Maybe some family, I have relatives that I wouldn't piss on if they were on fire
Older Guys: What are Your Thoughts?
- Thread starter AppalachianPipe92
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Well, I cannot give you the advice you want, all I can do is offer the single datum point: my choices. Maybe, hopefully, it will help...
From the start I didn't have a "job'" I chose a career; I didn't "work," I did what I liked, as if it was a hobby, and got paid for it. I worked in scientific research in universities and private and national (Federal) laboratories. I loved my work and my family, and both were so fulfilling that I never had to choose one over the other. It was a positive feedback loop: being happy at work made me happier at home, and being happy at home made me happier at work. Making money was never a driving factor in my choices, happiness was. Dividing the time between family and work was, therefore, never an issue. Now, whenever I found a job that I really liked elsewhere, I just relocated near to my work, so commuting was never an issue. As far as making money goes: it's true that I could have spent more time at home and work less; on the other hand, I was able to retire early, at 56 years old, and now spend full time with the family and the kids, and traveling, and doing whatever we want, while I'm still young enough and have the strength for it. So, this was my experience. I don't know if any of it applies to your life, but maybe it gave you something to think about.
From the start I didn't have a "job'" I chose a career; I didn't "work," I did what I liked, as if it was a hobby, and got paid for it. I worked in scientific research in universities and private and national (Federal) laboratories. I loved my work and my family, and both were so fulfilling that I never had to choose one over the other. It was a positive feedback loop: being happy at work made me happier at home, and being happy at home made me happier at work. Making money was never a driving factor in my choices, happiness was. Dividing the time between family and work was, therefore, never an issue. Now, whenever I found a job that I really liked elsewhere, I just relocated near to my work, so commuting was never an issue. As far as making money goes: it's true that I could have spent more time at home and work less; on the other hand, I was able to retire early, at 56 years old, and now spend full time with the family and the kids, and traveling, and doing whatever we want, while I'm still young enough and have the strength for it. So, this was my experience. I don't know if any of it applies to your life, but maybe it gave you something to think about.
I had something really uncharitable typed up about those older guys, and then thought better of posting it. If they are a lot older, perhaps they're of the mindset that the father's job is to spend all his time earning money for the family, and it's the mother's job to raise the kids. If both are on board with that arrangement, more power to them I guess, but you can't do it over again.
Count me among those who believe you've made the right choice.
Difficult question but kudos to the OP for contemplating this dilemma. I'm 66 and found balance is perhaps the most important thing in life. If you totally focus on building wealth, your family suffers. On the other hand, you could quit your job and spend all your time with your family. Unfortunately, you'd live in poverty which arguably would not be good for your family.
It sounds like you've found balance. From my perspective, you've made the right choice. Tomorrow is not guaranteed for you or any member of your family. Cherish every second you spend with your family. Your primary responsibility should not be building wealth but rather, raising your children with love and values so they become great adults and continue to pass that culture along for generations to come. Ask yourself what you want your legacy to be. "He built great financial wealth in his life" or "He was the world's greatest Husband and Father ". Answer that question and you have the answer to your other question.
It sounds like you've found balance. From my perspective, you've made the right choice. Tomorrow is not guaranteed for you or any member of your family. Cherish every second you spend with your family. Your primary responsibility should not be building wealth but rather, raising your children with love and values so they become great adults and continue to pass that culture along for generations to come. Ask yourself what you want your legacy to be. "He built great financial wealth in his life" or "He was the world's greatest Husband and Father ". Answer that question and you have the answer to your other question.
Or third wife, or your beneficiaries.
Fortunately, I like what I do and get paid to do it. Ours isn't a family that retires early since we all went after careers that interest us.
My father retired three times, first at 65 when he and Mom did a lot of traveling, again in his mid 70's, because he thought that he ought to make room for younger talent, and as it turned out that younger talent wasn't a replacement for that giant brain of his, finally actually retired at 84, because he wanted to spend time in his garden and he figured how much time did he have left. Turned out he had a fair ways to go, since he passed at 97.
People ask me when I'm going to retire, and my response is when I no longer enjoy what I'm doing. Besides, whoever heard of an artist retiring?
At 68 I worry about retiring...and not retiring...I have been privileged to have a profession which both provides for my family and provides me with a sense of purpose, contribution and identity. Although I do not golf, i am also keenly aware that I can see the clubhouse from here. The brevity of life comes to mind each morning when i read what is euphemistically called in Boston the "Irish sports page".
I am also reminded of the question posed by Don Corleone to Johnny Fontane in The Godfather: " you spend time with your family? Because a man who doesn't spend time with his family can't call himself a man."
Remember that in the end it does not matter how big your home or vacation home is...coffins are all the same size.
I am also reminded of the question posed by Don Corleone to Johnny Fontane in The Godfather: " you spend time with your family? Because a man who doesn't spend time with his family can't call himself a man."
Remember that in the end it does not matter how big your home or vacation home is...coffins are all the same size.
My feeling is that one is not mutually exclusive to the other. I know wealthy folks who also raised great kids. But, I suppose such depends on one's definition of wealth. Millionaires are a dime a dozen these days. I'd define wealthy as having access to a million cash with another few millions in assets. I certainly do not qualify but, I'm damned comfortable. While time spent with one's kids is important, more important is what values you instill in your kids while spending time with them. And, don't forget you are a role model for your children. Instilling a work ethic, teaching critical thinking, proper money management (budget, reconciling on bank statement, and such are all things no longer taught in many schools. The parent needs to remember that how they behave in life will most likely be emulated, to some degree or another, by the kids.
Luckily, many kids will look at their sadly lousy parents and with the help of a neighbor, another relative, teacher or such and make the decision not to emulate.
So, give them a role model to emulate!
Retirement doesn't have to mean ... retirement from being productive and continuing to learn. Retirement for me meant taking on interesting but usually low paying or non-paying jobs simply because I wanted the experience. Donating scheduled hours to non-profits is another great way of continuing ones education and widening horizons while serving a purpose which is necessary for many to feel they are still of value to others. Many, myself included, have to feel we are still making a contribution, whether it be to the community or, more lofty, the world.
There's a whole world of people, companies, universities, community colleges and non-profits who would be happy to utilize your experience and knowledge. I spent a summer, cruising and eating free by operating as a tour guide for a firm which took tours up the Alaskan "Inside channel." Tough gig that was.
Your lucky in the sense that you enjoy your work. I don't hate mine, I just don't necessarily enjoy what I'm good at. And what I'm good at is very hard, especially in the mountains.
I'll hope one day when my kids are older, I can make the leap to work with one of my passions without financial restraint. I'd rather do that than retire I think. Then again, i have quite a ways to go
I think you need to do both. Raise good and capable kids, and make as much money as you can. As many have stated, it's a balance. It's not easy, but being poor is not easy. Being poor is terrible. Not to be all doom and gloom, but long term care can cost over $10k per month and most people can't afford that. And people in general are living longer. None of us really want to end up in the care of someone else, but it happens with increasing frequency. State run LTC facilities are generally not swell, Medicare and Medicaid do not pay for the good facilities. And even the costly LTC facilities can be problematic. I believe stats indicate that substantial number of boomers do not have enough money to retire. Scary aging population tsunami coming our way. So, nurture and prepare the kids (that's a baseline requirement) and carpe diem, but make and save money....it's very important.
First up, I offer no answers and I wish you the best in your difficult decision. It's good to have choices.
I'm in my 40s with 2 elementary-school-aged kiddos and a wife I adore and just had a similar situation pop up, well, yesterday. I ran into a friend at a wedding last Saturday who does the same thing I do, but somewhere else. We started talking and while all jobs/employers have their pros and cons, the pay at his outfit is significantly better than where I'm at and it offers better opportunity for my practice. He pressed me to apply and I'm honestly considering it, although it will require driving 1.5 hours each way to the city at least twice a week.
My current job allows a lot of remote work and my team and I are more productive that way than any team in the last 15 years, or so we've been told. In addition to the 30 second commute from my bed to the kitchen table, I also have ample time to take the kids to sports, log off and immediately start working in the garden, and I don't have to fight traffic, which has gotten brutal in Tennessee with the population explosion over the last 10 years.
My father was a workaholic who followed the old boomer adage of "arrive early, leave late, take on the tasks everyone else avoids, and sell your soul to the company." It got him nowhere. He's estranged from the family, including mom, whom he's lived with for nigh on 50 years. A couple wrong place wrong time events wiped out his savings and retirement and he is now working in his 70s to pay the bills.
I see writing on the wall. The reality is the economy is going to the shitter and is never coming back until we get into whatever is going to replace western civilization. What looks like a juicy retirement package now won't be worth a bag of beans by the time I retire. Fiat currency is a social contract built on shaky foundations.
I'm in my 40s with 2 elementary-school-aged kiddos and a wife I adore and just had a similar situation pop up, well, yesterday. I ran into a friend at a wedding last Saturday who does the same thing I do, but somewhere else. We started talking and while all jobs/employers have their pros and cons, the pay at his outfit is significantly better than where I'm at and it offers better opportunity for my practice. He pressed me to apply and I'm honestly considering it, although it will require driving 1.5 hours each way to the city at least twice a week.
My current job allows a lot of remote work and my team and I are more productive that way than any team in the last 15 years, or so we've been told. In addition to the 30 second commute from my bed to the kitchen table, I also have ample time to take the kids to sports, log off and immediately start working in the garden, and I don't have to fight traffic, which has gotten brutal in Tennessee with the population explosion over the last 10 years.
My father was a workaholic who followed the old boomer adage of "arrive early, leave late, take on the tasks everyone else avoids, and sell your soul to the company." It got him nowhere. He's estranged from the family, including mom, whom he's lived with for nigh on 50 years. A couple wrong place wrong time events wiped out his savings and retirement and he is now working in his 70s to pay the bills.
I see writing on the wall. The reality is the economy is going to the shitter and is never coming back until we get into whatever is going to replace western civilization. What looks like a juicy retirement package now won't be worth a bag of beans by the time I retire. Fiat currency is a social contract built on shaky foundations.
So, pretty much as it's been since we left the trees in the Savannah.
As long as you can have a roof over your head and keep your family sad. I don’t think you can put a monetary value on the time to spend with your wife and children.
I wasn't born early enough to raise a family comfortably on one income. I think we're heading in the wrong direction, devolving economically if you will.
Now if my kin could have just started a trust fund when we were still wearing animal skins....
BTW, I don't disagree with you. I think we're doing a lot of things badly, but we're also always done a lot of things badly throughout history.
For example, commodifying shelter has hurt a lot more people than it has helped. Your house might be worth a lot more than you paid for it, but now your kids can't afford to buy a home. Great trade off. And like all things that go off the mean it will eventually correct...
Quality of life, that's always been my focus. The money will come.
Make your goal to fulfill your obligations (family, career, and a wee bit of selfish "me time") and enjoy making money. Having sufficient moneys makes life easier. Trust me, depending on what makes you happy, money will buy happiness if used correctly. We are all motivated differently and many are, sadly centered on themselves. A well rounded individual should be able to do more than two things in life well. A life well lived means making sacrifices but, having some fun also. I liked traveling when younger. I enjoyed riding the rough stock in my teens and twenties. I couldn't wait to get out of bed, don my uniform and get to work during my career but, I never lost sight of family and planning for the future. I've had a life well led and am thankfull to many people along the way, particularly the bad examples I learned so much from. Those folks taught me how not to be. Such lessons were/are as important as the positive ones, maybe be more so in some areas.
I always looked for a job that was meaningful, challenging and rewarding that would allow me to be present for my wife and kids. The hours were long and hard but it was possible to match them to the rhythm of family life to a degree. My wife chose not to work when the children were small. The money wasn’t good and there were times early on when we just got by. With time the money came. I’ve never made decisions based primarily on money. It’s always been the “fit” of the situation and then was the money doable. I’m thankful for all the time that I’ve shared with my son and daughter as they both reach their mid-30s.