipe, a reminder of a more elegant age where masculine refinement was the fashion and the simple statement of a fine pipe declared who you are. Each flawless Dunhill bowl is fitted with a custom made, hand-cut stem fashioned from extruded rod vulcanite for durability and perpetual excellence. It’s one thing to smoke a pipe but quite another when people see the singular, small white dot on your Dunhill stem, that quietly says that you know the best and you demand it. Perhaps nothing you will ever buy says more about who you are than a Dunhill pipe.
No lies, lots of adjectives and I never mentioned smoking quality.
Here's my '98 Ashton Old Church with the original saddle stem by Bill Taylor and then the tapered stem by George. You can see that while this was a very good stem, George's fitment to the shank was better (same for the button and tenon). I was after the look of a tapered stem, and George's overall craftsmanship. (this pipe was NOS with the saddle stem, so it wasn't buffed, etc.)
1928 Alfred Dunhill retires
1929 The entire world plunges into a depression.
Coincidence? I think not.
1929 The entire world plunges into a depression.
Coincidence? I think not.
Neverbend,
The details you are asking about are much better illustrated with examples than words. It reminds me of the pipemakers forum when a new carver posts photos of his first attempt alongside pictures of the pipe he tried to copy. There's really nothing you can say other than, "They aren't the same. Keep looking until you spot the differences."
The easiest and best way for someone who is interested in such differences to see them is to have two pipes literally in hand, and compare them side by side. Then, when you're finished and think you've spotted them all, hand the same two pipes to someone like Adam Davidson who will show you what you missed.
Me writing about such stuff would branch endlessly, Mandelbrot Set-style, as questions and answers layered upon themselves. It would be like trying to write an interactive book.
As cool as something like that could potentially be, I honestly haven't the time.
Maybe you could start a new thread that showed full, close-up photo sets of two pipes, one of them factory Britwood and the other a prime Danish or American specimen of the same shape, and open the floor to comments about the differences that can be seen. Such a thread would also be more informative and entertaining than me writing pages of attempted description.
The details you are asking about are much better illustrated with examples than words. It reminds me of the pipemakers forum when a new carver posts photos of his first attempt alongside pictures of the pipe he tried to copy. There's really nothing you can say other than, "They aren't the same. Keep looking until you spot the differences."
The easiest and best way for someone who is interested in such differences to see them is to have two pipes literally in hand, and compare them side by side. Then, when you're finished and think you've spotted them all, hand the same two pipes to someone like Adam Davidson who will show you what you missed.
Me writing about such stuff would branch endlessly, Mandelbrot Set-style, as questions and answers layered upon themselves. It would be like trying to write an interactive book.
As cool as something like that could potentially be, I honestly haven't the time.
Maybe you could start a new thread that showed full, close-up photo sets of two pipes, one of them factory Britwood and the other a prime Danish or American specimen of the same shape, and open the floor to comments about the differences that can be seen. Such a thread would also be more informative and entertaining than me writing pages of attempted description.
When you order a limited edition Dunhill Christmas pipe, Santa Claus will personally deliver it, even if it's not Christmas.
Einstein's original relativity equation was A=mc2.
Then he bought a Dunhill. The rest is history.
Then he bought a Dunhill. The rest is history.
crusader, Seeing that this discussion has raised the issues of old Dunhills versus new Dunhills, and factory British pipes versus artisan pipes, I am curious as to whether you are considering buying a brand new Dunhill/newer estate Dunhill or an old Dunhill estate pipe.
If you are considering a brand new Dunhill/newer estate Dunhill, you might actually be happier with the lower priced, standard production offerings. My experience with their 2000-present hand turned offerings is limited to a single pipe I have personally handled, but that pipe had an off-center airway and an equally off-center white dot. I have seen off-center drilling on lots of pipes ranging from old Comoys and old Kaywoodies to recent Becker & Musico and Northern Briars pipes. On Dunhills, though, that hand turned pipe was the only time I have seen off-center drilling or an askew white dot. I wonder whether Dunhill is very good at making pipes the factory way and not particularly good at making pipes the artisan way. That would fit with how "hand made" cuts both ways in the world of British cars - the term is associated simultaneously with prestige and spotty quality.
If you are considering a brand new Dunhill/newer estate Dunhill, you might actually be happier with the lower priced, standard production offerings. My experience with their 2000-present hand turned offerings is limited to a single pipe I have personally handled, but that pipe had an off-center airway and an equally off-center white dot. I have seen off-center drilling on lots of pipes ranging from old Comoys and old Kaywoodies to recent Becker & Musico and Northern Briars pipes. On Dunhills, though, that hand turned pipe was the only time I have seen off-center drilling or an askew white dot. I wonder whether Dunhill is very good at making pipes the factory way and not particularly good at making pipes the artisan way. That would fit with how "hand made" cuts both ways in the world of British cars - the term is associated simultaneously with prestige and spotty quality.
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