New Zealand to Ban Smoking for Next Generation in Bid to Outlaw Habit by 2025

[Brendan]

Yep, that's the thing I worry about - although I doubt Australia will ever do the same, we just love our taxes!

 

[aquadoc]

I'd rather see the ban than raised taxes, which is all but admitting you're trying to enslave the population rather than help them.

Seriously?

 

[Ahi Ka]

Seriously?

When you are already taxed roughly $1us per gram of tobacco, plus a further 15% goods and services tax on the total import price (this includes: shipping charges ($30us), import fees ($30us), tobacco cost (say $40us for a pound), and duty ($500us)), you are looking at around $700us for a pound. Remember US members were getting their knickers in a twist about a potential $50us per pound tax increase.

the reality is this legislative change makes zero difference for us down under.

 

[brian64]

When you are already taxed roughly $1us per gram of tobacco, plus a further 15% goods and services tax on the total import price (this includes: shipping charges ($30us), import fees ($30us), tobacco cost (say $40us for a pound), and duty ($500us)), you are looking at around $700us for a pound.

Identifying funding sources for their dystopian utopian programs presents unique challenges for the geniuses in charge:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1468594502080237568

 

[jpberg]

We’re talking about taking freedom away. Tobacco is one part. If you’re okay with the rest, you’re okay with tobacco.

 

[Ahi Ka]

We’re talking about taking freedom away. Tobacco is one part. If you’re okay with the rest, you’re okay with tobacco.

 

[jpberg]

But they can take your freedom to sing.
50 years ago the thought of taking away the freedom to smoke would’ve seemed ridiculous.
I seem to sound like a Debbie downer, but when you can get locked up for not following Covid protocol, you will eventually be locked up for anything.

 

[Ahi Ka]

But they can take your freedom to sing.
50 years ago the thought of taking away the freedom to smoke would’ve seemed ridiculous.
I seem to sound like a Debbie downer, but when you can get locked up for not following Covid protocol, you will eventually be locked up for anything.

You ain’t no Debbie downer, and you have personally done more for kiwi pipe smokers than the majority of the forum. I am probably naive, too hopeful and out of touch with the wider context of this thread, but I’ve always felt it’s the songs of the oppressed that will sustain the spirit of the counter hegemony.

In terms of leaf, I’m more excited about growing my own than upset about a commercial supply of Gawiths’ drying up - heck even a decade back when I picked up the pipe, a tin of erinmore was already $30us, you guys would be spewing about that.

 

[jpberg]

You ain’t no Debbie downer, and you have personally done more for kiwi pipe smokers than the majority of the forum. I am probably naive, too hopeful and out of touch with the wider context of this thread, but I’ve always felt it’s the songs of the oppressed that will sustain the spirit of the counter hegemony.

In terms of leaf, I’m more excited about growing my own than upset about a commercial supply of Gawiths’ drying up - heck even a decade back when I picked up the pipe, a tin of erinmore was already $30us, you guys would be spewing about that.

Two things - songs are the right answer, and as long as mail is legal you and your countrymen will have tobacco if you need it.
And growing your own, that’s the ultimate freedom. Keep on keeping on!

 

[OzPiper]

Prohibition (in the US and several other countries in the early 20th century). And no tapering by age, it (alcohol) was just outright made illegal.

For some years I have referred to this movement against tobacco as Neo-Prohibitionism.
Australia will most likely follow that lead soon.
History repeats itself.

 

[cfreud]

I get a small vicarious thrill from smoking while reading this thread.

 

[Brendan]

I get a small vicarious thrill from smoking while reading this thread.

Shhhh..

If they know we enjoy it they will ban it outright.

If they think we are all hopeless addicts they will stick to just taxing the crap out of us.


I am joking of course.

 

[tzinc]

THIS is actually the only way to stop smoking EVERYTHING else they have done has been nonsense and VIRTUE SIGNALLING... it makes me sad that a great hobby has to die out... but I also loved typewriters and 8 tracks. Progress is progress I guess. BUT they need to make sure that those who are allowed to smoke by their laws have access to tobacco until they die out. I mean that's the ONLY FAIR way to do it. It won't effect their plan they will eventually end up with a smoke free and healthier society.

 

[GlidingGonzo]

Telling people (especially teenagers) that they can't do something is the prime way to make them want to do it just to rebel. All this will do is create a black market around tobacco. Silly New Zealand... no doubt my home Canada will fall in line with this mentality too eventually.

 

[BROBS]

Sheesh, not sure how to feel about this.

I think it'll be increasingly important to help people (the general public) understand that tobacco does NOT equal cigarettes.

In the same way, we have come to understand that a reasonable amount of red wine can provide antioxidants that are healthy and that is very different than going out on a Friday and hammer 12 gin-based cocktails; we need to somehow fund some unbiased research in to the different forms of tobacco.

Actually studies say that is false. Any alcohol intake is detrimental to your health.

 

[GlidingGonzo]

Up here in the great white North its getting tricky:
- can't smoke indoors in public buildings including restaurant patios.
- can't smoke within 3 metres of a doorway or window
- plain (hideous) packaging - cigars come in cardboard boxes - not cedar anymore
- insane taxes ($11 C7D tin - duty is $30)
- some cities (Victoria BC) - can't smoke on benches or in public places (parks, beaches)

Basically you have to go hide in your backyard or garage and freeze your ass off. (Unless you are lucky like me - and belong to an old private club with a cigar lounge!)

An outright ban is difficult politically as First Nations leaders will lose there collective minds - tobacco is a sacred herb. But - they sure as heck make it as hard as possible.

Pot? No problem......

I live in BC and I smoke both but it's funny noticing how the cigars and pipe tobacco, which teenagers have no interest in, are all plain packaging at the local tobacconist. Meanwhile, go into the local dispensary and the packaging is allowed to be as colourful and attractive as possible. Weird double standard.

 

[Hovannes]

If you think this is bad, you ought to see what the Kiwis do to sheep!

 

[Ahi Ka]

I can only assume you are referring to This

 

[bullet08]

Doesn't Aborigines use tobacco for ceremonies? It seems different things are mentioned for smoking ceremonies, but no tobacco. Can they change the ingredients and keep it as cultural heritage?

 

[Ahi Ka]

Doesn't Aborigines use tobacco for ceremonies? It seems different things are mentioned for smoking ceremonies, but no tobacco. Can they change the ingredients and keep it as cultural heritage?

Unlike say First Nations peoples in Canada who can claim a right to tobacco through indigeneity, I’m fairly certain that tobacco (and potentially smoking, not sure here though) was not introduced to Aotearoa until European contact. What is fascinating though about pipe smoking and Māori, is that it wasn’t relegated to only a male past time as per European traditions. Women also took it up, and there are many stunning photos of Kuia Māori with a pipe clenched. It was also used as koha - a similar practice to bartering, but less about a resource base currency and more emphasis placed on cementing relationship

Tobacco (whole leaf not product) can still be imported tax free to NZ for cultural purposes, however you need to have customs approve a management/use plan to show its legit.