Is Gawith Dark Plug Flavored?

[cosmicfolklore]

As far as I know, Tonkin is no longer used in tobacco blends. A synthetic alternative has replaced it.

Hey Woods, I totally trust your info, because you've got contacts that we don't, but can you give me your source of this info?
I know that if I ever say this in conversation, the next thing that I am going to get asked is, "where did you hear that?" and instead of just replying, "Oh, I heard it from some guy online," it would be better if I could source something else. Thanks

 

[jpberg]

I had a UK buddy who put tonka beans in his SLF tin. I tried, and liked it.

 

[kcghost]

Can't abide the Lakeland flavor, I don't believe Dark Plug is flavored in any meaningful way.

 

[Strange Quark]

GH is so screwed up.
They change the nomenclature on cuts to names only they understand but can’t quite explain. Then all this crap about renaming and discontinuing blends.

Their next step will be to quit manufacturing altogether and just rebrand STG products.

I think a lot of this has to do with EU laws that restrict what tobacco products can be called or described as on the label. They're ever ratcheting up this process. As to cuts, tobacco is taxed at different rates according to class. Shag cut is analogous to cigarette tobacco despite being marketed for pipe. I wasn't surprised when G&H introduced versions of blends with the wider "vintage cut." Also, many blends may not sell as well and eventually get the ax.

 

[Skippy B. Coyote]

Just last week Rachel Gawith told me on Facebook that Kendal Kentucky and Dark Birds Eye have been discontinued, and that the currently-produced Kendal Dark is the equivalent of DBE, but that they label it as DBE for the American market.

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Now that is weird! Just last month I ordered Kendal Dark, Dark Bird's Eye, and Kendal Kentucky from SmokingPipes and they're all very obviously distinctly different blends. To my palate Kendal Dark has an unpleasant flavor to it that reminds of me of damp soil, Dark Bird's Eye has an obvious mild chocolatey topping not dissimilar to the topping on Prince Albert, and Kendal Kentucky is just good old plain unadulterated dark fired Kentucky.

It's a real bummer that they seem to have discontinued the two of the three that I like! Or at least they say that have. I dunno, Gawith is Gawith and rather inexplicable at times.

 

[woodsroad]

I think a lot of this has to do with EU laws that restrict what tobacco products can be called or described as on the label. They're ever ratcheting up this process. As to cuts, tobacco is taxed at different rates according to class. Shag cut is analogous to cigarette tobacco despite being marketed for pipe. I wasn't surprised when G&H introduced versions of blends with the wider "vintage cut." Also, many blends may not sell as well and eventually get the ax.

I agree that EU and US regulations are forcing changes, but GH has been totally cryptic about it. And what about the other pipe tobacco manufacturers? They don’t seem to be following GH’s bizarre behavior.

 

[woodsroad]

Hey Woods, I totally trust your info, because you've got contacts that we don't, but can you give me your source of this info?
I know that if I ever say this in conversation, the next thing that I am going to get asked is, "where did you hear that?" and instead of just replying, "Oh, I heard it from some guy online," it would be better if I could source something else. Thanks

Honestly, I don’t have a cite off-hand. My reference is as shady and questionable as yours! What I do know is that Tonka beans have been illegal to sell and use in foodstuffs since the mid 1950’s. There’s been a push to reverse that, since the coumarin level is really quite low, and chefs/bakers prize the flavor it adds. It’s not that overpowering perfume odor (that’s Rose Geranium), but rather a vanillaesque aroma.

 

[gawithhoggarth]

I think a lot of this has to do with EU laws that restrict what tobacco products can be called or described as on the label. They're ever ratcheting up this process. As to cuts, tobacco is taxed at different rates according to class. Shag cut is analogous to cigarette tobacco despite being marketed for pipe. I wasn't surprised when G&H introduced versions of blends with the wider "vintage cut." Also, many blends may not sell as well and eventually get the ax.

The UK government came down hard many years ago on what thickness pipe tobacco could be. So we had to change. Shag cut in the UK is not the same as hand rolling. However for the American market we continued to produce a finer cut. This would be illegal to sell in the UK as pipe tobacco. We thought we would see whether the UK thickness of pipe tobacco (called vintage in the USA) would sell. It would be far easier for us to be able to produce the same thickness of pipe tobacco for everywhere.

And yes blends that do not sell well are discontinued. We have two pay a registration fee each year for every blend we produce. This is wasted costs if that blend does not sell much.

 

[gawithhoggarth]

I agree that EU and US regulations are forcing changes, but GH has been totally cryptic about it. And what about the other pipe tobacco manufacturers? They don’t seem to be following GH’s bizarre behavior.

Cryptic? How exactly? I have stated exactly what we have done and why. Hardly bizarre behaviour.

Every country had different interpretations as to the rules and regulations and the UK has different rules to the EU in some cases. What we can label on way for one country, we cannot necessarily do for another country. What we can call a tobacco blend and what we can describe it as differ for each country. We try and align this as much as possible. Some countries don't allow words like 'light', 'sweet' etc, some countries (EU mostly and UK) don't allow anything that is associated with food e.g honey, chocolate, rum....rules and regulations change constantly.

Which other pipe tobacco manufacturers do you mean? We are the only one in the England. Europe is pretty much a monopoly under STG now.

 

[gawithhoggarth]

Now that is weird! Just last month I ordered Kendal Dark, Dark Bird's Eye, and Kendal Kentucky from SmokingPipes and they're all very obviously distinctly different blends. To my palate Kendal Dark has an unpleasant flavor to it that reminds of me of damp soil, Dark Bird's Eye has an obvious mild chocolatey topping not dissimilar to the topping on Prince Albert, and Kendal Kentucky is just good old plain unadulterated dark fired Kentucky.

It's a real bummer that they seem to have discontinued the two of the three that I like! Or at least they say that have. I dunno, Gawith is Gawith and rather inexplicable at times.

If you search then forums you will see I stated this ages ago. SmokingPipes may have old stock they are still selling out. I believe they took the last of Kendal Kentucky maybe 2 years ago when it was discontinued. Dark Bird's Eye used to have stalky birds eye bits in it, hence the name. This then became very difficult to find a few years ago and Dark Birds Eye morphed into Kendal Dark. The USA distributor wanted to continue with it being labelled as dark birds eye. So unless you have very old stock that actually has the 'eyes' in it which are pretty obvious, then it is the same as Kendal Dark. We agreed to carry on labelling as DBE to allow a transition over. There is no chocolate topping on DBE.

 

[georged]

Rachel ---

I just want to say that no one who hasn't tried to source, produce, and distribute a product for international markets that have different requirements and regulations---an increasingly vilified product at that---can appreciate the difficulty, effort, and dedication required.

The fact that there are far easier ways to make a living speaks volumes.

Please keep doing what you are doing.

 

[woodsroad]

Cryptic? How exactly? I have stated exactly what we have done and why. Hardly bizarre behaviour.

Every country had different interpretations as to the rules and regulations and the UK has different rules to the EU in some cases. What we can label on way for one country, we cannot necessarily do for another country. What we can call a tobacco blend and what we can describe it as differ for each country. We try and align this as much as possible. Some countries don't allow words like 'light', 'sweet' etc, some countries (EU mostly and UK) don't allow anything that is associated with food e.g honey, chocolate, rum....rules and regulations change constantly.

Which other pipe tobacco manufacturers do you mean? We are the only one in the England. Europe is pretty much a monopoly under STG now.

Oh, crap.
She’s back.

 

[Skippy B. Coyote]

If you search then forums you will see I stated this ages ago. SmokingPipes may have old stock they are still selling out. I believe they took the last of Kendal Kentucky maybe 2 years ago when it was discontinued. Dark Bird's Eye used to have stalky birds eye bits in it, hence the name. This then became very difficult to find a few years ago and Dark Birds Eye morphed into Kendal Dark. The USA distributor wanted to continue with it being labelled as dark birds eye. So unless you have very old stock that actually has the 'eyes' in it which are pretty obvious, then it is the same as Kendal Dark. We agreed to carry on labelling as DBE to allow a transition over. There is no chocolate topping on DBE.

How very odd! The Dark Bird's Eye I got from SmokingPipes here in the US recently doesn't have the 'eyes' in it, so it seems likely to be the new Kendal Dark that's just being labeled as Dark Bird's Eye, but it is very good and I've been enjoying it immensely! I'm not sure what it is about it that makes it taste chocolatey to me if there's no chocolate topping on it, but whatever it is it sure is tasty! Really fantastic blend.

That does make me wonder what the "Kendal Dark" that SmokingPipes is selling actually is though, if their "Dark Bird's Eye" is the true Kendal Dark, since what they're calling "Kendal Dark" is a very obviously different blend and nowhere near as good as the true Kendal Dark that they're labeling as Dark Bird's Eye; in my book at least.

In any case, thank you for your continued work getting blends over to this side of the pond! Gawith Hoggarth makes some of the world's finest blends that are unlike anything else on the market, and I'd be awfully sad if I couldn't get them anymore.

 

[gawithhoggarth]

As already stated the more recent Dark Birds Eye is Kendal Dark. It is the same product labelled differently. Absolutely no difference in the product. This just shows how subjective tobacco is and how people's perceptions can be based on different things.

 

[BingBong]

As already stated the more recent Dark Birds Eye is Kendal Dark. It is the same product labelled differently. Absolutely no difference in the product. This just shows how subjective tobacco is and how people's perceptions can be based on different things.

Out of curiosity, is there any reason why Cabbies is "mixture" in the tin but "roll cut" in 250g bags? Smokes the same to me - never stop making it under any name, please, it's manna from heaven for me - but if each name needs to be registered at some expense, seems a bit unnecessary to have two names.

 

[gawithhoggarth]

Cabbies has always been Cabbies Roll Cut Mixture to give it, its full name - it is exactly the same in the tins as in the bags. Just due to artwork layout on tins versus bags its termed slightly different - says Roll Cut underneath Callies Mixture on the tins.

We are re-designing some of the artwork so may make a note of this and make sure its the same on tins and bags going forward.

You would not have to register each variation of the name - its each different blend that needs registering in the UK and then each weight you sell it in.

 

[BingBong]

Cabbies has always been Cabbies Roll Cut Mixture to give it, its full name - it is exactly the same in the tins as in the bags. Just due to artwork layout on tins versus bags its termed slightly different - says Roll Cut underneath Callies Mixture on the tins.

We are re-designing some of the artwork so may make a note of this and make sure its the same on tins and bags going forward.

You would not have to register each variation of the name - its each different blend that needs registering in the UK and then each weight you sell it in.

Thank you!

 

[Skippy B. Coyote]

As already stated the more recent Dark Birds Eye is Kendal Dark. It is the same product labelled differently. Absolutely no difference in the product. This just shows how subjective tobacco is and how people's perceptions can be based on different things.

The more I look at and smell the jars of Kendal Dark and Dark Bird's Eye I have the more I think you're right and that they are the same blend, and the difference in flavor I'm detecting might just be down minor variation between batches. In any case, thank you for the information!