Francis Scott Key Bridge in Baltimore collapses.

[Briar Lee]

The order of salvage is first restoring shipping channels, then moving the Dali, and then they’ll put the bridge back up:

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More than one week on from the disaster, two temporary channels have now been opened in the river, allowing the passage of some deeper vessels in and out of the port. A third channel for larger vessels is planned for the coming days.

Baltimore Key Bridge collapse updates: New dive video around wreckage revealed

Maryland Governor Wes Moore has indicated that the mission to reopen the port will take longer than a month following the deadly collapse of the Francis Scott Key Bridge in Baltimore

www.independent.co.uk

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My wife is concerned over the crew of the Dali being left on their ship.

I think that’s the safest and most comfortable place for them.

They’d not be very popular in Baltimore today.

 

[Briar Lee]

Why opening the channel is the foremost goal:

Rotterdam is a major seaport in the Netherlands.

The entire economic output of all the nation of the Netherlands is about one trillion dollars, and the people there are prosperous.


But just exports, alone, nothing else, the USA exports three trillion dollars a year.

And except maybe for Boeings, Harleys, Jeeps, Peterbuilts, Red Wing boots, and Zippo lighters, there’s not one thing I know of some other country couldn’t make as well as we can and cheaper.

When America makes an export sale we must deliver the goods or we’ll lose that sale to another nation.

 

[ssjones]

Well, my Roy Rogers drink cups are part of thousands of held product that can't get out of the closed port.

The MD State legislature voted in some emergency final aid funding for dock workers. My wife works for a person I can't mention here. They have not yet approved the MD budget (the legislative session ends on Monday). But, they've ear-marked many potential cuts to divert funding. Should be a prosperous year here in Maryland.

 

[VDL_Piper]

This image adds some colour to this discussion and if you were to overlay the population of the top exporters you would see some are punching way above their weight in exports. Remember it’s not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog.

 

[Briar Lee]

The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers (USACE) announced a tentative timeline to open a limited access channel that would restore safe navigation in and out of the Port of Baltimore after the Francis Scott Key Bridge collapsed, blocking the vital waterway.

The USACE said it plans to open a 280-foot-wide and 35-foot-deep channel by the end of April. The channel would provide one-way traffic in and out of the Port of Baltimore for barge container service and some vessels that move cars and farm equipment.

The USACE also said it is working to reopen the full channel, 700-foot-wide by 50-foot-deep, by the end of May to restore port access to normal capacity.

The port is the busiest in the U.S. for car shipments, handling more than 750,000 vehicles in 2023, according to data from the Maryland Port Administration. It is also the largest U.S. port by volume for handling farm and construction machinery, as well as agricultural products.

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No mention of the Dali.

It’s not going anywhere, soon.

The Dali is “anchored” in international waters, the crew is safe and well provisioned, and there are only so many crane ships and so many divers underwater to cut steel.

In due time, they’ll refloat her and salvage her cargo, and she’ll be repaired and go back in service.

As to rebuilding the bridge, as much of the current span as can be saved is likely to be saved, but the engineers have to assess the damage to what’s left standing first.

 

[Briar Lee]

This image adds some colour to this discussion and if you were to overlay the population of the top exporters you would see some are punching way above their weight in exports. Remember it’s not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog.
View attachment 300786

It just floors me, to see the United States as not only the largest oil and gas producer on the earth, but we export more oil and gas than we use.

Top 5 U.S. Exports​

As the second-largest exporter in the world—outranked only by China—total U.S. exports for 2023 climbed to $3.1 trillion, a new record, up $35.0 billion from 2022, according to Census Bureau data. According to data through December 2023, the following are the United States’ top exports by value:

1. Oil
2. Civilian Aircraft Parts
3. Gasoline and Other Fuels
4. Liquified Natural Gas (LNG) and Other Petroleum Gases
5. Passenger Vehicles

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And each year, in spite of record breaking drilling and fracking and pumping, , our oil reserves increase:

Xxxxxx
Official DOE report

We estimate that the United States had 44,418 million barrels of proved reserves of crude oil and lease condensate as of December 31, 2021—an increase of 16% from year-end 2020.

Dec 30, 2022

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And whoever would have thought the rest of the world wanted so many American vehicles?

Someday men will panic and there will be another global recession.

But until then, we really might think about digging out that Baltimore channel a little deeper.

 

[VDL_Piper]

America certainly doesn’t have the lions share of the automotive industry

 

[jpmcwjr]

<< Snipped bits out >>

No mention of the Dali.

It’s not going anywhere, soon.

The Dali is “anchored” in international waters, the crew is safe and well provisioned, and there are only so many crane ships and so many divers underwater to cut steel.

In due time, they’ll refloat her and salvage her cargo, and she’ll be repaired and go back in service.

International waters?? By what agreement/convention?

And she is not anchored, but temporarily "moored".

Finally, "re-float'? I hadn't heard she'd sunk.

Finally, finally, do you know if there are shipbuilding facilities that can handle extensive bow work on a behemoth? @ssjones!

I think my new Lambo was in one of the containers that was knocked off into the Bay...Thank heavens I could cancel the contract.

 

[Briar Lee]

International waters?? By what agreement/convention?

And she is not anchored, but temporarily "moored".

Finally, "re-float'? I hadn't heard she'd sunk.

Finally, finally, do you know if there are shipbuilding facilities that can handle extensive bow work on a behemoth? @ssjones!

I think my new Lambo was in one of the containers that was knocked off into the Bay...Thank heavens I could cancel the contract.

She’s in international waters inside the state of Maryland.

The bridge has caused her bow section to rest on the bottom. Her hull is sound, but she’s well anchored.

The first thing they’ll do is get her cargo off, which the terminal is right there, to unload her.

A 100,000 ton ship has one diesel and one screw. The authorities on shore will go over why it failed, and if it can be fixed in Baltimore it will be.

Those ships are worth over a hundred million dollars.

When she’s deemed seaworthy enough to sail I’ll bet they use tugs to take her out to the ocean, anyway.

She was built somewhere and somewhere there’s a dry dock big enough to fix her, if they need a dry dock.

If there’s no hull damage the repairs can be done in a lot more locations, maybe even Baltimore.

 

[Chasing Embers]

Seems the same ship collided with a shipping pier in Belgium in 2016.

 

[Streeper541]

She’s in international waters inside the state of Maryland.

With all due respect... No.

International waters begin 12 nautical miles off the shoreline of the US Coast. Inland waters are any waters within that baseline, including the states, ports, channels & navigable waterways.

The ship is firmly, 100% within US territorial waters.

 

[Briar Lee]

With all due respect... No.

International waters begin 12 nautical miles off the shoreline of the US Coast. Inland waters are any waters within that baseline, including the states, ports, channels & navigable waterways.

The ship is firmly, 100% within US territorial waters.

The territorial jurisdiction of the USA ends at 12 miles, and it’s 200 miles for an exclusive economic zone.

But can you imagine if the mayor of Baltimore could send a city cop out there and arrest the captain of the Dali?

Or if some bottom feeding billboard advertising lawyers could run to a friendly judge and get a judge to impound the Dali?

The port of Baltimore wouldn’t be as busy as it is today.

Legally, for legal purposes, the Dali is in international waters in a shipping channel and all her crew are foreign nationals.

The only court that can litigate legal issues concerning the Dali is

Admiralty Cases | District of Maryland | United States District Court

www.mdd.uscourts.gov

Every civilized maritime nation on earth has had similar admiralty courts for over a thousand years.

Or they couldn’t have trade.

Leaving that crew on the ship takes away one more headache in the salvage process.

And let me tell you, if I was on an American flagged ship in a harbor in Siri Lanka that had knocked over a bridge, I’d want to stay on that ship.

 

[Briar Lee]

Seems the same ship collided with a shipping pier in Belgium in 2016.

Yes, and who owned Dali then, and who was the local pilot, and who was her captain in 2016?

To allow her to dock, or leave port, the Port Authority in Baltimore requires maritime insurance.

Insurance will pay for the bridge and salvage, pay for the ship and cargo. How much and who has to indemnify the insurance company will take years.

As to criminal charges, Maryland would do well to remeber the captain of the Exxon Valdez.

Joseph Hazelwood - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Streeper541]

Legally, for legal purposes, the Dali is in international waters in a shipping channel and all her crew are foreign nationals.

That's not how that works. Trust me. There's more to it that that. The maritime industry is a funny thing...
I don't need to get into a lengthy discussion about it though.

 

[ssjones]

Good news/bad news here:

Patchwork international regulations govern cargo ships like the one that toppled Baltimore bridge

Critics say the patchwork system of safety regulations governing massive cargo ships like the one that toppled a Baltimore bridge this week can allow shippers to skirt oversight.

apnews.com

 

[Briar Lee]

That's not how that works. Trust me. There's more to it that that. The maritime industry is a funny thing...
I don't need to get into a lengthy discussion about it though.

When I was in law school, they gave us a ten second class on Admiralty Law.

Don’t do it.

Refer it to an Admiralty lawyer.

Good news/bad news here:

Patchwork international regulations govern cargo ships like the one that toppled Baltimore bridge

Critics say the patchwork system of safety regulations governing massive cargo ships like the one that toppled a Baltimore bridge this week can allow shippers to skirt oversight.

apnews.com

Given the huge amount of freight delivered around the world by some 90,000 ships of all sizes, relatively few accidents are reported, according to the International Chamber of Shipping coalition of ship owners. Insurer Allianz Global said only 38 vessels were lost in 2022, which is down significantly from the 1990s, when more than 200 ships were routinely lost each year.

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Geezus!

I suppose 38 ocean going ships going down a year is quite the improvement over 200 foundering, but still —-

 

[jpmcwjr]

Strident post and clever quip deleted.

Keep this thread to the Dali, Key bridge, navigation, tugs, murky water, depth of channel, etc.

In other words, no more on international trade, other cargo ports, etc., in this thread.

 

[gubbyduffer]

Strident post and clever quip deleted.

Keep this thread to the Dali, Key bridge, navigation, tugs, murky water, depth of channel, etc.

In other words, no more on international trade, other cargo ports, etc., in this thread.

Nevermind. Can we mention the inadequate protection measures?
https://www.npr.org/2024/04/04/1242605876/baltimore-bridge-collapse-dolphins

 

[Briar Lee]

Nevermind. Can we mention the inadequate protection measures?
https://www.npr.org/2024/04/04/1242605876/baltimore-bridge-collapse-dolphins

Design work on the Key Bridge began in 1972. The entire project is 11 miles long, what is considered a bridge is 1.6 miles, and near the shore was a quarter mile steel truss between two huge supports.

Under the truss span is a river in a tidal estuary.

The currents and tides and potential storms there are quite challenging to maintaining a fifty foot deep shipping channel.

And it means whatever an engineer puts on either side of a support has to withstand the Atlantic Ocean.



Most ships in 1972 displaced less, but even then the really big ones could be 100,000 tons. There is a naval station in Baltimore and in 1972 the Iowa class battleships or current sized nuclear aircraft carriers could hit those supports.

For reasons engineers will explain, ths protection scheme for the supports were “dolphins” about 500 feet in front of the supports on both sides.

When one dolphin was struck in 1980 the dolphin worked. The design is like a bumper in an old bumper pool table. Unless the ship hits it dead on, the dolphin diverts the ship from hitting the support head on.

All those engineering plans and design studies may still exist. Young engineers in 1972 are still living.

Show them the photo, of how a 100,000 ton vessel with only one screw and one engine, lost power and drifted at the perfect angle to narrowly miss the dolphin and strike the support dead center, and they’d likely say how, could we have imagined that?

 

[Briar Lee]

A third temporary channel in the Port of Baltimore opened late Friday, allowing more vessels and goods to flow into the crucial shipping center following the collapse of the Francis Scott Key Bridge in March.

The passageway was opened by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers (USACE) as it continues to clear away the wreckage of the Dali, the container ship that collided with the bridge, as well as the twisting metal and chunks of concrete from the bridge itself. As The National Desk reported Friday, USACE, Coast Guard, and other responding crews have been able to remove around 120 containers from the wreck of the Dali, and hope to finally move the ship after taking away 140. 3,000 tons of bridge steel has also been removed from the port.

Port of Baltimore opens third temporary channel for vessels following Key Bridge collapse

13wham.com

No longer the top of the page in the news, this last temporary channel is the last step before opening the entire harbor again.

When the shipping channel is entirely opened as it was before and the Dali is moved to offload salavage cargo, they’ll fully assess how much of the old bridge can be used.

One rule change to consider is single screw single engine ships must have tugs from the ocean to the dock.