Anyone Ever Use This “Hard Rubber Deoxidizer” On Your Stems?
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I'd want to review a SDS (Safety Data Sheet) prior to using it on something that goes in the mouth.
Short answer: It's functionally stain, NOT a de-oxidizer.
This "getting back to black" subject really should be made a sticky.
www.fountainpennetwork.com
This "getting back to black" subject really should be made a sticky.
Reblackening Hard Rubber
Hi all, I own some HR pens, and some among them are fading a little bit. I have read about the re-blackening process, the polishing method, and so. I know that both of them most probably mean that you are altering the pen (by either removing material from it or by chemically altering the surface ...
www.fountainpennetwork.com
I make the deoxidizer. It is made to remove the oxidation and is not a stain. There is another product that is a stain but it is not this oneShort answer: It's functionally stain, NOT a de-oxidizer.
This "getting back to black" subject really should be made a sticky.
Reblackening Hard Rubber
Hi all, I own some HR pens, and some among them are fading a little bit. I have read about the re-blackening process, the polishing method, and so. I know that both of them most probably mean that you are altering the pen (by either removing material from it or by chemically altering the surface ...
Can you supply the above mentioned Safety Data Sheet for the product? The detail mentions wearing gloves and eye protection while using it. We put these hard plastic stems in our mouths, so that is concerning to me. Was there a particular item the product is targeting?
Ah, bifocals on, I see that in the ad. That's even more worrisome then for pipes. I gather rubber pens do not lend themselves to be as easily sanded to remove oxidation like a pipe stem.
The Vulcanite and Cumberland ones clean just like a stem. Maybe different types of rubber are also used?
This "magic formula" silliness absolutely never ends.
Remove is not the semantic equivalent of change back, you realize. Or maybe you don't?
--- If the dimensions of the oxidized object remain the same after using your product, it is a stain/coloring agent.
--- If the oxidized object is smaller in size after using your product, it is a material remover that targets oxidized material. Functionally no different from a variety of things ranging from liquid bleach to metal scrapers to sandpaper.
This bottle of stuff you are selling is, like the many dozens that have come before it for many decades, either one or the other. There is no "C".
If the first, you are being outright dishonest. Charcoal cannot be changed back into wood, or a rusted car fender made whole again. The physical world does not work that way.
If the second, you are trying to sell something that's worth pennies for many dollars with an approach intended to confuse people enough that they'll finally say, "What the Hell, I guess I'll just have to try it for myself."
I don't know anything about pens, I just meant it might be more difficult to sand all the nooks and crannies of a pen, versus a pipe stem (with only a logo to worry about).
I bought some and used it. It does softens and brings the oxidation to the surface so it can be easily removed. The instructions I've read says to wipe the stem down with mineral oil after using the deoxidizer. Instead of using a soft cloth, I worked over the stem using micromesh pads and then cleaned the airway with pipe cleaners dipped in grain alcohol to remove any chemical residue.
I was happy with the results and didn't find the stems to have any chemical aftertastes when smoking them.
I was happy with the results and didn't find the stems to have any chemical aftertastes when smoking them.
I've used it on an unsmoked Lindberg pipe from 1927. It did remove a lot of discoloration. Over a day sitting in the goo, a cloud of brown came off of the stem, leaving it quite black, but also completely matte. At some point I'll polish it up.
First of all, I am happy to discuss this. In fact I think this is an issue that needs to be discussed as there are no clear guidelines for restoring materials like hard rubber. You are of course welcome to your opinion and while I think it is incorrect it is your opinion. Trying to say things about my character are truly not necessary.
At any rate. Rubber begins to deteriorate from day one of production. This is an on-going process that for the moment at least can not be stopped. There are a number of things that cause rubber to oxidize. UV light, high humidity, high temperature, oxygen and as well as certain gases such as ozone.
UV light is certainly one of the factors that can cause rubber lighten over time.
However, it is the chemical reaction that the off-gassing sulfur as well as the other things like fillers has
with moisture that create the thin layer on the surface that we see. These combined factors will discolor the surface grayish green to brown and cause the material to break down quickly.
So, technically, you are right. This product is removing that build-up on the surface which was sulfur that was in the hard rubber. That being said, it is not necessarily removing surface material. Underneath this layer the rubber is often black. Also, this surface oxidation for the most part does not run extremely deep. When I created my products I wanted to be sure that the hard rubber was not being chemically attacked. Oxyclean as well as Beach are very indiscriminate as they will not only remove the oxidation but will also start to harm the healthy rubber underneath. Often the oxidation will also re-harden and sanding is required. My product is only removing the surface oxidation. Recently, I have added a product to remove slightly deeper oxidation as well but I am very careful to not cause deep surface damage. I also use enzymes to break the oxidation down. These enzymes are not destructive like so of their chemical counter-parts. Once this is finished often very little polishing is needed. Even the polishes I make are made to break down very quickly so as to not remove to much material. I also make sure that all the products contain anti-oxidants that protect the material.
The whole reason I got into this was not to make money but to come up with something that was actually made for restoring hard rubber and not something that was used because that is what they had at the hardware store. I am also trying to use safe ingredients only. Bleach as well as things like Semi-chrome and Flitz are not made for for that. They use strong abrasives and chemicals that are quite toxic.In fact because I used the Semi-Chrome so much I started to have breathing issues.
Also, believe me, I am not getting rich doing this. I am sure you make a lot more money then I do.....at least I hope you do. While I enjoy doing this there is also a lot of time and effort that goes into it.
I am happy to continue this conversation if you have anything else to discuss. If you have better methods for restoring please do share them. I am happy to give you my opinion as well.
Sincerely,
Mark Hoover
At any rate. Rubber begins to deteriorate from day one of production. This is an on-going process that for the moment at least can not be stopped. There are a number of things that cause rubber to oxidize. UV light, high humidity, high temperature, oxygen and as well as certain gases such as ozone.
UV light is certainly one of the factors that can cause rubber lighten over time.
However, it is the chemical reaction that the off-gassing sulfur as well as the other things like fillers has
with moisture that create the thin layer on the surface that we see. These combined factors will discolor the surface grayish green to brown and cause the material to break down quickly.
So, technically, you are right. This product is removing that build-up on the surface which was sulfur that was in the hard rubber. That being said, it is not necessarily removing surface material. Underneath this layer the rubber is often black. Also, this surface oxidation for the most part does not run extremely deep. When I created my products I wanted to be sure that the hard rubber was not being chemically attacked. Oxyclean as well as Beach are very indiscriminate as they will not only remove the oxidation but will also start to harm the healthy rubber underneath. Often the oxidation will also re-harden and sanding is required. My product is only removing the surface oxidation. Recently, I have added a product to remove slightly deeper oxidation as well but I am very careful to not cause deep surface damage. I also use enzymes to break the oxidation down. These enzymes are not destructive like so of their chemical counter-parts. Once this is finished often very little polishing is needed. Even the polishes I make are made to break down very quickly so as to not remove to much material. I also make sure that all the products contain anti-oxidants that protect the material.
The whole reason I got into this was not to make money but to come up with something that was actually made for restoring hard rubber and not something that was used because that is what they had at the hardware store. I am also trying to use safe ingredients only. Bleach as well as things like Semi-chrome and Flitz are not made for for that. They use strong abrasives and chemicals that are quite toxic.In fact because I used the Semi-Chrome so much I started to have breathing issues.
Also, believe me, I am not getting rich doing this. I am sure you make a lot more money then I do.....at least I hope you do. While I enjoy doing this there is also a lot of time and effort that goes into it.
I am happy to continue this conversation if you have anything else to discuss. If you have better methods for restoring please do share them. I am happy to give you my opinion as well.
Sincerely,
Mark Hoover
Net semantic content: What you are selling is Clorox Lite
Conversational tone is irrelevant. (Sorry, but when it's physics or chemistry that's being disputed and not artistic interpretation or similar, facts are all that matter.)
Note the reflectivity of the stem in the following pics. If the surface of that stem was made irregular somehow, it would show up as distortion like ripples on a pond.
Oxidation never occurs evenly enough that removing it by chemical means---no matter how mild the solution---would result in a second surface "under" it that was as smooth as the original "outer" one. Result? It would have to be sanded and polished to make it uniformly smooth again.
And if that's where you're going to end up, why bother with an expensive, hours-long chemical soak beforehand?
.
Conversational tone is irrelevant. (Sorry, but when it's physics or chemistry that's being disputed and not artistic interpretation or similar, facts are all that matter.)
Note the reflectivity of the stem in the following pics. If the surface of that stem was made irregular somehow, it would show up as distortion like ripples on a pond.
Oxidation never occurs evenly enough that removing it by chemical means---no matter how mild the solution---would result in a second surface "under" it that was as smooth as the original "outer" one. Result? It would have to be sanded and polished to make it uniformly smooth again.
And if that's where you're going to end up, why bother with an expensive, hours-long chemical soak beforehand?
.
A lighter, a wet paper towel, and toothpaste.
Prior to it and a few other videos being deleted by YouTube, I showed the process on here in a restoration thread for the above pictured pipe for those curious about the technique. Maybe a video of your process could help?
Beautiful pictures. But I have a lot of beautiful pictures as well. You seem to think this is a dispute. I may not agree with your way of doing things but I am more then happy to discuss it as there are number of ways to approach restoring. If you have researched everything and have research to share please send it to me and I will be happy to go over it and give you my opinion. I would also love to see the video you have made or you can just break down how you did these restorations here. Again, I can't tell you what I think if I don't know how you did it.
You are right though. I do need to do a video and I plan on doing this. I posted a step by step process using pictures though on instagram and facebook.
You are right though. I do need to do a video and I plan on doing this. I posted a step by step process using pictures though on instagram and facebook.
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