Asked to show ID/proof of age at local B&M shop

[tbradsim1]

If that's part of his job, show it, reminds me of a Movie called Guarding Tess, ex president wife gets kidnapped, found, took to hospital, happy ending, going home she's in the hall and aide says I have to wheel you out, she gets on her high horse, aide says Mam it's my job, it's the rules, Seceret Service man eyeballs her and says Get in The Damn Chair. Man at smoke shop was doing his job, though I admit it would have struck me also. Rules, Rules,Rules

 

[brian64]

@Warren: I take it then that where you live tobacco products are not sold in grocery stores, for example? If so, are you in the USA?
Just another observation: If the clerk had said something like, "yeah, I know it's ridiculous but I'm required to do it now or I could lose my job", then I suspect the OP would have complied. I probably would have. But it's the mindlessness of the attitude displayed (assuming the exchange occurred as described in the OP) that I could not abide, and I would simply leave and never do business there again.
But that's just me...I guess I'm like Winston...I'd have to be physically tortured before I'd agree that 2+2 equals 5.

 

[raevans]

Warren, in my State, it's a 75 dollar fine for a first offense and that goes against the individual. Second offense is 150 dollars and that goes against both the individual and the store/company. Second offense also gets noted and the store is put on a "watch list". It pretty much means that they will be tested on an ongoing basis. Third offense can get a court summons.
**Please note that the following is just an opinion and not directed at any person in particular**
Although it is not a law that everyone must be carded. It is the policy of many places. If I had a new employee, they would have zero "discretionary" leeway. As a new employee, I would expect them to follow the companies policies and procedures to the letter. If, as a new employee, they took it upon themselves to decide what should be followed and what they can alter, I would wonder what other decisions they were making on their own that could potentially hurt the business.
This has definitely turned out to be a very interesting thread.....

 

[oldmansmoking]

Dear kirkland
I sympathise but we have several things to concider.
1. The employee was going through his routine without intelligent thought.

2. As others have said maybe they have been fined and now ask all to show ID, taking the responsibility away from the employee.

3. Take it as a laugh

4. Don't stop shopping there because of one mentally challenged employee.
I know it's easier said then done, but try to put it behind you and not let it ruin your shopping for the future.

 

[cally454]

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[woodsroad]

Pappymac sez:

woodsroad - if your drivers license has a magnetic strip on the back and the swipe it, it's probably to verify that the information on the front of your DL matches the information on the back. This aids in identifying counterfeit identification.

Perhaps, but it also allows them to capture this information. My DL info (and who knows what info is encoded on the mag strip) is not for general consumption and distribution.
cally454 sez:

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I agree, completely. Well said.

 

[warren]

oldmansmoking: The law here doesn't allow the owner to take the responsibility from the employee. Both the owner and the employee are assigned such by law.
brian64: Where I live, Anchorage, grocery stores may sell tobacco products. Of course all of the employees on a premises where liquor/tobacco products are to be at least twenty-one years of age. Safeway maintains separate premises where liquor and or tobacco products are sold. Smaller entities, "stop and robs", sell tobacco on the same premises and do not employ kids as "stockers" and "baggers."
We "old timers" often refer to the lower 49 states as "outside" or "America" and not always in facetiously.
aldecaker: Getting tobacco use banned is indeed a "crusade" to many. They see providing children with tobacco products as "abuse" little different from any other type of child abuse. Hence the invoking of, "for the children", in many of their campaigns.

 

[brian64]

Where I live, Anchorage, grocery stores may sell tobacco products.

Smaller entities, "stop and robs", sell tobacco on the same premises

Ok, I see. I assume then you misspoke when you said previously:

Here you must be of age to enter a store selling either liquor or tobacco products.

Because I think it's safe to assume that underage people are allowed in grocery stores and convenience stores...even there.
So again, there are a lot of apples and oranges being discussed in this thread. I point back once again to the fact that the OP was required to show ID just to be in the store...NOT at the point of sale.
IMO, that is total bullshit. I doubt very seriously that the law requires that there...especially regarding a 60 year old. And if it's just store policy, then again, I sure as hell would not do business there.

 

[raevans]

Brian64, I believe that Kirkland said that he was greeted when he entered the store. It wasn't until he started to go into the separate tobacco room that ID was requested, (I use the word requested very loosely as I don't know how the clerk asked. It could have been in a rude,curt,snarky manner which would be enough to upset pretty much anyone)

 

[jefff]

I have not been bothered by being carded since I was 21.
There are so many things to be offended about these days, for me, this isn't one of them

 

[aquadoc]

Most online tobacco shops stop you at the gate for verification and most have asked me for a copy of my photo DL for the first time I buy. It is what it is. I agree with Jeff and many others... No biggie.

 

[kirkland]

Staying on track, as I posted earlier, the law here in Colorado has a cut-off point for carding at age 35. From there it is wide open for complete discretion by the the owner//worker. I just find it a bit odd that a 40-50 year old B&M worker can't tell if a guy who is actually 60 (and looks 60-65) when the law says looking 35 and over doesn't need to be carded. But hey, common sense, common judgement seems a rarity in this brave new world. And remember the New Murica' motto "just following orders." Now where have I heard that before ?
Behavior conditioning and operant conditoning are very interesting topics to explore. I also like the work of Joseph Goebbels (Hitler's Minister of Propaganda) But that's for another discussion forum, not here.
And BTW, Brian is right, I just entered the store and headed to the pipe tobacco area. It was then I was carded and I never purchased anything. I just strolled in.
But to keep things light I will say this. I'd gladly show them my ID if they'd get some Penzance in their shop. And I'd wear a suit-coat too.

 

[ashdigger]

Okay, I got the vibe of you "concerns" earlier, but now you've slipped off the cliff. Good luck in your bunker.

 

[kirkland]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmzsWxPLIOo

 

[brian64]

Brian64, I believe that Kirkland said that he was greeted when he entered the store. It wasn't until he started to go into the separate tobacco room that ID was requested

Yes, to be precise, he indicated it was a "separate pipe tobacco room". But I did not take that to mean that all of the tobacco in the store was in a separate isolated area. If tobacconist shops have to do that now, it's really getting more and more absurd.

 

[surlysoul]

I use the same B&M as the OP and to be fair they have taken a very aggressive approach to this and usually make sur you know it is the F D As fault. I don't mind getting carded, but the way they go about it is annoying and I have quit going there.

 

[kirkland]

Probably guys like Warren and a few others are right. In the very near future we'll see a locked door at the B&M's entrance and you're only allowed inside by swiping your DL or some other gov-issued card. And it appears some online sales are already requesting a copy of your DL as well. I order from 4 Noggins and never had to fax over ID to Rich.

 

[kirkland]

Surlysoul quoted: "I use the same B&M as the OP and to be fair they have taken a very aggressive approach to this and usually make sur you know it is the F D As fault. I don't mind getting carded, but the way they go about it is annoying and I have quit going there."
Most interesting, surlysoul. Honestly I'm a pretty easy going guy but when I get fired up it's for good reason. The worker guy was pretty much in my face (invading my space may be a better word) and repeated the same "order/demand" twice in the same exact words...scrufty-like and his voice tone was demeaning. He never mentioned to me it was the FDA's fault either. I was raised in NY and I'm pretty thick-skinned but this guy was an A-1 ass.
In the past, there was always an 40-ish gal there who I believe was the owner or part owner and she was always nice and cheery when I walked in. So it was a bit overwhelming to be treated so differently. It's always been a place I looked forward to going into, scope out all the goodies and leave with a few tins of tobacco.

 

[warren]

brian64: Got me there. Under 21s can enter the grocery stores and drug stores where tobacco is sold. The product has to be behind the counter. But, there is no restriction yet with regard to vending tobacco products in the grocery stores excepting under 21s from ever handling the product. Tobacco only stores are the same as liquor stores, must be 21 to cross the threshold.
Mea culpa! I stand at the bottom of your steps, hat in hand, pushing dirt with my toe, unable to look you in the eye as I apologize for misinforming you.

 

[brian64]

Tobacco only stores are the same as liquor stores, must be 21 to cross the threshold.

Ah, this is what I was not understanding. I had no idea that tobacconist shops were over 21 only. Perhaps it's always been this way for all I know. I don't get out much. I still say though that if a 60 year old crosses the threshold, no ID beyond a casual glance should be necessary.

Mea culpa! I stand at the bottom of your steps, hat in hand, pushing dirt with my toe, unable to look you in the eye as I apologize for misinforming you.

That's ok Warren, even you are allowed to be wrong once in a while (as long as it doesn't happen too often). Actually you weren't wrong...I just needed clarification...which is something I find myself often in need of in this world.

Most online tobacco shops stop you at the gate for verification and most have asked me for a copy of my photo DL for the first time I buy.

In the case of on-line vendors it's actually understandable if they require some form of proof of age...because they cannot see you. That's the whole point...that's why carding an obviously older person when you are face to face with them is absurd.

Behavior conditioning and operant conditoning are very interesting topics to explore.

Very interesting indeed...a vast subject. And even though most people are oblivious to it, it's been going on for a very long time on a very large scale. Normalcy Bias is now a mass epidemic.