Ruminations of Briar Quality and Improved Taste

[Briar Lee]

Any of us who buy enough pipes from eBay eventually get one that’s musty. There are various cures such as salt and alcohol and my favorite, coffee grounds, and you can smoke the stink out if you are determined.

And I think it’s safe to claim that the ordeal of breaking in a brand new pipe has been documented for as long as men have smoked briar pipes. But the brand new briar pipe,,,,does improve with smoking at least to a point. Some don’t seem to need a break in period.

This morning I’m smoking an old, but cheap Carey Freehand.



This cheap pipe made in modern times in Italy for EA Carey smokes as well as any pipe I own, and better than most I own not made of Pre 54 Algerian briar.

Now, it could be a fortuitous arrangement of the mechanics of how this pipe draws the smoke.

But I’m convinced that really good quality briar imparts an improved flavor to the smoke, the same as bad briar imparts a bad taste.


How, I’ve not yet determined.

There must be good mojos in good briar, and bad mojos in bad briar.

 

[BingBong]

I think the same, but Embers points out that the carbon layer insulates the briar from the smoke. Well, true, although the stem doesn't get that layer as such - I'm still enjoying a "sweet" briar, good carbon layer, not as sweet as new, but still prominently delightful.

 

[Briar Lee]

I think the same, but Embers points out that the carbon layer insulates the briar from the smoke. Well, true, although the stem doesn't get that layer as such - I'm still enjoying a "sweet" briar, good carbon layer, not as sweet as new, but still prominently delightful.

About 35 years ago I quit putting a cake on my briar pipes. Instead I keep an extremely thin resin of carbon, just enough to say there’s a trace of what might be a cake.

That resin layer doesn’t kill the stink from musty, bad briar.

 

[Choatecav]

I think the same, but Embers points out that the carbon layer insulates the briar from the smoke. Well, true, although the stem doesn't get that layer as such - I'm still enjoying a "sweet" briar, good carbon layer, not as sweet as new, but still prominently delightful.

I agree, but we also need to remember that the point of the burn (inside the bowl) is not the only exposure of the smoke with the briar. There is the travel from base of bowl, through the stummel and into the stem, before we taste it. Normally, we use pipe cleaners to clean out the stummel and not allowing for build up of much inside. So, we are tasting a product that has come in contact with the briar.

Is this a bit anal in it's approach??? Maybe, but still applies.

 

[Sigmund]

Im in the musical instrument business. Specifically sax mouthpieces. There are so many people who believe that old hard rubber is better than new hard rubber. Myths that Semler saxophones post war were from superior quality shell casings from WWII. The list goes on. Pretty much all of it is nonsense.

I do not believe that the quality of briar makes a big difference in the flavor after the first few bowls. I believe it makes a difference in how long a pipe lasts. It makes a difference in appearnace.

That said I cant prove it so if believing it makes you happy rock on.

I know you believe different but I also dont belive the old Algerian myth. I think companies like Marxman excelled in marketing more than pipe making. I also think the same about Dunhill. Im sure there are fine examples but its not a new thing for companies to obtain cheap materials and market the hell out of it so it seems like a premium hunk of material. All in all, I dont think it makes a huge difference in the smoking experience. That is more in the design

 

[BingBong]

Im in the musical instrument business. Specifically sax mouthpieces. There are so many people who believe that old hard rubber is better than new hard rubber. Myths that Semler saxophones post war were from superior quality shell casings from WWII. The list goes on. Pretty much all of it is nonsense.

I do not believe that the quality of briar makes a big difference in the flavor after the first few bowls. I believe it makes a difference in how long a pipe lasts. It makes a difference in appearnace.

That said I cant prove it so if believing it makes you happy rock on.

I know you believe different but I also dont belive the old Algerian myth. I think companies like Marxman excelled in marketing more than pipe making. I also think the same about Dunhill. Im sure there are fine examples but its not a new thing for companies to obtain cheap materials and market the hell out of it so it seems like a premium hunk of material. All in all, I dont think it makes a huge difference in the smoking experience. That is more in the design

Some briars are like the Mk. VI though, just sayin'

 

[Briar Lee]

Right after Pearl Harbor the gubbermint did a pipe smoker survey and found that the USA alone made 30 million pipes a year.

There were about 10 million pipe smokers who on average bought 3 pipes a year, and the most common price was a dollar.

Kaywoodie advertised they sold 11 million pipes a year, and the cheapest was $3.50.

Today Dr Grabow is the only volume maker, and they make 200,000 pipes a year.

Bob Marx and the Bertrams in Washington DC kept the one true faith and only used the best grades of Algerian briar, and Bertrams advertised it.

Every Shell Dunhill until 1968 was Algerian.

Pipe makers hated Algerian briar. It was soft, required more care, longer curing, and it was the best smoking.

So the best and most expensive old school makers only used Algerian, and the best grades of that. The only reason any pipe maker bad mouthed Algerian was they didn’t want to fool with it or made so many pipes they practically could not use much of it,

As to the superiority of Algerian I don’t think there’s a shadow of a doubt.

It’s like a fine linseed oil finish on a stock. The best guns only used a modified oil finish and the ones that took the cheaper methods bad mouthed oil.

And whatever wood and finish Martin used on Trigger, is superior. Willie paid 600 1968 dollars for Trigger and it’s the most valuable Martin, if not guitar, on earth. Because Trigger sounds twangier.

 

[Sig]

About 35 years ago I quit putting a cake on my briar pipes. Instead I keep an extremely thin resin of carbon, just enough to say there’s a trace of what might be a cake.

That resin layer doesn’t kill the stink from musty, bad briar.

I'm a HUGE proponent of the "thickness of a dime" is an insane amount of cake.
After I smoke my pipe, I wipe it out. Occasionally I use a knife to scrape out any soft cake that WILL hold moisture for eternity....or longer.
The carbon layer in my pipes is more of a diamond layer. If I want to remove it, it must be chiseled out. It comes out in shiny flakes.
Ive been doing this for decades. I've never once had a sour pipe or a stinky pipe.

 

[Briar Lee]

This color is the best way I can illustrate the oxblood fine Algerian briar turns.



Who’d like to make super high dollar pipes that look like a dog turd after a few smokes?

That color is the reason many makers of fine pipes hated Algerian.

 

[sablebrush52]

Pipe makers hated Algerian briar. It was soft, required more care, longer curing, and it was the best smoking.

Please link me to a source which states pipe makers hated Algerian briar.

In the very early days of pipe making it was thought to be an inferior variety because of its softness and susceptibility to cracking. Somehow, firms like Baring and Comoy came to embrace Algerian briar to the extent that they both established harvesting and seasoning operations in Algeria. Dunhill prized the craggy blasts that Algerian briar offered.

Much of the legend surrounding Algerian briar is marketing hype, part of the American and European fascination with the "mysterious orient".

I've never had a difficult time breaking in a pipe. There's a point where the scent of warmed or charred briar diminishes as a hard carbon coating forms, though there is disagreement among knowledgeable pipe makers and pipe smokers as to whether or not the basic flavor of the briar continues to affect the flavors of tobaccos after a carbon coating has been established. But, that's the nature of pipe smokers, particularly very experienced pipe smokers, to agree to disagree.

 

[woodsroad]

But I’m convinced that really good quality briar imparts an improved flavor to the smoke, the same as bad briar imparts a bad taste.

Bad stuff in briar imparts bad taste. Clean briar has very little taste.
My best smokes still come with clay pipes!

 

[KingPiper]

Any of us who buy enough pipes from eBay eventually get one that’s musty. There are various cures such as salt and alcohol and my favorite, coffee grounds, and you can smoke the stink out if you are determined.

And I think it’s safe to claim that the ordeal of breaking in a brand new pipe has been documented for as long as men have smoked briar pipes. But the brand new briar pipe,,,,does improve with smoking at least to a point. Some don’t seem to need a break in period.

This morning I’m smoking an old, but cheap Carey Freehand.

View attachment 380883

This cheap pipe made in modern times in Italy for EA Carey smokes as well as any pipe I own, and better than most I own not made of Pre 54 Algerian briar.

Now, it could be a fortuitous arrangement of the mechanics of how this pipe draws the smoke.

But I’m convinced that really good quality briar imparts an improved flavor to the smoke, the same as bad briar imparts a bad taste.


How, I’ve not yet determined.

There must be good mojos in good briar, and bad mojos in bad briar.

I always appreciate your posts. You share lots of interesting information and opinions.

 

[Briar Lee]

Please link me to a source which states pipe makers hated Algerian briar.

In the very early days of pipe making it was thought to be an inferior variety because of its softness and susceptibility to cracking. Somehow, firms like Baring and Comoy came to embrace Algerian briar to the extent that they both established harvesting and seasoning operations in Algeria. Dunhill prized the craggy blasts that Algerian briar offered.

Much of the legend surrounding Algerian briar is marketing hype, part of the American and European fascination with the "mysterious orient".

I've never had a difficult time breaking in a pipe. There's a point where the scent of warmed or charred briar diminishes as a hard carbon coating forms, though there is disagreement among knowledgeable pipe makers and pipe smokers as to whether or not the basic flavor of the briar continues to affect the flavors of tobaccos after a carbon coating has been established. But, that's the nature of pipe smokers, particularly very experienced pipe smokers, to agree to disagree.

Dunhill tried Algerian and found it wanting. until he discovered some heated by a furnace.

WDC used it and called it French briar, and Bob Marx used it and called it Imported Briar.

Some maker unknown to me called Briar Brothers used it in this medium (by modern standards) Best Briar Superior GIANT




There probably were several grades of Algerian.

But those makers weren’t all bragging or lying.

The top end pipes used Algerian until the French lost the Algerian War of Indepence and still would, if France had won.

It imparts a slightly cinnamon taste.

No everyone likes cinnamon flavored pipes.

 

[Sig]

I think the bottom line is that some pipes just taste better.
A few years ago I acquired an unsmoked set of "Match Grain" Yorkshire pipes. They were not a particularly expensive pipe back when they were made in the 50s-60s, but, as with most pipes back then, they are made with quality briar and are drilled and finished near perfectly.
Two pipes, made from the same piece of briar, with the same dimensions. One Billiard, one Apple.
But, the Apple just tastes better, always has. So much so that the Billiard has been relegated to aromatics. In my world, that's where the lesser pipes end up.
The Apple is a top 5 Va/Burley smoker in my daily lineup.
I have $400+ pipes that just don't make tobacco taste great. And my very best tasting pipe is a dedicated VA pipe which is a basket pipe I got NOS for $10 from a box of 10 pipes I found in a small cigar shop. He got them 40 years ago from a closed down news shop in Jamestown NY.

 

[sablebrush52]

Dunhill tried Algerian and found it wanting. until he discovered some heated by a furnace.

WDC used it and called it French briar, and Bob Marx used it and called it Imported Briar.

Some maker unknown to me called Briar Brothers used it in this medium (by modern standards) Best Briar Superior GIANT

View attachment 380987


There probably were several grades of Algerian.

But those makers weren’t all bragging or lying.

The top end pipes used Algerian until the French lost the Algerian War of Indepence and still would, if France had won.

It imparts a slightly cinnamon taste.

No everyone likes cinnamon flavored pipes.

But none of these are examples of a pipe maker hating Algerian briar.

 

[NookersTheCat]

There were about 10 million pipe smokers who on average bought 3 pipes a year, and the most common price was a dollar.

Today Dr Grabow is the only volume maker, and they make 200,000 pipes a year.

And today, I'm certain, there's only about 1000 of us insane jackasses buying 200 pipes a year

And whatever wood and finish Martin used on Trigger, is superior. Willie paid 600 1968 dollars for Trigger and it’s the most valuable Martin, if not guitar, on earth. Because Trigger sounds twangier.

Personally I'm of the mindset that when it comes to music it's 90% the artist. I mean, I know that Martins are some of the best acoustics in the world.. but I'd bet a fiddle a gold that if I handed Willie my $400 Ibanez Artwood he'd be able to make it sing 100x better than I would be able to make Trigger sound haha.

I think that mindset applies to alot of things, no matter how much we try to convince ourselves otherwise. 'Ohh if I just get this $10k guitar I'll be a better musician. Oh if I get this $5k rifle I'll be a better shot' etc.
When the truth usually is actually if you just sat down and played with the cheap piece of crap you currently have instead of working the weeks on end it takes to afford all the new shiny doo-dads (like all the greats did when they started) you'd get alot further

 

[Briar Lee]

And today, I'm certain, there's only about 1000 of us insane jackasses buying 200 pipes a year

Personally I'm of the mindset that when it comes to music it's 90% the artist. I mean, I know that Martins are some of the best acoustics in the world.. but I'd bet a fiddle a gold that if I handed Willie my $400 Ibanez Artwood he'd be able to make it sing 100x better than I would be able to make Trigger sound haha.

I think that mindset applies to alot of things, no matter how much we try to convince ourselves otherwise. 'Ohh if I just get this $10k guitar I'll be a better musician. Oh if I get this $5k rifle I'll be a better shot' etc.
When the truth usually is actually if you just sat down and played with the cheap piece of crap you currently have instead of working the weeks on end it takes to afford all the new shiny doo-dads (like all the greats did when they started) you'd get alot further

Which does bring up another point about good smoking pipes, Algerian or otherwise.

Fifty years ago, when I’d smoke my EA Carey’s, my WDC Wellington, and my new Nording Hand Made Grade 3, the damned things would gurgle and they’d bite my tongue and when I brushed my teeth my mouth would burn.

And the more and more I smoked those pipes, that I still own today, the better smokers they became.

Buck Trent invented the electric banjo in 1960 and since then, only Buck Trent can make the Buck Trent sound.

1960 I Didn’t Mean It

Buck has gone home now, and there’s no more electric banjo artists I know of.

 

[NookersTheCat]

Fifty years ago, when I’d smoke my EA Carey’s, my WDC Wellington, and my new Nording Hand Made Grade 3, the damned things would gurgle and they’d bite my tongue and when I brushed my teeth my mouth would burn.

And the more and more I smoked those pipes, that I still own today, the better smokers they became.

I'm sure your mouth getting more tough over the years probably helped the equation a bit too haha

 

[Briar Lee]

I'm sure your mouth getting more tough over the years probably helped the equation a bit too haha

Exactly.

I got better at pipe smoking, too.

But, let’s talk about pipes deterioration of smoking quality over the years.

My pipe smoking mentor (although his wife and my mother would have put him six feet under if they caught him teaching me to smoke) was Harry Hosterman.

His wife Wilda Mae and daughter Nona Fern bought all of Harry’s Dr Grabow pipes, and he had maybe a couple dozen.

But when those pipes didn’t give off the proper aroma of Prince Albert those same women would trash that pipe and buy their beloved Harry a new one.

And I’d watch Harry take 4/0 steel wool from his garage and steal some olive oil from the kitchen cabinets and take a dab of honey off the kitchen table and break in a new pipe.

Youth is fleeting and so are pipes, even with the best care, if smoked enough.

The decline is so gradual the smoker might not notice.

Let’s Go All the Way 1964

A lifetime later

I think that in time, the good mojos fade like Pretty Miss Norma Jean

And it takes the best luthiers on this earth to keep Willie’s guitar Trigger, sounding like Trigger.

 

[telescopes]

Exactly.

I got better at pipe smoking, too.

But, let’s talk about pipes deterioration of smoking quality over the years.

My pipe smoking mentor (although his wife and my mother would have put him six feet under if they caught him teaching me to smoke) was Harry Hosterman.

His wife Wilda Mae and daughter Nona Fern bought all of Harry’s Dr Grabow pipes, and he had maybe a couple dozen.

But when those pipes didn’t give off the proper aroma of Prince Albert those same women would trash that pipe and buy their beloved Harry a new one.

And I’d watch Harry take 4/0 steel wool from his garage and steal some olive oil from the kitchen cabinets and take a dab of honey off the kitchen table and break in a new pipe.

Youth is fleeting and so are pipes, even with the best care, if smoked enough.

The decline is so gradual the smoker might not notice.

Let’s Go All the Way 1964

A lifetime later

I think that in time, the good mojos fade like Pretty Miss Norma Jean

And it takes the best luthiers on this earth to keep Willie’s guitar Trigger, sounding like Trigger.

I have found that a proper restoration - especially by someone who specializes in a proper cleaning - something more than a salt bath and definitely no steel wool - with an added bath of ozone and all the tar and old resin removed from inside the pipe - the pipe can be be brought back to like new standards. It is also a good time to reexamine the draw of the pipe and open it up if need. Each and everyone of my estates has bee n completely overhauled this way and each and everyone requires a new break in afterwards and smokes like a new pipe.