Older Tobacco is Better? Naaa.

[Hovannes]

In my humble opinion, fresh PS Cube Cut is delicious. Old PS Cube Cut isn't.
Old crispy MacBaren's Latakia Blend I enjoy, A fresh new can, not so much.
I can't say why exactly. It depends.

 

[clynch]

How much 2/5/10 year old Capstan Blue have you smoked to allow you to make an educated comparison? I find Capstan Blue a bit harsh and rough around the edges when is fresh. I can't think of a single Virginia, VaPer or VaOr blend I've tested that didn't improve with age. I even like aged English blends but I could see how a latakia freak may feel differently.

I'm just speaking for me having had more than a little experience smoking fresh and aged. Closely, it's a subjective thing and as long as you're not asking me to buy it for you, I don't care what you smoke.

I haven't smoked any old capstan to get a better opinion. I see the pungent grassy freshly opened tin mellowing down in as little as 6 months. This is while smoking from the same tin. Thats why I asked. It seems all the tin notes from the 15 tins I have are slowly mellowing down from when they were freshly opened. Capstan stands out because it seemed very pungent to me. I still like it but prefer fresh.

 

[sablebrush52]

I think one's perspective changes the longer one has been smoking pipe tobaccos. When I was starting out these various brands were the products of separate and individual entities, and their products reflected that. Components were aged for years before and after blending, often undergoing fermentation, and the flavors reflected that.

Today's pipe smoker faces a very different reality, one where a corporate behemoth has bought the IP rights to a lot of names, using the same sources to make their range of blends and as a result, the blends have lost some of their individuality. Loss of subsidies has pushed a lot of growers to abandon their traditional crops and to turn to growing more profitable and less labor intensive crops. So there are fewer sources than there used to be. Economies of production, like machine harvesting as opposed to careful hand harvesting also affect the result.

We've seen blends go out of production as a result, a recent example being Watch City Slices, because the particular variety of leaf, or quality of leaf, isn't available to make it and its maker isn't going to pretend that it can still be made. Then as now, component quality is variable. Just because a blend uses St James Perique doesn't guarantee it's good St James Perique.

People getting into pipe smoking in today's world will imprint on what's available, just as I did when I started smoking pipe tobaccos 50 years ago. But what I imprinted on is different and many of today's blends I find lacking, especially modern versions of blends that have been around for decades. That's why I can't stand today's Balkan Sobranie. It's not the Balkan Sobranie I smoked in the past, not by a long shot. Same with what's presented as Escudo. It's not the Escudo that I smoked years ago. For me, they're just a name on a tin of "whatsis".

For people who didn't experience these blends as they were once made, it doesn't matter. If you like what you're smoking, that's really what counts. Today's St Bruno isn't the Ogden's St Bruno because the base tobaccos are different. Fortunately, I like this version, so I enjoy smoking St Bruno.

Having stocked up on blends that I liked allows me to continue to enjoy blends that are either no longer made, or made in a way that is no longer recognizable as what they once were.

But just starting out, I probably wouldn't have these considerations.

 

[clynch]

I think one's perspective changes the longer one has been smoking pipe tobaccos. When I was starting out these various brands were the products of separate and individual entities, and their products reflected that. Components were aged for years before and after blending, often undergoing fermentation, and the flavors reflected that.

Today's pipe smoker faces a very different reality, one where a corporate behemoth has bought the IP rights to a lot of names, using the same sources to make their range of blends and as a result, the blends have lost some of their individuality. Loss of subsidies has pushed a lot of growers to abandon their traditional crops and to turn to growing more profitable and less labor intensive crops. So there are fewer sources than there used to be. Economies of production, like machine harvesting as opposed to careful hand harvesting also affect the result.

We've seen blends go out of production as a result, a recent example being Watch City Slices, because the particular variety of leaf, or quality of leaf, isn't available to make it and its maker isn't going to pretend that it can still be made. Then as now, component quality is variable. Just because a blend uses St James Perique doesn't guarantee it's good St James Perique.

People getting into pipe smoking in today's world will imprint on what's available, just as I did when I started smoking pipe tobaccos 50 years ago. But what I imprinted on is different and many of today's blends I find lacking, especially modern versions of blends that have been around for decades. That's why I can't stand today's Balkan Sobranie. It's not the Balkan Sobranie I smoked in the past, not by a long shot. Same with what's presented as Escudo. It's not the Escudo that I smoked years ago. For me, they're just a name on a tin of "whatsis".

For people who didn't experience these blends as they were once made, it doesn't matter. If you like what you're smoking, that's really what counts. Today's St Bruno isn't the Ogden's St Bruno because the base tobaccos are different. Fortunately, I like this version, so I enjoy smoking St Bruno.

Having stocked up on blends that I liked allows me to continue to enjoy blends that are either no longer made, or made in a way that is no longer recognizable as what they once were.

But just starting out, I probably wouldn't have these considerations.

I bow to your wisdom. Always enjoy reading your in depth responses. Considering how everything changes I applaud the blender who can keep it close to the starting standard. I'm enjoying the pipe journey. Life is good.

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

I haven't smoked any old capstan to get a better opinion. I see the pungent grassy freshly opened tin mellowing down in as little as 6 months. This is while smoking from the same tin. Thats why I asked. It seems all the tin notes from the 15 tins I have are slowly mellowing down from when they were freshly opened. Capstan stands out because it seemed very pungent to me. I still like it but prefer fresh.

I respect your opinion. I think if you it fresh, you'll like it more with a few years age. Perhaps not. Regardless, I think we can agree that it is a very fine blend.

 

[clynch]

I respect your opinion. I think if you it fresh, you'll like it more with a few years age. Perhaps not. Regardless, I think we can agree that it is a very fine blend.

I will force myself to get a few tins and cellar two. This will be my cellar test. Put it away for 2 and 5 year test. Should I see an old capstan blue, I'll buy it. I do appreciate your experienced opinion. I know I'm a noob.

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

I will force myself to get a few tins and cellar two. This will be my cellar test. Put it away for 2 and 5 year test. Should I see an old capstan blue, I'll buy it. I do appreciate your experienced opinion. I know I'm a noob.

PM me your address and I'll mail you a tin of Capstan Blue with a few years of age on it. Everyone is anoob at some point.

 

[Swiss Army Knife]

As others have mentioned I cellar more for availability and cost than I do to specifically age anything.

As for if things improve with age I've found it depends. A tin of Murray's era Dunhill Light Flake from the 90s is mind-blowing compared to a fresh tin of it's equivalent, Peterson Flake, today. I don't think that's entirely because "tobacco was better back then" or anything. Age has just allowed the blend to mellow and settle into itself. Some of the richness isn't being overshadowed by harsher or more obvious aspects like you'd find in a green fresh version.

In other blends I find little improvement or they're outright worse. Where as a fresh tin of ,for example, Blood Red Moon is a pretty enjoyable cocktail of dark cherry and chocolate a jar of it that's been sitting for a year is just a whisper of it's former self. Some Latakia blends share the same fate, others are improved as the Latakia becomes less dominating. It all depends.

I will say that I've tried just about every virginia I can get my hands on and they're always better the older they are.

 

[AppalachianPipe92]

Like others stated, I only started "cellaring" because I really liked something and feared it not being available forever. WCS is a great example as someone already said.
Although I noticed after smoking some tins with just 3 or so years age on em, they were much more refined (mellow, sweeter) than their fresh counterparts. The PS Luxury flakes are a great example. HH Pure VA another. So many that I started to see a theme and not dismiss it as snake oil.
Thats not to say every blend is this way, but many of my favorites are.

YMMV

 

[seanv]

I don't have anything new to add but I'll just agree with the sentiment that some blends improve dramatically and some don't. I have a cellar to hedge myself against the future of tobacco price increases and lack of availability. The aging that takes place in the meantime has so far been enjoyable.

 

[clynch]

PM me your address and I'll mail you a tin of Capstan Blue with a few years of age on it. Everyone is anoob at some point.

That is quite the gesture. I'm truly humbled and delighted!

 

[Honkytonk Man]

That is quite the gesture. I'm truly humbled and delighted!

I told y'all. That Hoosierpipeguy is quite a guy! ?

 

[LeafErikson]

As someone that has only been pipe smoking for a couple of years, I haven’t amassed a huge cellar of aged tobaccos so I can’t speak on the quality of smoking the heavily aged classics like escudo, capstan, etc (although I don’t really like capstan much to begin with). I will say that some of my favorite tobaccos I’ve tried have been blended with heavily aged leaf, namely eight state burley by Cornell and Diehl. Another blend that I noticed a marked difference with from even just one year of age on it was Peter stokkebye luxury navy flake. On that same vein I’ve smoked fresh vs two year aged opening night by Cornell and Diehl (a straight Virginia) and found the differences to be marginal. I think it’s almost on a blend by blend basis. Then again I’m a man of few tobaccos and haven’t tried nearly as many as some of the insightful forum members here.

 

[Honkytonk Man]

That is quite the gesture. I'm truly humbled and delighted!

And Clynch, let us know your thoughts. Aged vs Un-Aged (new word right there).
?

 

[cigrmaster]

I do see the need for a cellar. Many reasons. Perhaps when I find THE blend I'll cellar it. First things first for me. If I am still smoking a pipe two years from now, I'm beyond hobby

Anything aged will mature and change. Did your aged capstan go less pungent when opened?

You may not believe it but I cannot remember the last time I stuck my nose into a tin of tobacco to check out the aroma. I think I stopped doing it once I stopped smoking English blends. I have no reason not to smell the tobacco I just open a tin, grab a flake and close the lid and put it back where it stays fresh. I light up and I am off and running. If I can remember I am going to stick my nose in a tin tomorrow.

The only thing that I notice with Capstan is it get darker once it is opened and the air gets to it. Again, sorry I don't know how long it takes to darken. I am not that observant I guess.

 

[Briar Lee]

it's individual. My take is very different from yours, not so much about aging "improving" tobaccos because it only changes them and not all of them and not to the same extent, but about liking blends and stocking up. I like about 15% of the blends that I try, so I stock those against price increases and sudden disappearances. Cellaring is at best a mixed bag. But every time I get to smoke a favorite blend that has been discontinued I'm happy that I stocked up.
That you're happy with what you're doing is the key thing. Your view regarding tobaccos worked for me until it didn't and now I enjoy my tobaccos in a different way.

Once upon a time the valiant boys in blue cornered their quarry around the town of Durham North Carolina.

General Lee had been released on his parole at Appomattox and neither side down there in North Carolina were anxious to die for a noble cause, since the war was nearly done.

And those Yankee dollars bought a lot of Bull Durham tobacco. A few weeks later the Yankee officers ran out and bought more, by mail order.

Thence the first national smoking tobacco brand was in the borning.

Bull Durham Smoking Tobacco - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Do you think that Blackwell said boys, let’s fill those Yankee orders with a blend that will age well?

Or did the success of Bull Durham rely on fresh, but aged in wood previously, bright leaf tobacco getting out the door to a fresh tobacco hungry customer?

About fifty years later on, a man named R J Reynolds came up with a patent to flavor tobacco with licorice and sell it moist and fresh in little metal cans.

And the National Joy Smoke became the foundation sire of every codger burley blend sold today, all still sold moist and sealed so as to preserve freshness.

Nothing on this planet smells better than a brand new girlfriend.

But after the bloom has faded from that rose, then I think a brand new opened package of Half and Half smells very tasty.

All commercial blends are made to stay fresh as long as possible.

Some of the pipe shop blends might improve with age.

But don’t count on it.

 

[Chasing Embers]

Thence the first national smoking tobacco brand was in the borning.

P. Lorillard Company was founded nearly 100 years earlier in 1760.

Nothing on this planet smells better than a brand new girlfriend.

Money does.

 

[bassbug]

Tobacco gets better with age. No getting around that. Added flavors or latakia may disappear with time, that could negatively affect a blend.

Which one is it then?

 

[judcole]

6 months is not aged. Drier, if the tin has been opened, but not aged.
The general consensus, from what I have read, over a period of 15 years perusing internet tobacco & pipe groups, is that it takes at least 5 years for any noticeable changes to take place. That means 5 (or more) years sealed, in the tin or jar, not opened to "dip into".
Aged tobacco is different. Whether or not it is better is of course subjective, as is so much else in this hobby.
Smoke what you like, and like what you smoke, but don't dismiss things without experience,

 

[Richmond B. Funkenhouser]

Which one is it then?

The TOBBACO leaf gets better.. Fresh tobacco leaves are harsh. Some BLENDS lose the flavors that were added to them over time.

So shithead, you'll find that what I meant is what I already said.. The tobacco improves but the added flavors like those imparted on the latakia may fade. That could negatively affect the blend.