Questions for Leonardw

[Terry Lennox]

The countdown to this thread getting closed. 3...2...1...

 

[Zamora]

The cigar industry is much larger, has higher profits, more cash, and is much more competitive than pipe tobacco, thus there’s a lot more merchandising going on.

But my question is: why is it so important to have salesmen telling you what to buy? “Brand Ambassadors” are just that, salesmen. Slick, low key salesmen, but salesmen nonetheless.

Yes of course the cigar industry is much bigger, I was just pointing out that STG does do that sort of thing for that sector

 

[Zamora]

Actually, Sutliff hasn’t been US owned for 50 years. Mac Baren bought them from Altadis, a subsidiary of Imperial Tobacco.

I didn't know Altadis owned them but that's not surprising at all since they're all over the tobacco world. They not only own the Non Cuban "legacy" versions of brands like Montecristo but are also shareholders in Habanos

 

[leonardw]

Leonard, I also appreciate your coming on to discuss this matter further.

One thing I can’t get my head around is why STG would pay a reported $70 million to buy what appears to be 950 underperforming Sutliff blends and an old factory in the warehouse area of Richmond?

Are the Mac Baren blends that viable and valuable going forward?

Also, by moving all production out of the US aren’t you concerned about the import tariffs that have been promised for off-shored companies?

Sutliff and their U.S. produced pipe tobaccos are just one part of a much larger Mac Baren company. The pipe tobaccos made in the Mac Baren Denmark facility are sold in more than 60 other countries around the world. There is also a significant roll-your-own business, also global. There is also a significant nicotine pouch division, where sales are primarily in western Europe.

 

[Beers 'N Briars]

Sutliff and their U.S. produced pipe tobaccos are just one part of a much larger Mac Baren company. The pipe tobaccos made in the Mac Baren Denmark facility are sold in more than 60 other countries around the world. There is also a significant roll-your-own business, also global. There is also a significant nicotine pouch division, where sales are primarily in western Europe.

We appreciate you being here even if we don’t entirely appreciate the business moves of your employer. We know there are people like you at STG who want to address our concerns even if you can’t alleviate them. And though I’ve my questions and criticisms, I hope your employer will strive to be a bigger part of the community. And if I see you, Max, or any STG representatives here stateside at a show, I will shake your hand, and wish you well. I respect you have a tough job cutting people and cutting blends. Glad I don’t have to do it. Good luck in your endeavors, and maybe save MacBaren Navy Flake for the US market. That’s my Christmas wish for STG.

 

[leonardw]

That's good to hear, there were a few members who said that at their local B&Ms the Peterson blends weren't big movers which surprised me because they're hugely popular with the online community.

It's all relative. For a premium tin brand, Peterson does very well, nationally and globally. For a local B&M, it would absolutely be a slow mover, compared to say Lane 1Q.

We've actually done consumer research on "general pipe smokers" vs. online enthusiasts. Most enthusiasts love to experiment. Most general pipe smokers stick to their go-to brands.

I had smoked a pipe for 15 years before I joined STG. I had never heard of a pipe forum, a pipe show, or a pipe club before that. Folks who are engaged with the hobby like the folks here probably represent 2%-3% of all pipe smokers.

 

[telescopes]

. Folks who are engaged with the hobby like the folks here probably represent 2%-3% of all pipe smokers.

Excellent statistic, but a question for a follow up is do forum users proportionately account dmfor a significant statistic proportion of online sales? How much do forum users drive sales?

 

[Beers 'N Briars]

Excellent statistic, but a question for a follow up is do forum users proportionately account dmfor a significant statistic proportion of online sales? How much do forum users drive sales?

I’d venture a guess we probably buy more per purchase, but the regular pipe smoker likely buys more frequently.

 

[InWithBothFeet]

If it’s body wash, it is, but I won’t be picking it up.

Protect your back... bend at the knees.

 

[Beers 'N Briars]

Protect your back... bend at the knees.

Squat form…check.

 

[leonardw]

I say just be polite for polite’s sake. I can’t blame the people who feel like this is damage control for the US market because it does feel that way. STG is hardly present in the community in general. Their people aren’t on here or other forums/discords/chats very often at all. STG should be more engaged, supporting pipe shows, and podcasts if they want us to be more engaged with them. People shouldn’t be rude, period. But STG needs to step up as a community member now more than ever. So I agree that Leonard is doing a good thing here but he even admits it’s on a personal level and not at STG’s request. I hear good things about Max, but where is he besides in cringy Captain Black videos? STG should be more involved as a community member, and not just consider us at the end of its point of sale system. My 2¢ anyway.

It's hard to know which of these posts to jump in on, but I'll try to address a few of the points I'm seeing here...

People are upset, they have every right to be upset, and nothing I say can, or is intended to change that. Be polite to each other, but moderators, no one has to be polite to me. It's literally while I'm. Yes, to provide some context, which is always going to read like damage control. But instead of venting into void or some anonymous corporate inbox, you can vent or ask questions to the actual person who said to STG: This is what we should do with the Sutliff portfolio.

Nothing about this has been easy or fun, and there is also nothing anyone can say that is going to offend me.

Regarding STG being more engaged with the pipe smoking community, I 100% agree. And from 2012 to about 2020 I was. I was at pretty much every pipe show up until Covid. I was less active here starting about 2015 because we started another online community. In 2018 the company shifted Max Stokkebye from my marketing team to be STG's first 100% dedicated pipe tobacco brand ambassador. He might have been less active here, but spent 40 weeks a year traveling and hosting events at local B&Ms.

But it's true that since Covid we haven't been anywhere near as engaged. Multiple reasons for that. I was running a separate division (focused on hemp, of all things), and more recently Max moved back to his native Denmark.

Everyone's roles where switched around again this past June, and since then Max and I have been pretty much exclusively focused on assessing the combined STG/Mac Baren pipe tobacco and roll-your-own portfolios. You can expect us to be more engaged in 2025.

 

[Ahi Ka]

Excellent statistic, but a question for a follow up is do forum users proportionately account dmfor a significant statistic proportion of online sales? How much do forum users drive sales?

This is an excellent question. Very curious to hear the response.

 

[sfduke]

@leonardw
Looking forward to seeing you and Max at the various pipe shows in 2025.

Jeremy and the Sutliff team are always engaging at these events and really involved with the US pipe enthusiast community.

At the Chicago 2023 show, the Sutliff team provided five 10# blocks of pressed tobacco to be auctioned off.

At both the Vegas 2023 and 2024 shows, the Sutliff team had a significant presence compared to STG.

Looking forward to the STG team being as involved with the US pipe community as Sutliff.

Btw, please tell Max and the team that P&C operations has gone downhill in recent years.

 

[burleybreath]

Folks who are engaged with the hobby like the folks here probably represent 2%-3% of all pipe smokers.

Speaking as one who doesn't particularly give a damn about the subject matter here, I've been waiting for this. Thank you, Leonard.

 

[AndyNJ]

LNF absolutely contains perique.

Leonard

your contributions to this thread are most appreciated by me. Great, thanks.

I like LNF very well and have 10lbs of it, it's a (very) good tobacco, perique I don't taste in it. <2%?

 

[BenMN]

It's all relative [...] compared to say Lane 1Q.

We've actually done consumer research on "general pipe smokers" vs. online enthusiasts. Most enthusiasts love to experiment. Most general pipe smokers stick to their go-to brands.

I had smoked a pipe for 15 years before I joined STG. I had never heard of a pipe forum, a pipe show, or a pipe club before that. Folks who are engaged with the hobby like the folks here probably represent 2%-3% of all pipe smokers.

This

We are not "the room."

Thanks for talking with us

With expertise, passion, knowledge, etc. there is opportunity for humility rooted in the understanding that you are in the thin tail of a distribution curve

 

[sablebrush52]

Actual forum members may be the thin edge of a small wedge, but there are a lot of lurkers who look in without joining.

 

[anotherbob]

Ok, I get that, but the government never cares about losing jobs. They care about losing power and campaign contributions. Did they ever look at jobs lost when they passed the Tobacco Control Act in 2009? When they enacted the deeming regulations?

I know I am going in dangerous territory but I will say I agree so much with what you said about the Government. I think they only do good for us when they know their power is on the line. End of transmission (i.e. I am jerk that said that is peaceing out as the last batch of kids said.)

 

[Beers 'N Briars]

Leonard said we enthusiasts make up only 2-3% of the community. Not that we’re only 2-3% of sales. My relative is the standard pipe smoker. Grabs a pouch of SWRa a couple times a month at most. Doesn’t do shows, doesn’t cellar, doesn’t do the internet at all, and smokes a Grabow til it’s plugged and gets another. I definitely buy a lot more tobacco than he does. Exponentially more.

 

[Zamora]

It's all relative. For a premium tin brand, Peterson does very well, nationally and globally. For a local B&M, it would absolutely be a slow mover, compared to say Lane 1Q.

We've actually done consumer research on "general pipe smokers" vs. online enthusiasts. Most enthusiasts love to experiment. Most general pipe smokers stick to their go-to brands.

I had smoked a pipe for 15 years before I joined STG. I had never heard of a pipe forum, a pipe show, or a pipe club before that. Folks who are engaged with the hobby like the folks here probably represent 2%-3% of all pipe smokers.

Yeah my local B&M is cigar focused and 1Q and RLP6 are absolutely the biggest pipe tobacco movers along with the other aromatics, I love Peter Stokkebye and thankfully the non aromatic ones aren't as big movers so I've been always been able to get them. They sometimes have tins of Plum Pudding and Sutliff Crumble Kake VaPer and the owner said they were very slow movers until the news about the buyout came and then they were promptly sold out.

Do you know what the plans are for the Sutliff Krumble Cakes?