Charatan Size and Shapes Observation/Question

[Celius]

Been looking for a nice smaller Charatan straight billiard estate pipe for a while and I noticed one thing,
mostly Charatan pipes are of a bigger size (group 5) and have saddle stems.

Why is that the case? Were saddle stems most common?

EDIT: Fixed Capitalization in Title - Bob

 

[sablebrush52]

Been looking for a nice smaller Charatan straight billiard estate pipe for a while and I noticed one thing,
mostly Charatan pipes are of a bigger size (group 5) and have saddle stems.

Why is that the case? Were saddle stems most common?

That's true for the later product. The early Charatan pipes were small classic shapes that featured tapered stems as well as saddle stems. These early Charatans are extremely rare.

 

[Celius]

That's true for the later product. The early Charatan pipes were small classic shapes that featured tapered stems as well as saddle stems. These early Charatans are extremely rare.

By later ones, you mean Lane Era?
Yes its a shame that there are not many pre Lane Charatans out there

 

[sablebrush52]

By later ones, you mean Lane Era?
Yes its a shame that there are not many pre Lane Charatans out there

Yes, Lane Era.

 

[peregrinus]

They are out there. I have a several Charatan that are classic shapes and without the bothersome and ironically named double comfort stems. I picked this Supreme up a few years ago for $100.00. Cleaned it up a little, but never have smoked it, not sure why, perhaps I didn’t want to be disappointed if it didn’t live up to the promise. Too often I find the most beautiful pipes are seldom the best smoking...

 

[Celius]

View attachment 8724
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They are out there. I have a several Charatan that are classic shapes and with out the bothersome and ironically named double comfort stems. I picked this Supreme up a few years ago for $100.00. Cleaned it up a little, but never have smoked it, not sure why, perhaps I didn’t to be disappointed if it didn’t live up to the promise. Too often I find the most beautiful pipes are seldom the best smoking...

Thats a great looking pipe.
Is this Lane Era?

 

[peregrinus]

Is this Lane Era?

I don’t really know. No Lane stamp, early Lane or possibly pre-Lane?
@sablebrush52, any idea what era?

 

[sablebrush52]

I don’t really know. No Lane stamp, early Lane or possibly pre-Lane?
@sablebrush52, any idea what era?

The member here who is most likely able to give you an accurate dating is Ken Barnes. Lack of a Lane stamp doesn't tell you anything because the Lane stamp wasn't used on pipes for the British market. That is a Supreme Supreme.

 

[Celius]

I don’t really know. No Lane stamp, early Lane or possibly pre-Lane?
@sablebrush52, any idea what era?

Forgot to ask, what group size aproximately is the pipe?

 

[peregrinus]

It’s a more traditional Brit. sized pipe. Comparable to most DH group 4’s.

 

[kenbarnes]

This is from the 1951 catalogue. It shows this shape 12. The stamping may be a little smaller in those days and the shape number stamped near the fit continued until about 1963 I think - not sure? I am pretty certain that this was a Reuben era piece and I reckon this was, at the time, the highest quality they made. The 102 is larger than this one and the 42 was the Giant Billiard

 

[Celius]

This is from the 1951 catalogue. It shows this shape 12. The stamping may be a little smaller in those days and the shape number stamped near the fit continued until about 1963 I think - not sure? I am pretty certain that this was a Reuben era piece and I reckon this was, at the time, the highest quality they made. The 102 is larger than this one and the 42 was the Giant Billiard
View attachment 9196

Thank you for your input Ken!
Very nice. Its very difficult to find the Rueben Era pipes nowadays, and 100 Dollar would ve a fantastic price.

 

[dmcmtk]

Shape 42 (not the greatest pictures). The pipe with the sterling band (covering the shape number) and replacement stem is a Selected; it's grp 3 in size.

 

[kenbarnes]

Shape 42 (not the greatest pictures). The pipe with the sterling band (covering the shape number) and replacement stem is a Selected; it's grp 3 in size.

The shape 42 was a rare shape at that time as the size of block needed was hard to come by and the difficulty in getting these large pipes clean.

 

[peregrinus]

This is from the 1951 catalogue. It shows this shape 12. The stamping may be a little smaller in those days and the shape number stamped near the fit continued until about 1963 I think - not sure? I am pretty certain that this was a Reuben era piece and I reckon this was, at the time, the highest quality they made

Thank you very much for the research.

 

[ssjones]

Small Charatans are rare. The 109 Bulldog is a smaller standard shape and pop up with some frequency.



The 08 is about a Group 4 size



Some other smaller shapes

 

[ssjones]

 

[ssjones]

2109 (later version I believe), Special grade below. I sold my 109 Make above, thinking I was upgrading with this pipe. But, it turned out to be a terrible smoker, and I never bonded with it.

 

[oldgeezersmoker]

42’s, 43’s and 44’s (Billiard, Dublin and Bent) were avidly sought fare in the 1980’s and 1990’s, particularly in Selected and Supreme. Dennis Congos has a fabulous group of 44’s, and freehands that are more or less in the 44 shape. Any Selected or Supreme with a shape number would draw attention then and has likely been well preserved over the years.

Lower grade shape numbered pieces weren’t in that much collector demand, but smaller classic shapes such as billiards, Dublin’s, pots, etc., were fairly common in Special, Perfection and Belvedere grades. I imagine the passing years haven’t been kind to that supply.

 

[dmcmtk]

Here's shape 47 the Ritz. A Selected, and a wonderful smoker...Super Duper.