Why Are There So Few Burley Flakes Available?

Log in

SmokingPipes.com Updates

1 Fresh Brigham Pipe
18 Fresh Winslow Pipes
New Cigars
18 Fresh Brebbia Pipes
18 Fresh Musico Pipes

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

PipesMagazine Approved Sponsor

Briarcutter

Lifer
Aug 17, 2023
1,320
7,339
U.S.A.
I've wondered this as well, and my best guess is that since burley behaves pretty well as a ribbon cut, there just isn't as much demand for flakes as with Virginias. And when a cooler-burning burley has been called for, cube cuts do the job and are less work. C&D offers a cube-cut burley, but only when they haven't used it all in their blends.
Sutliff use to offer a cube called "TS 20, white cube cut". Even this has changed in the last few years. Last couple batches I received were more of a mashed up mess loosly resembling cubes. It use to be well manufactured cube, I smoked pounds of it. Close to the quality of the PS41 but not quite. Anyway I'm suspecting many used It in their blends including Peretti, but that's just a guess. i wouldn't doubt C&D used it as well. I dont think it's an easy task to make true CC or flakes for that matter. I'm not talking about mashed,pressed and sliced ribbon. I'm thinking it takes whole leaf,sauced,pressed then sliced. CC would be even more challanging. You'd have to press whole leafe about 3/16 think, slice it all 3/16 wide, rotate it all 90 degrees and cut it again 3/16 or what ever the desired dimentions. Probably tricky and need correct equpment. Since Sutliff's gone under do we have anyone left in the states capable of this?
 
Last edited:

makhorkasmoker

Part of the Furniture Now
Aug 17, 2021
864
2,205
Central Florida
I’d love to try a truly straight burley flake with no casings or toppings or toasting either, but so far as I know this doesn’t exist. I wonder if it’s even possible to make a flake without some kind of sauce to help hold things together.
 
  • Love
Reactions: Mrs. Pickles

woodsroad

Lifer
Oct 10, 2013
13,915
26,283
SE PA USA
Even if you don't look specifically at flakes, VA's in general (regardless of cut, but probably even by cut) are far more popular, and a lot of people are almost proud of not liking burley... to me, akin to that Portlandia skit or whatever (never saw the show just familiar with the clip) of a bunch of snooty people "DID YOU READ?" and "I don't even own a TV", though the proudness of not liking burley pales in comparison to the people tripping over themselves to proclaim their hatred of aromatics like only children and wimps smoke aros and real smokers only want unadulterated pure tobacco taste, because they're a real man (at least that's how it comes off to me). I mean someone saying they don't like aros when it's relevant isn't really the issue (and it's perfectly fine to not like them), it's more the people that go out of their way unnecessarily to proclaim their dislike of them when it's not really relevant (like if someone is specifically asking for aro recommendations and that's what the thread is about, it helps nobody for you to come in to say "I don't like aros").

Hell, another forum someone started a thread about what's your "final four" or something about what you're currently smoking between vas, aros, burley and English and the number of people putting down blends for 3 of the categories and putting "I don't smoke burley" for the burley category was like 1/4 of the responders on the first two pages. And there's others still that the only burley they'll smoke is ODF/Kentucky.

And then there's still occasionally threads that crop up from time to time about "I thought burley was just cheap floor scrapings for cigarette tobacco, boy was I wrong" or some such.

All that is to say, burley of any cut is not immensely popular compared to other blend types... at least as far as forums are concerned. Many think of burley as either "noobie/beginner" tobacco or "codger stuff". VAs are probably the most popular blends.

And that's a big part of why you don't see more burley flakes (not as much demand from consumers as for VAs, at least as it appears on forums and for boutique blend buyer types).

If there's more to the story than that, I don't know. I do know burley is a little more difficult to grow than VA (at least I think that's what I read at some point), which could mean less production compared to VA which could translate to less use, or less familiarity.

Then probably other factors like, too many are the same because they're all trying too hard to be an ABF clone, which is one of only a handful of burley blends that get regularly recommended, and not trying to experiment with burley (if you think burley is one-dimensional and something you can't explore very far as a basis for a blend, you've never had LJP's burley blends) or thinking it can't do much other than add nicotine to a blend or alter the ph of a VA or something also probably contributes.
Wanna buy a period?
 

krizzose

Lifer
Feb 13, 2013
3,620
24,391
Michigan
A similar question is why aren’t there any Virginia cube cut blends? Lots of people cube cut Virginia flakes, myself included on occasion, and they smoke very well that way.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mrs. Pickles

Briarcutter

Lifer
Aug 17, 2023
1,320
7,339
U.S.A.
I’d love to try a truly straight burley flake with no casings or toppings or toasting either, but so far as I know this doesn’t exist. I wonder if it’s even possible to make a flake without some kind of sauce to help hold things together.
I was told by several people,straight burley will tear your mouth apart. They said it has to have some casing,sugars or whatever to make it smokeable. One gentleman was the boss at Peretti. I've never tried it, I'm just saying what I heard.
 

ofafeather

Lifer
Apr 26, 2020
2,958
9,336
52
Where NY, CT & MA meet
I was told by several people,straight burley will tear your mouth apart. They said it has to have some casing,sugars or whatever to make it smokeable. One gentleman was the boss at Peretti. I've never tried it, I'm just saying what I heard.
Yes. Per Ernie Q from Watch City, every commercially available tobacco (unless you’re buying unprocessed whole leaf) will have some sort of casing which is largely there to balance PH (there are many other directions to go but PH is a big one)
 

anotherbob

Lifer
Mar 30, 2019
17,777
32,134
47
In the semi-rural NorthEastern USA
Honestly I don't really think burly is as effected by being pressed into a flake as VAs are. There is a difference but it's not as stark. The simple fact is it's just not as temperamental of a leaf. So it's more work in my opinion for a smaller return.
To illustrate what I mean if I break up a flake with a high va content it not only smokes differently then if I fold and stuff, the flavor profile changes somewhat dramatically. With the burly flakes the difference just isn't as noticeable.
I love the burly flakes I've tried but would not feel dramatically differently about them if they suddenly were only sold as ribbons.
Another thing is that burly is better at absorbing other flavors and scents then Va it will marry the falvors without being pressed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ofafeather

Lumbridge

(Pazuzu93)
Feb 16, 2020
919
3,178
Cascadia, U.S.
Anecdotal: Burley seems to be generally underappreciated and treated as a "lesser" tobacco as compared to the more fashionable Virginia. Less demand, fewer products available. I've seen more comments akin to "I don't smoke burley" than I have regarding any other base tobacco.

Personally, I love burley, whether aromatic or non-aromatic. It's the primary staple of my cellar. I'd love to see more burley flakes and non-aromatic Burley-dominant blends.

edit: grammar
 
Last edited:

Briarcutter

Lifer
Aug 17, 2023
1,320
7,339
U.S.A.
Anecdotal: Burley seems to be generally underappreciated and treated as a "lesser" tobacco as compared to the more fashionable Virginia. Less demand, fewer products available. I've seen more comments akin to "I don't smoke burley" than I have regarding any other base tobacco.

Personally, I love burley, whether aromatic or non-aromatic. It's the primary staple of my cellar. I'd love to see more burley flakes and non-aromatic Burley-dominant blends.

edit: grammar
IMO burley has gotten a bad rap over the years. I think mainly because it was used in so many codger blends and some viewed those as bottom of the barrel, I did for many years when I was tobacco snobing. Or, maybe they just don't like the taste of burley, to each his own. Now, I really enjoy burley and also enjoy the codger blends as we!!. I think Peretti has on their site somewhere, everyone eventually comes to burley, something like that. It does have very good properties of absorption from what I'm told.