Seeking Ashton Info (Horn Stemmed Oddity)

[alaskanpiper]

Just received an Ashton (A Sovereign dated 1995) that I bought specifically because I can’t ever remember seeing an Ashton pipe with a horn stem before.

I am curious if anyone has any knowledge regarding horn stemmed Ashton pipes and in what capacity they were produced?

FWIW, it also has an orific-ish bit.

Additionally, this pipe also has a strange thin ring of color near the end of the shank that as of yet remains a bit of a mystery to me. Upon inspection of the mortise interior, it does not appear to be repair related.

The leading theory so far is that it is possibly coloring left behind from a since departed metal band of some sort, but this would be an awfully thin band, especially for Ashton, and it seems as though it is below the wax used to finish the pipe! Any and all theories on this would be appreciated as well! Thanks!

 

[buckaroo]

Right, I thought that ring was a bit strange too (and horn) as I saw that on Marty's site and considered buying it, but I just have too many pipes right now. After seeing it, I immediately went to my saved old RD Field Ashton pictures and info and could not find that pipe, so I am of no help. I wonder if anyone else will chime with details. Anyway, nice pics and beautiful Ashton.

 

[VDL_Piper]

It’s certainly not in keeping with the Ashton text book but it’s a gem of a pipe. Wonder if the stem is a reproduction by a talented repairer/maker and they installed the Ashton identifier in the stem

 

[alaskanpiper]

It’s certainly not in keeping with the Ashton text book but it’s a gem of a pipe. Wonder if the stem is a reproduction by a talented repairer/maker and they installed the Ashton identifier in the stem

I had the same thought, and certainly it’s possible. If so, they did quite well. The fit is fantastic and the briar dot in the stem looks legit.

 

[georged]

Nice puzzle.

Repair bands don't have any roll-over at their large end (they are all faintly conical) by design, and even if they did the evenness of any scratch they created would not be that uniform or look like that.

My guess is that the "scratch ring" was created, either accidentally or on purpose, by mounting a fully shaped stummel on a lathe-centered pin, and touching a scribe tool to it while it was rotating.

If the shank/stem joint is perfectly level (can't tell from the pics) it would strongly argue that the stem is original, because achieving "perfect level" after the fact is quite labor intensive, and not the sort of thing any maker would choose to do. MUCH easier to shape the shank and stem as a unit. Less work AND perfect result = no-brainer.

If there is a LACK of uniform leveling, it would strongly argue that the stem was fitted after the fact.

But wait, there's more! lol

Indicative of a replacement is that the button shaping is legit---and difficult to get exactly right---while the profile shaping was left incomplete. (The lines aren't straight, and there's significant "bloat") The skill to execute the former would seemingly preclude the latter... unless it was a factory-made item that was reduced in diameter to fit that pipe. (Horn and bakelite blanks with finished buttons were produced for the repair trade along with rubber ones).

Creating the inset trademark is no biggie in any event, so argues neither for nor against originality.

 

[georged]

 

[alaskanpiper]

Nice puzzle.

Repair bands don't have any roll-over at their large end (they are all faintly conical) by design, and even if they did the evenness of any scratch they created would not be that uniform or look like that.

My guess is that the "scratch ring" was created, either accidentally or on purpose, by mounting a fully shaped stummel on a lathe-centered pin, and touching a scribe tool to it while it was rotating.

If the shank/stem joint is perfectly level (can't tell from the pics) it would strongly argue that the stem is original, because achieving "perfect level" after the fact is quite labor intensive, and not the sort of thing any maker would choose to do. MUCH easier to shape the shank and stem as a unit. Less work AND perfect result = no-brainer.

If there is a LACK of uniform leveling, it would strongly argue that the stem was fitted after the fact.

But wait, there's more! lol

Indicative of a replacement is that the button shaping is legit---and difficult to get exactly right---while the profile shaping was left incomplete. (The lines aren't straight, and there's significant "bloat") The skill to execute the former would seemingly preclude the latter... unless it was a factory-made item that was reduced in diameter to fit that pipe. (Horn and bakelite blanks with finished buttons were produced for the repair trade along with rubber ones).

Creating the inset trademark is no biggie in any event, so argues neither for nor against originality.

That is indeed what the “scratch ring” looks like. However, there is no indentation whatsoever. The repair band theory was more of a “years of gunk” theory than a “scratch” theory.

The perfect fit and level shank/stem transition is what led me to believe it was original at first as well.

The profile shaping you mention may be a combination of the photo angle and/or natural horn coloration creating an illusion (if you look at the other side pic you can see the far side of the stem in the pic you referenced is brown). I can clearly see what you mean in the photo, but I went and grabbed the pipe and to the naked eye, it looks pretty uniformly profiled, and I don’t see any “bloat”.

All that being said, what now has me leaning back towards replacement (aside from the fact that its horn on an Ashton to begin with), is while performing the aforementioned intense stem gazing, I took a closer look at the stem dot, and you can see an uneven area on the metal ring surrounding the briar dot. Almost looks like it could be where the two ends of a thin piece of metal were melded together. I feel like this would be a little too much of an imperfection to survive the scrutiny of a 1995 Ashton inspection

 

[georged]

10-4 on the aluminum dot ring.

Bill used Dunhill innertubes for them. Not just easy and uniform, but for him they were literally free. He managed the Dunhill shop for years, and they were everywhere.

More to the point, Dunhill innertubes are seamless.

Definitely looking more like the horn stem is a retrofit.

The best way to check for straight profile lines is with a 1-2-3 block designed for the purpose. (Rulers are pretty much hopeless)

 

[VDL_Piper]

Remarkable sleuthing Gentlemen