Where Does the Seller's Responsibility End?

[hoosierpipeguy]

Have a friend who had this happen to a Stanwell Authentic (see photo below). I think by looking at the pipe you can see it hasn't been smoked heavily and has been well cared for. Perhaps I'm mistaken but that certainly looks like a flaw likely caused by an unseen sand pit.
Pipe was purchased several months back from PnC. Email sent to PnC got a reply of essentially "Too bad, it's past our 30 day warranty period." What are people's thoughts? Should the buyer be stuck with this pipe through no fault of their own?

 

[ckarnes]

The pipe was purchased several months ago. Why wasn't the flaw noticed then? Personally, I see no issue with a seller sticking to their 30 day warranty period. Otherwise, people could misuse their items (be it pipes, electronics, whatever) and return it claiming a manufacturing defect. I think this is a perfect example of why one should closely inspect any items they purchase immediately on receipt.

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

These types of flaws usually aren't visible prior to smoking the pipe and often don't appear for quite some time. How do you inspect for a sand pit that is just below the inner bowl surface?

 

[npod]

Imho the key here is “several months”. It is a factory pipe and non artisan, so it’s subject to standard manufacturing language for use and performance. I would support PnC on this matter. But that doesn’t mean it doesn’t suck for your friend and I hate to see these things happen.

 

[npod]

Pipe mud should should patch that up I would imagine.

 

[bluegrassbrian]

I would ring Stanwell's bell and see if they can ship out a replacement.
Always thought the industry standard was 1 year after purchase for burnout.

 

[metalheadycigarguy]

It's unfortunate for your friend that his pipe has a flaw, but I have no issue with PnC not accepting a return and issuing a refund. They have no way of knowing if the individual smoked the pipe 15 times a day every day for several months and burned the pipe out and now wants a refund. Not saying that happened, but they have no way to know. When I clean out my pipes after smoking them I always check the bowl to make sure I get all the dottle out, and if there was an issue with the pipe I would see it then.

 

[sablebrush52]

I'm going to have to agree with the respondents. P&C didn't manufacture the pipe, they merely sold it and guaranteed it for a period that has long since expired. Stanwell's guarantee may be longer and your friend should contact Stanwell to see if they will do anything for him.

 

[jaytex1969]

Flaws unforeseeable by the buyer or the seller can't really be assigned fault.
Part of the "Doodoo occurs" life clause.

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

He purchased the pipe in April. I can kind of see both sides of the aisle. What's the advantage though of purchasing a pipe from an internet store if they're not going to handle warranty exchanges? I would think they would extend the same warranty as the manufacturer. If that is 30 days, it's 30 days. I had a pipe I purchased from Moretti and after a couple of months, a similar problem developed. One email with photos, Marco responded within minutes that he would have a replacement sent out to me within a week. He did and it was a nicer pipe than the one with the flaw.
I fail to see what smoking it 15 times per day has to do with a sandpit flaw? I thought people purchased pipes to smoke them. It's pretty obvious that pipe had seen very moderate use (my friend say he smoked it less than a dozen times). Perhaps what one should do is smoke it 15 times per day for the first month to see if a flaw exists. I also can't agree with the "unforseen flaws" thing. So if you purchase 20 tins of tobacco, pop the tin and they all have mold, you'd say "the seller cannot be held responsible for unforseen flaws."?
Regardless, I appreciate people weighing in on this and providing their unbiased opinion. I'll advise my friend to smoke a few more bowls in the first 30 days in the future to see if this type of problem would be uncovered. It clearly isn't a chronic problem, I've had it happen once in over 100 pipes purchased in my life.

 

[tkcolo]

It is disappointing, but I agree P&C is not responsible. I have repair a number of problems with MEECO'S RED DEVIL 121 Furnace Cement and Fireplace Mortar with great success. It is stronger and more permanent than pipe mud. It is a little gritty, but it smooths over with a little cake. My repairs have been to charred thin wall cracks, and not large areas. Not taste or impact to smoking.

 

[ssjones]

A similar story, with another product:

I purchased a Browning axe for my son-in-law, from a web retailer, in April. A few weeks ago,I visited them and found the axe head was heavily damaged. My son-in-law said he only used it for light wood, and the blade deformed almost immediately. I contacted the retailer, who said their 30 warranty had expired and they suggested that I contact Browning. I called Browning and sent a picture of the axe head. They sent him a replacement axe.

 

[jpmcwjr]

I am not sure where the flaw is in the photos! I see a light grey smudge area towards the heel, but can't tell if it has depth or not. So, is there a pit inside the chamber that he's afraid might burn through? So, a bit of pipe mud should cure it.

 

[metalheadycigarguy]

I fail to see what smoking it 15 times per day has to do with a sandpit flaw? I thought people purchased pipes to smoke them. It's pretty obvious that pipe had seen very moderate use (my friend say he smoked it less than a dozen times). Perhaps what one should do is smoke it 15 times per day for the first month to see if a flaw exists. I also can't agree with the "unforseen flaws" thing. So if you purchase 20 tins of tobacco, pop the tin and they all have mold, you'd say "the seller cannot be held responsible for unforseen flaws."?

Again, I was using that as an example. Most people don't smoke a pipe that heavily, and if and when they do they can cause burn out. Especially if the pipe is not made from good quality briar and the pipe is being smoked hot etc. Regardless of heavy use or very little use, because the seller doesn't know the amount of abuse the pipe has been through they're only going to warranty the pipe under their standard warranty. As for the "unforeseen flaws" that has nothing to do with the seller either, and those fall under the manufacturer. I would suggest like others that your friend contact Stanwell and see what they'll do for him in regards to the issue with the pipe.

 

[woodsroad]

Am I the only one who doesn’t see a flaw in that pipe?

 

[scloyd]

In the first picture it seems that I can see a depression/dimple. I'd contact Stanwell.

 

[warren]

I'm not seeing a flaw either in the pictures. Be that as it may, the retailer lived up to his part of the sale. Might be worth seeing what the manufacturer thinks but, the retailer certainly isn't wrong. Cake is going to take care of the dimple I think.

 

[rmpeeps]

At first it was hard for me to see the flaw too, but zooming in on the first picture I see the wall of the bowl dished out at least an 1/8”, showing shadow into the hole.

It’s hard to hold this on P&C, and to get any kind of decent acceptance of responsibility from Stanwell is doubtful.

This would be one of those occasions when I’m thankful to know exactly who carved my pipe.

 

[wyfbane]

The margins on this stuff are pretty small. I am totally on the side of P&C. To be fair, I usually side with P&C when they come up on here. But in this case, the pipe just took too long to exhibit the flaw. There are no pipe lemon laws.
If the guy can't afford another pipe, that sucks. Luckily, he is your friend and you appear to have a healthy income based on your cellaring rate, hoosier. Hook your boy up with a pipe if he needs it!
Or have him come on here and get to know us. Heck, people just randomly send Brad pipes when he says he likes them. Maybe your friend will have charisma like that?

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

wyfbane, my friend already purchased a replacement, a really nice Alan Brothers freehand blast. I was just looking for opinions and the response is near unanimous. My friend does reasonably well for himself so it's not the end of the world. I've never been in the retail business so I don't have first hand experience with the customer service standards. Based on the feedback from unbiased third parties, I now have a better perspective.
Had my friend been unable to afford his own pipe, as I'm sure many here would do, I'd happily provide one for him.