The problem is the principle of thinking you need to pay $200 to have someone do five minutes functionally critical work, it's just not a reasonable expectation. Factory pipes can easily fill this role, if only consumers were informed enough to request the change it would be done in an instant.
Scott's Pipes: S. Klein Design Technical Breakdown
- Thread starter frozenchurchwarden
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Factory made pipes?
At this point I can guarantee the stem on every factory pipe you own is drilled to 3mm, because across the 60+ pipes in my collection I have never seen any variation from this standard (except some pipes that are drilled smaller than 3mm, and of course the one pipe in this review, though even here the change to 3.2mm only barely qualifies).
I could go home and check, but then it's just word against word. I'll take your word on it, but since I know how my pipes all smoke so differently from one to another, I'm pretty sure they aren't, but for sake of argument... sure....
Ultimately, what are you doing about it? Do you think Savinelli and Peterson and Dunhill are on here looking to see what you have to say? Maybe for over a hundred years, guys have been buying these pipes and not being able to smoke them because of this airway issue is the reason no one smokes pipes today?
"Hey Mr. Peterson, there's a guy on the forums that has caught on to our problems with the airway situation."
Ha ha, excuse my making light of this. But, if this was an obvious problem... wouldn't they have changed?
What if... they all make the best airway, but you prefer something less than perfect?
I enjoy my factory pipes a lot. I think they're great. YMMV
How often does "Standardization" lead to the best practice?I could go home and check, but then it's just word against word. I'll take your word on it, but since I know how my pipes all smoke so differently from one to another, I'm pretty sure they aren't, but for sake of argument... sure....
Ultimately, what are you doing about it? Do you think Savinelli and Peterson and Dunhill are on here looking to see what you have to say? Maybe for over a hundred years, guys have been buying these pipes and not being able to smoke them because of this airway issue is the reason no one smokes pipes today?
"Hey Mr. Peterson, there's a guy on the forums that has caught on to our problems with the airway situation."
Ha ha, excuse my making light of this. But, if this was an obvious problem... wouldn't they have changed?
What if... they all make the best airway, but you prefer something less than perfect?
I enjoy my factory pipes a lot. I think they're great. YMMV
The industry is standardized, that doesn't mean everyone is doing everything they can to make the best pipes, and "best for who" is a very good question.
As I've said in various threads now, the standard 3mm airway in the stem is probably a vestige of best practice from when people did commonly chew through their stems, and maybe that is still applicable to some people today, but as of yet no-one has thought to give any other option, and changing that is all a matter of letting it be known there is a market.
Changing a spec in a line production means changing the line production. It’s not something you just make a few dozen of as it’s a full retooling of an entire run of pipes.
A company is standardized to the company specs. If you don’t like that companies specs, find a new company. Asking for customization of drillings in a factory operation doesn’t make much sense. You’d have to make an entirely new series of pipes so people knew what they were buying and go all in on a line run of them.
Factory lines are all about standardization. That’s exactly how they operate and produce products on spec at friendly prices.
A company is standardized to the company specs. If you don’t like that companies specs, find a new company. Asking for customization of drillings in a factory operation doesn’t make much sense. You’d have to make an entirely new series of pipes so people knew what they were buying and go all in on a line run of them.
Factory lines are all about standardization. That’s exactly how they operate and produce products on spec at friendly prices.
Actually, you beat me. I give up. I’m not saying that you are correct, and I definitely do not agree with you at all. But, your level of audacity has reached a level that I just have to respect. But, don’t waste time campaigning among is mere mortals. We can’t do shit. Get out there and make them all change. Give them hell! But, maintain that audacity…. thats what I love about this.
"Make them all change" is your words, not mine.
I'm advocating for choice not a new uniformity, but if the population of customers decide on a new standard when given the choice then that's only a good thing.
The primary point of contention has only been fabricated by other people trying to argue just for argument's sake.
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Ok, that’s nutso.
You’re going to advocate for choice amongst us other consumers? What the hell you want me to do? Tell the people who matter if you want change. Aint a damn thing anyone in this thread can do about what pipe companies do.
Eventually, it’ll just sound more annoying.
You need a better strategy. I’ll just let you work that out as I set here with my 3.5mm drilled Stanwell.
3.5mm drilled to the button?Ok, that’s nutso.
You’re going to advocate for choice amongst us other consumers? What the hell you want me to do? Tell the people who matter if you want change. Aint a damn thing anyone in this thread can do about what pipe companies do.
Eventually, it’ll just sound more annoying.
You need a better strategy. I’ll just let you work that out as I set here with my 3.5mm drilled Stanwell.
I almost bought a Stanwell a while ago but without holding one I can't see if they do maintain surface area of the airway through the stem.
Which brings up the other half of why the situation is so frustrating, if anyone does anything differently no-one advertises it.
I can put Stanwell at the top of my shopping list now but I've never seen mention of Stanwell being drilled differently before.
Apologies for the late interjection, but I just read the original post and had to say that I loved the review! I wish you’d review pipes from every brand in your collection just so I could read them!
No, not drilled to button. That would make the button uncomfortable to clench for me. I want my button to thin as shit, with a reasonable amount of material above and below the slot.
Also, keep in mind that my stanies are rather old.
I’m not schooled enough in air flow dynamics to argue with you. But, something I do notice in all of my pipes is that the opening into the chamber is always less than the diameter of the draft in the shank of the stummel. And, the draft in the stem tapers to just before the button and then the funnel of the slot widens.
My very first pipe I made, and I am not saying that I am a great pipemaker now) but my very first pipe I drilled at whatever pimo sells as the largest bit, and it smokes like a wide open corncob. I hate it.
I have a Colding Danish pipe that has like a 2mm draft (apprx). Barely get a pipe cleaner through it, and it smokes as well as a Dunhill.
I think that there’s more to draft hole logic than just the diameter. That’s just me. And, I’m just a guy whole loves pipes. Big pipes, little pipes, wide pipes, long pipes, pipes pipes pipes.I declare that pipemakers know more than me. And, this is where I plant my flag. For better or worse.
How Are Stanwell Pipes? :: General Pipe Smoking Discussion
I have several of both Sav and Stanwell - they both are workhorses and have never had a bad smoke in either brand - just and FYI , if you are looking at the top range of your budget, spending another $20-$25 will get you into some nice Radice hand made ( I have several of these as well all...
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Here's a thread about Stanwell pipes, and while the open draw is mentioned, it's also stated as just being equal to Savinelli, and most people are more concerned about the origin of manufacture. Pipesmokers are a fickle bunch.
Stanwell has had some of the greatest pipemakers come out of their factories. Big names. They’ve went through several changes over the decades. And now they are Italian made pipes.
At one time they were nevk and neck with Dunhill on luxury, but as with any corporation, they opted for increased sales over increased luxury prices. For better or worse, they know a thing or two.
I’m just more attracted to the older Stanies for aesthetics. And, I’ve never been let down by their performance. YMMV
I’ve really enjoyed your thread!!! And, your enthusiasm is growing on me. Keep up the audacity!!
Crazy thing is I already have made reviews of every pipe I've found that's notably better than a Savinelli: Icarus Bent Egg First Impressions :: Pipe Talk - https://pipesmagazine.com/forums/threads/icarus-bent-egg-first-impressions.41884/
So that makes two.
Sadly Icarus pipes are not in production anymore.
Definitely there is more than just diameter.No, not drilled to button. That would make the button uncomfortable to clench for me. I want my button to thin as shit, with a reasonable amount of material above and below the slot.
Also, keep in mind that my stanies are rather old.
I’m not schooled enough in air flow dynamics to argue with you. But, something I do notice in all of my pipes is that the opening into the chamber is always less than the diameter of the draft in the shank of the stummel. And, the draft in the stem tapers to just before the button and then the funnel of the slot widens.
My very first pipe I made, and I am not saying that I am a great pipemaker now) but my very first pipe I drilled at whatever pimo sells as the largest bit, and it smokes like a wide open corncob. I hate it.
I have a Colding Danish pipe that has like a 2mm draft (apprx). Barely get a pipe cleaner through it, and it smokes as well as a Dunhill.
I think that there’s more to draft hole logic than just the diameter. That’s just me. And, I’m just a guy whole loves pipes. Big pipes, little pipes, wide pipes, long pipes, pipes pipes pipes.I declare that pipemakers know more than me. And, this is where I plant my flag. For better or worse.
Recently I've started flossing some pipes with a small flexible sawblade and it makes a big difference to airflow when the walls of the chamber are just textured in the right direction.
With Churchwarden stems even if I can only get a large bore halfway down the stem it does still make a difference, of course drilling to the button makes more of a difference, and I will always do 1/8" (3.2mm) at minimum to the button, but the diameter of the airway in the base half of the stem does affect the draw, finding that to be the case was quite surprising.
Just a technical clarification, the draft hole in the stem is not 3.5mm but very close to it.
At the time I wrote this review I didn't have a 3.5mm drill bit, now that I do have 3.5mm I can see it does not fit, but the 3.2mm bit is obviously loose and 3.5mm feels like it's just slightly larger than the hole, my best guess is the S. Klein Design stem starts at 3.4mm.
Drill presses and lathes can have a little vibration to them, and whether metal or wood, you get a little chatter in the bit, especially a long bit. It was probably drilled with the 3.2 or even a 3mm. But maybe a 3.5 was worn down a bit from use, especially if the maker was rehappening bits. This may drive you bonkers, but I bet if you used calipers on 100 pipes made by the same maker successively, you'll get different measurements. Maybe not a full half a mm, but within that+/-.
Given that the tenon is an insert my bet is it was molded and probably not drilled at all.
Before smoking the pipe last night I gave it a run through with the 9/64" tapered bit and barely anything came off the tenon.
On a side note I just got shipping confirmation for a Stanwell 185 from Italy (I'm a sucker for large bent egg shapes and these can be found with a very decent sandblast). In a few weeks we'll find out what Stanwell's modern standards are like.