California Customers at P&C...It Has Begun.

[docpierce]

It certainly isn't going to get any easier. But how often do most people order? Once per week? Once per month? Having to sign for a package or, what horror, you have to go to the post office to pick up a package. If you order from P&C, just feel lucky that you get it at all.

Not often. But I thought I'd let the community know that something has changed in the state laws.

 

[bullet08]

Living in NC, I don't really worry too much about tobacco getting to me. I still see tobacco growing in fields drive down to a friend's place.

 

[Akousticplyr]

Living in NC, I don't really worry too much about tobacco getting to me. I still see tobacco growing in fields drive down to a friend's place.

Be careful. According to the package warnings, apparently tobacco can kill you. It might jump into the road in front of you and cause an accident.....

 

[docpierce]

Be careful. According to the package warnings, apparently tobacco can kill you. It might jump into the road in front of you and cause an accident.....

I do believe I have seen that!

 

[sablebrush52]

No notice regarding the requirement to provide P&C with an ID to keep on file, but got a notice of attempted delivery from UPS. Usually I get an advanced notice and sign into UPS to handle it, but did not receive the usual email.

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

Living in NC, I don't really worry too much about tobacco getting to me. I still see tobacco growing in fields drive down to a friend's place.

That is true but at the same time, North Carolina had some of the most restrictive anti smoking laws of anywhere. Try finding a smoking hotel room to rent in Raleigh or Charlotte.

 

[litup]

If anyone's interested, here's the majority of the text of the bill with the emphasis (in bold) done by me. I didn't include the whole text because it goes over the character limit for a post.

SB 39, Hill. Tobacco products.
Existing law, the Stop Tobacco Access to Kids Enforcement (STAKE) Act, prohibits the sale, distribution, or nonsale distribution of tobacco products, as defined, directly or indirectly to any person under 21 years of age through the United States Postal Service or through any other public or private postal or package delivery service. Existing law requires a person selling or distributing tobacco products directly to a consumer through the United States Postal Service or by another postal or package delivery service to comply with specified age-verification policies and deliver only to the consumer’s verified mailing or billing address, as applicable. Existing law authorizes enforcing agencies to assess civil penalties for violations of the STAKE Act.

This bill would additionally require sellers, distributors, and nonsale distributors to deliver tobacco products only in conspicuously marked containers, as specified, and to obtain the signature of a person 21 years of age or older before delivering a tobacco product. The bill would allow a person to designate an address for delivery that is different from the person’s mailing or billing address, if the person’s mailing or billing address has been verified in accordance with specified provisions.

DIGEST KEY
Vote: majority Appropriation: no Fiscal Committee: yes Local Program: no


THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA DO ENACT AS FOLLOWS:

SECTION 1.
Section 22963 of the Business and Professions Code is amended to read:

22963.
(a) The sale, distribution, or nonsale distribution of tobacco products directly or indirectly to any person under 21 years of age through the United States Postal Service or through any other public or private postal or package delivery service at locations, including, but not limited to, public mailboxes and mailbox stores, is prohibited.

(b) Any person selling or distributing, or engaging in the nonsale distribution of, tobacco products directly to a consumer in the state through the United States Postal Service or by any other public or private postal or package delivery service, including orders placed by mail, telephone, facsimile transmission, or the internet, shall comply with the following provisions:

(1) (A) Before enrolling a person as a customer, or distributing or selling, or engaging in the nonsale distribution of, the tobacco product through any of these means, the distributor or seller shall verify that the purchaser or recipient of the product is 21 years of age or older. The distributor or seller shall attempt to match the name, address, and date of birth provided by the customer to information contained in records in a database of individuals whose age has been verified to be 21 years or older by reference to an appropriate database of government records kept by the distributor, a direct marketing firm, or any other entity. In the case of a sale, the distributor or seller shall also verify that the billing address on the check or credit card offered for payment by the purchaser matches the address listed in the database.

(B) If the seller, distributor, or nonsale distributor, is unable to verify that the purchaser or recipient is 21 years of age or older pursuant to subparagraph (A), the seller, distributor, or nonsale distributor shall require the customer or recipient to submit an age-verification kit consisting of an attestation signed by the customer or recipient that the customer or recipient is 21 years of age or older and a copy of a valid form of government identification. For the purposes of this section, a valid form of government identification includes a driver’s license, state identification card, passport, an official naturalization or immigration document, such as an alien registration receipt card (commonly known as a “green card”) or an immigrant visa, or military identification. In the case of a sale, the distributor or seller shall also verify that the billing address on the check or credit card provided by the consumer matches the address listed in the form of government identification.

(2) In the case of a sale, the distributor or seller shall impose a two-carton minimum on each order of cigarettes, and shall require payment for the purchase of any tobacco product to be made by personal check of the purchaser or the purchaser’s credit card. No money order or cash payment shall be received or permitted. The distributor or seller shall submit to each credit card acquiring company with which it has credit card sales identification information in an appropriate form and format so that the words “tobacco product” may be printed in the purchaser’s credit card statement when a purchase of a tobacco product is made by credit card payment.

(3) In the case of a sale, the distributor or seller shall make a telephone call after 5 p.m. to the purchaser confirming the order prior to shipping the tobacco products. The telephone call may be a person-to-person call or a recorded message. The distributor or seller is not required to speak directly with a person and may leave a message on an answering machine or by voice mail.

(4) (A) The nonsale distributor shall deliver the tobacco product to the recipient’s verified mailing address, or in the case of a sale, the seller or distributor shall deliver the tobacco product to the purchaser’s verified billing address on the check or credit card used for payment.

(B) In the case of a nonsale, a recipient may designate an alternative address for delivery, if the recipient’s mailing address has been verified in accordance with this section.

(C) In the case of a sale, a purchaser may designate an alternative address for delivery, if the purchaser’s billing address has been verified in accordance with this section.

(D) A delivery described under this section shall not be permitted to any post office box.

(5) The tobacco product shall be delivered only in a container that is conspicuously labeled with the words: “CONTAINS TOBACCO PRODUCTS: SIGNATURE OF PERSON 21 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER REQUIRED FOR DELIVERY.”

(6) Upon the delivery of the tobacco product to the recipient’s or purchaser’s address, the seller, distributor, or nonsale distributor shall obtain the signature of a person 21 years of age or older before completing the delivery.

 

[3rdguy]

You never get a sideways look about smoking in Kentucky.

That is because they are crosseyed?
<ducks>

 

[cosmicfolklore]

We could treat this all like assault weapons. What if we all just decided to no longer refer to it as "tobacco"? We could call it nadillydally for from now on. Then no worries, right?

 

[jpmcwjr]

From the above.

The part I have bolded below must have a purpose for effing us over more, but not sure what effect it will have. Next, are they not gonna specify on a CC exactly what personal battery operated toys madame orders on line?

(2) In the case of a sale, the distributor or seller shall impose a two-carton minimum on each order of cigarettes, and shall require payment for the purchase of any tobacco product to be made by personal check of the purchaser or the purchaser’s credit card. No money order or cash payment shall be received or permitted. The distributor or seller shall submit to each credit card acquiring company with which it has credit card sales identification information in an appropriate form and format so that the words “tobacco product” may be printed in the purchaser’s credit card statement when a purchase of a tobacco product is made by credit card payment.

 

[docpierce]

From the above.

The part I have bolded below must have a purpose for effing us over more, but not sure what effect it will have. Next, are they not gonna specify on a CC exactly what personal battery operated toys madame orders on line?

What is the point of such laws, again? I'm forgetting. It's almost like some kind of frog in a crock pot.

 

[tkcolo]

In rural Colorado, 80% of all UPS packages go to USPS anyway. No physical delivery, so we go to the post office anyway. No matter what, you are standing in line.

2 day Amazon shipping usually is 7-9 days for me. Postal workers are pissed at UPS making more work for them, so they will hold packages in the post office for 2-3 days before we get a package notice. If you have the cajones to ask about a package that tracking shows to be at the post office with no package notice, they will sit on it another few days for good measure.

 

[litup]

From the above.

The part I have bolded below must have a purpose for effing us over more, but not sure what effect it will have. Next, are they not gonna specify on a CC exactly what personal battery operated toys madame orders on line?

My understanding is that some credit card companies have refused to process transactions for tobacco products. So . . . basically this will make it harder to pay for and receive tobacco. It's another step to eradicating tobacco without actually making it illegal.

 

[Chasing Embers]

That is because they are crosseyed?
<ducks>

Yep done here.

 

[bullet08]

That is true but at the same time, North Carolina had some of the most restrictive anti smoking laws of anywhere. Try finding a smoking hotel room to rent in Raleigh or Charlotte.

True. But that's for bigger cities. Drive out of any town and most don't really care. Lot of transplants, like myself, here. Been in NC for 40 yrs and just getting comfortable.

 

[dontbeaburleyman]

They're just encouraging people on their way to the post office to stop at any street corner and purchase marijuana (legally or otherwise). Improves the economy.

This state is unbelievable.

 

[diamondback]

I thought that was when you were abducted by the Black Frigate.

Hey, whoa! What happens concerning the Black Frigate is best spoken in hushed tones.

 

[sablebrush52]

Got my package with no issue. I did notice that the package had a label on it stating that the package "contains tobacco products, requiring a signature of a person 21 years or older" which I hadn't seen before, or don't recall seeing before.
All of the ignorant drooling slobbering ignoRANT California hating comments aside. especially the hilariously cretinous imbecilic thunderingly dumb-as-a-plank "People's State Of" comments about an economy that is the 5th largest on the face of the earth, the state has significant problems that nobody is dealing with and they're one hell of a lot more significant than having to sign for a delivery of tobacco to anybody who isn't totally brain dead.

Expect your states to enact similar laws. For example, states in the Midwest are cooperating to track tobacco sales in order to enforce the collection of state excise taxes. Enjoy your worthless and false sense of superiority while you can.

 

[docpierce]

Got my package with no issue.
I did notice that the package had a label on it stating that the package "contains tobacco products, requiring a signature of a person 21 years or older" which I hadn't seen before, or don't recall seeing before.
All of the ignorant drooling slobbering ignoRANT California hating comments aside. especially the hilariously cretinous imbecilic thunderingly dumb-as-a-plank "People's State Of" comments about an economy that is the 5th largest on the face of the earth, the state has significant problems that nobody is dealing with and they're one hell of a lot more significant than having to sign for a delivery of tobacco to anybody who isn't totally brain dead.

Expect your states to enact similar laws. For example, states in the Midwest are cooperating to track tobacco sales in order to enforce the collection of state excise taxes. Enjoy your worthless and false sense of superiority while you can.

Well Sablebrush,

I got my package yesterday also. No stickers and everything was intact. But, I cant help but to think that this is the shape of things to come. Each increase in oversight, each in change in the law, by itself is slight. But looking at all the changes in aggregate we can see the drift. It's pretty easy to foresee a time when.... well, you know the rest of this monologue.
I agree with you that our state has more than our share of troubles.- But it is beautiful still and (as you point out) it does contribute a heck of alot of $ into the national economy. If I'm not mistaken people are getting cranky and frankly scared of all the changes engulfing the nation these days. People see what has happened here (crime, high taxes, kooky laws) as the fault of Progressive, well meaning SF types . Perhaps folks from nearby states see all the people leaving California in droves; and voting , and overwhelming local values. Who can blame them. Taxes going up to pay for things they don't believe in. Hello, Virginia, I'm lookin' at you.

I can tell you that almost everyone I know over 50 has discussed selling their house and leaving CA to transplant "safer" or cheaper areas in out of state. Nice as Californians may be,, they can't help bringing their progressive values with them and voting in their new homes. Rinse and repeat. People notice a pattern so they get mad and rant.
Nobody doesnt like the old Ca of the Beach Boys,Gidget and Kramer's of Beverly Hills. It 's Jerry Brown , Crap and syringes on the sidewalk they dont want in their towns, IMHO.

 

[Akousticplyr]

Got my package with no issue. I did notice that the package had a label on it stating that the package "contains tobacco products, requiring a signature of a person 21 years or older" which I hadn't seen before, or don't recall seeing before.
All of the ignorant drooling slobbering ignoRANT California hating comments aside. especially the hilariously cretinous imbecilic thunderingly dumb-as-a-plank "People's State Of" comments about an economy that is the 5th largest on the face of the earth, the state has significant problems that nobody is dealing with and they're one hell of a lot more significant than having to sign for a delivery of tobacco to anybody who isn't totally brain dead.

Expect your states to enact similar laws. For example, states in the Midwest are cooperating to track tobacco sales in order to enforce the collection of state excise taxes. Enjoy your worthless and false sense of superiority while you can.

I coined the People’s Republic crack. I was joking, of course. No offense to your home state. In fact, as a Resident of the bizarre and imbecilic Planet Florida I can attest we give California a run for its money on weird, stupid and dumb.

I’m definitely in a glass house as I type this on my tablet (which if it or ANY product is for sale in California- also has a sticker on it that says “California wants you to know that this thing -object- widget -gizmo whatever etc.you are holding- using -looking at - walking past- probably causes cancer.”). I literally saw this sticker on a Glock handgun case.

So you have to kinda admit, California did put the “kick me” sign on its back for some of this ribbing.

Truce?