Phased Tobacco Ban Bill Proposed in California

[K.E. Powell]

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I sometimes have to wonder if I live in a different reality than others. Like, California is the home of Nixon and Reagan; it is literally where the New Right of the 1970s started, which helped build the foundation on which the fusionists and populists of the current right-wing still stand on to this day. Dems rule the roost in CA, but they are not, contrary to what cable news says, typically of the progressive Sanders-esque variety. There are exceptions to be sure, but most Dems in CA are there by virtue of their ability to fundraise and not their promotion of leftist policies.

CA is one of the biggest states in the Union and one of the biggest economies in the world, but people who have never been there think it is just one giant San Francisco lol. There are states in this Union whose so-called "nanny" laws are far more stringent and whose politics are couched more firmly in the left. (I should say, however, that the former is not exclusive to the left and, in fact, the right has been quite willing to sacrifice to their own "small government" principles to, say, ban books featuring -gasp!- queers or to otherwise fire off a few more shells in this pointless culture war they helped foment in the first place.)

Anyway, I don't want to get too political, and I don't live in CA. It's 3000 miles away from me. But I just find it weird that the media has convinced everyone it is this super leftist utopia when it is actually a somewhat conservative state in the aggregate.

Also, no, this is not, as someone said here earlier, "literally 1984." Beyond the obvious hyperbole in that statement, it is not true in the literal sense: smoking was permitted in the novel.

 

[sablebrush52]

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I sometimes have to wonder if I live in a different reality than others. Like, California is the home of Nixon and Reagan; it is literally where the New Right of the 1970s started, which helped build the foundation on which the fusionists and populists of the current right-wing still stand on to this day. Dems rule the roost in CA, but they are not, contrary to what cable news says, typically of the progressive Sanders-esque variety. There are exceptions to be sure, but most Dems in CA are there by virtue of their ability to fundraise and not their promotion of leftist policies.

CA is one of the biggest states in the Union and one of the biggest economies in the world, but people who have never been there think it is just one giant San Francisco lol. There are states in this Union whose so-called "nanny" laws are far more stringent and whose politics are couched more firmly in the left. (I should say, however, that the former is not exclusive to the left and, in fact, the right has been quite willing to sacrifice to their own "small government" principles to, say, ban books featuring -gasp!- queers or to otherwise fire off a few more shells in this pointless culture war they helped foment in the first place.)

Anyway, I don't want to get too political, and I don't live in CA. It's 3000 miles away from me. But I just find it weird that the media has convinced everyone it is this super leftist utopia when it is actually a somewhat conservative state in the aggregate.

Also, no, this is not, as someone said here earlier, "literally 1984." Beyond the obvious hyperbole in that statement, it is not true in the literal sense: smoking was permitted in the novel.

You are correct in all of this and California led the tax revolt with Proposition 8.
But you are expecting ignorant, intellectually lazy people who have long ago given up thinking critically, if they ever did, thinking for themselves and are now simply mindless parrots, to understand any of this. Every time I encounter the "it's California" stuff I know I'm dealing with a mindless parrot. Same goes for the tobacco/marijuana trope. All mindless parrots who can't be bothered to look deeply into anything as it's so easy to have the "freedom" to be told what to think. It a sort of tribal nativism that's groomed into them and they are far too comfortable with it to challenge it.
And you're also correct to state that all the grooming and indoctrinating is not just on one extreme side of the political spectrum, but on both.

 

[Chalaw87]

Sooo....what Im hearing is stock up and cellar while you can... just in case.
If tobacco is illegal to buy in the future then youll have your well aged cellar, but if tobacco remains legal then, youll have your well aged cellar.

 

[sablebrush52]

Sooo....what Im hearing is stock up and cellar while you can... just in case.
If tobacco is illegal to buy in the future then youll have your well aged cellar, but if tobacco remains legal then, youll have your well aged cellar.

I honestly don't see tobacco ever being made illegal since prohibitions don't work, except in the opposite. I do see tobaccos being made more inconvenient to buy or enjoy.

Used to be that only Washington state banned internet sales of tobacco. Now it's also Arkansas, Maine, Oregon, Vermont, and Utah.

States banning various forms of tobacco include:

Arizona, California, Colorado Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Iowa, Kansas, Mane, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Montana, Nebraska, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Utah, Vermont, Washington, and Wisconsin.

Most of these bans are aimed at online or face to face sales of vaping products, flavored tobaccos, or cigarettes.

 

[pipestud]

I'm already picturing PipeStud lording over a great American tobacco cartel, cabana hat and all.

Well, not wearing a cabana hat!. That would not look good on a Texan!

 

[kcghost]

Sooner or later, they are going to be coming for all of us.

 

[georged]

Sooner or later, they are going to be coming for all of us.

Indeed.

Humans haven't changed, only the technology available to allow them to BEHAVE like humans has.

Imagine if any of history's famous bootheel-grinding conqueror/dictators, from Genghis Khan to Hitler, Mao, and Pol Pot, had been able to monitor the behavior of individuals down to a "dial-able" level of detail. Every hour---sometimes every minute---of their day having been recorded by the devices they use. SmartPhones, computers, cars, traffic cameras, facial recognition cameras, and on and on.

One of them not getting with the program, or determined to be an actual risk to the conqueror/dictator wannabe? Check their habits, preferences, expenditures, debts, alliances, friends, political views, and etc. All the information is available. Leverage to force compliance WILL be found.

Sound like fun?

Planet Earth is about to find out.

 

[AJL67]

Indeed.

Humans haven't changed, only the technology available to allow them to BEHAVE like humans has.

Imagine if any of history's famous bootheel-grinding conqueror/dictators, from Genghis Khan to Hitler, Mao, and Pol Pot, had been able to monitor the behavior of individuals down to a "dial-able" level of detail. Every hour---sometimes every minute---of their day having been recorded by the devices they use. SmartPhones, computers, cars, traffic cameras, facial recognition cameras, and on and on.

One of them not getting with the program, or determined to be an actual risk to the conqueror/dictator wannabe? Check their habits, preferences, expenditures, debts, alliances, friends, political views, and etc. All the information is available. Leverage to force compliance WILL be found.

Sound like fun?

Planet Earth is about to find out.

Yah it sounds like a lot of fun in China.

 

[K.E. Powell]

You are correct in all of this and California led the tax revolt with Proposition 8.
But you are expecting ignorant, intellectually lazy people who have long ago given up thinking critically, if they ever did, thinking for themselves and are now simply mindless parrots, to understand any of this. Every time I encounter the "it's California" stuff I know I'm dealing with a mindless parrot. Same goes for the tobacco/marijuana trope. All mindless parrots who can't be bothered to look deeply into anything as it's so easy to have the "freedom" to be told what to think. It a sort of tribal nativism that's groomed into them and they are far too comfortable with it to challenge it.
And you're also correct to state that all the grooming and indoctrinating is not just on one extreme side of the political spectrum, but on both.

The whole being intellectually lazy thing is part of it, to be sure. But I don't want to paint with a broad brush here: there are people who may be ignorant of politics but are not otherwise intellectually lazy or whatever. Far from it. I think when it comes to politics, especially here in the United States, you are expected to have an opinion on matters regardless of how much you actually know about the topic. You have a right to having an opinion, and it is certainly easier than ever to broadcast that opinion to as many people as possible; one could even argue that doing so is part of one's civic duty to engage in an (ostensibly) democratic process. To not have an opinion is to appear to be apathetic, and though some people are fine with that, many others are not. It's not an easy responsibility to meet for anyone, myself included.

Unfortunately, critical thinking is a real skill, just like carpentry or repairing a car. That is unfortunate, because it is not in the interest of powerful people to have "regular" people learn that skill, so it is largely not taught or entirely glossed over in K-12 education. But if someone--let's say me, for sake of being fair--were to pontificate about how to best repair a car with a busted pump or something, few would take me seriously, because it would be very clear very quickly that I knew nothing about cars. Ditto for carpentry. If I need those skills, I will have to hire a professional or have a professional teach them to me. Those skills take a lot of intellectual and physical skill and years of experience to really master. Critical thinking is the same, which is why most people aren't good at it. Add to that a 24/7 media brainwashing and you get people selling their American inheritance for beans, essentially.