When will the madness end?

[brian64]

Many people these days simply cannot afford to eat well. A person can fill their bellies easier and faster and most importantly, cheaper on crap that is mass produced.
It's been demonstrated that corn syrup not only makes a person crave what they are eating, but it causes a person to gain weight much more quickly. And corn syrup is a main ingredient in these low-cost, mass produced foods. IMHO, crap food that is very cheap to make is a much bigger culprit than simply saying "people are lazy".

+1
Corn (and corn syrup) is the basis of damn near everything in the modern, low-cost, mass produced, processed-food-stuffs that make up the American diet. The severity of the economic crisis is significantly veiled by all of this inexpensive "food". But that's not the worst part. The worst part is that nearly all yellow corn is now genetically modified...and that is a whole other major can o' worms.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiCRwMMh9k8&feature=player_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Onw72ShqbP4&feature=player_embedded#!

 

[photoman13]

Wow some strong opinions on this thread. All I can talk about is my personal experience with food. I am clinically obese and have always had a problem with weight. Even when I was running 3 miles a day, lifting weights, and ate very healthy I still had a rough time. My sister has had a difficult time with weight as well and has done similar things. There were times when we were growing up that all my parents could afford was McDonalds! I am far from a lazy person and neither is my sister and we have struggled no matter the situation. There were a few times we just ate bread for dinner. I will also point out my parents are far from lazy. From my experience it is a combination of things. In our case it was being tight on money, possibly genetics, and probably just the low quality of food we could even find in rural Tennessee and rural Michigan. I have a bunch of friends who went to Europe for 3 weeks and ate tons of terrible food but when they come back to the states they found they have lost weight. The US's uses of certain oils, preservatives, and just generally cheap ingredients I believe are another problem. I do agree that some people are lazy but please refrain from calling all people lazy. It is a very sensitive issue for me and I don't mean to take offense but it is hard not to.

 

[lankfordjl]

It's a fact that gaining weight results from "more calories in than calories out." As long as someone is getting basic nutrients...they can lose weight by eating less calories - exercise is not a really a factor. Exercise helps. Yes, syrups of all kinds are packed with calories, but its not corn syrup itself that is the problem - it's eating too much corn syrup. Most people's lifestyles are becoming more sedentary - that means they must eat a lot less to maintain a reasonable weight - but eating is fun - so its hard to do. As a kid I was over weight and it was because my mom was stuffing me with food - my parents were depression era kids - lack of food was a scary thought; fat meant healthy to them. I lost 45 lbs during college just by eating less calories. It's a sad example but just look at concentration camp victims of WW II. They lost weight because they were eating less. If we switch to what the government deems healthier ingredients, we'll still have weight problems because people will eat to much of it! People like to eat!
People must be able to judge what is healthy for themselves. You can be overweight and healthy; you can be thin and unhealthy. You can live your whole life as a vegan and die of a massive heart attack.

 

[numbersix]

@photoman13
Good points all around. I think you bring up some significant issues: genetics IMO do play a role in how a person manages their weight, as well as what they crave. Money plays another role as cheaper processed foods are more affordable and finally, education (or lack thereof) is another factor.
@lankfordjl

Yes, syrups of all kinds are packed with calories, but its not corn syrup itself that is the problem - it's eating too much corn syrup.

I think this is true to a point, but when so many affordable processed foods contain it, even those people who eat moderately will gain excess fat.
When society and politicians reduce a complex problem into simplistic moralistic attacks (i.e., fat people are all lazy or eat too much) they are in effect saying that fat people are morally inferior (not true) and more importantly, we miss any opportunity to actually fix the problem.
It's true people should go out and exercise, but not everyone enjoys a normal 9-5 job, reasonable salary and good health - all of which make it easier to simply find time to exercise. Some have to work 2 or 3 jobs and do what they can to make ends meet; and this often means buying cheap processed foods that will fill their bellies and their children's bellies.
There was an article I read about a working-class woman in NYC shopping for her family. They compared the prices of fresh meat, vegetables and an overall balanced diet in a nice supermarket to the cheap processed foods, with heavy starches and pasta she normally bought at the local grocery store.
There were many things to consider in her case. For one, she didn't have a car and getting to the nice supermarket was expensive and it was difficult to bring the food back. The food at the supermarket was expensive as well. Whereas her local grocery store was close by and sold cheap (but filling) processed food.
The point of the article being that she literally couldn't afford to eat healthily.

 

[lankfordjl]

@numbersix
Corn syrup leads to no more fat gain than any other syrup. Corn syrup is cheap; it's in almost everything. People, like myself, just eat too many calories, that's what leads to more fat gain. Corn syrup is not some strange or corrupt substance.

When society and politicians reduce a complex problem into simplistic moralistic attacks (i.e., fat people are all lazy or eat too much) they are in effect saying that fat people are morally inferior (not true) and more importantly, we miss any opportunity to actually fix the problem.

This is exactly what politicians are doing to tobacco users. The way to fix the problem is education...then individaul rights...and accepting responsibility. Not dictating rules. People will only learn with education and by reaping what they sow.

The point of the article being that she literally couldn't afford to eat healthily.

A person can literally lose weight eating "Big Macs" from McDonalds. If you eat one a day...you'll get all the nutrition(including calories) you'll need to live that day and you'll lose weight; you can't eat anything else though. I know people will disagree but...losing weight is cheap...you're buying less food and eating less!

 

[numbersix]

This is exactly what politicians are doing to tobacco users. The way to fix the problem is education...then individaul rights...and accepting responsibility. Not dictating rules. People will only learn with education and by reaping what they sow.

+1
This I can agree with 100%. ::

 

[photoman13]

I don't mean to say that everyone had the same circumstances as me but that is the only information I know to be true in a case like this. I might add that I know how to eat healthy as I did loose over 80 pounds when I was running 3 miles a day and lifting weights but still had problems with weight. I still eat rather healthy but gained a lot back as I have knee problems now. I don't eat a lot either so no one can tell me it is less calorie intake.
I do agree that our jobs and culture has made us more sedentary though as a people but I don't like speaking in generalizations as you can tell from this thread and the doctors thread. Sorry about that guys.
Another problem I noticed is the government's use of obese. It is based on one weight per height. That is just crazy. At one time I had 12 percent body fat and very heavy because of muscle yet I was obese. It in all honesty is a silly term.

 

[captainprophesy]

It is not just less calories... in fact if you starve yourself with very low calories then your body will go into starvation mode and store as much fat as possible for future fuel, your body literally thinks it will be a long time before it eats again... but there are variations on this too... but we would have to turn this thread into a science and biology thread instead of a pseudo political thread.

 

[numbersix]

Another problem I noticed is the government's use of obese. It is based on one weight per height. That is just crazy. At one time I had 12 percent body fat and very heavy because of muscle yet I was obese. It in all honesty is a silly term.

+1
Another very good point @photoman

 

[cigrmaster]

I have found that I can feed myself and my two sons a healthy meal for 10 bucks. I buy a whole chicken at a 1.29 a pound, so a 6 pound bird is 7.74. I buy a pound of green beans( lightly steamed) at 1.49 a pound and I am under ten bucks for a healthy meal. I buy pork tenderloin at 3.99 a pound, use 2.5 pounds and a pound of asparagus at 2.99 a pound, I am at 13 bucks for that meal. If I took them to McDonalds, the bill is much higher. I can buy 3 pounds of Swai which is a white fish for 9 bucks, throw in a veggie, and again 12 bucks or so for dinner. It is not very expensive at all to eat healthy. Once a week I will throw in a carb like rice or potato because that is what puts the weight on. For sandwiches you can use low carb wraps and save on carbs. If you stay away from carbs and any kind of processed foods, you can eat real well and be healthy.
Plus if you buy this kind of stuff, you will never see a warning label.

 

[captainprophesy]

+1 Cigrmaster... I can take it a step further... grow your own veggies, also if space permits 3 hens can give up to 20-30 eggs a week. Hens generally cost around $5 each

 

[photoman13]

I live in the city so no space for farm animals. When our family would go to mcdonalds we would only get the dollar menu so we would eat cheaper than 10 dollars. In college I only spend about 30 dollars a week and ate healthy so it can be done but it is difficult. My girlfriend and I eat pretty healthy and do similar meals to cigrmaster. It still doesn't matter though. We both still struggle with weight.

 

[lankfordjl]

True, muscle mass helps to burn extra calories.

Genetics plays a role as well...
@captainprophesy
but "calories in (from food) versus calories out (from use)" cannot be denied, no matter the situation. I’m not trying to simply things; it’s just mathematically true.
Starvation mode in an individual that has experienced starvation is a temporary condition in that individual (maybe not temporary for the next generation).
A person's metabolism is a result of genetics, environment, and behavior. Metabolic rate is not constant but can change with lifestyle changes. The biology is extremely complex…I don’t know if anyone on earth understands it yet.
The genetics of weight gain is complicated. How much do epigenes play a role? You all might be interested in watching this short video:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/body/epigenetics.html
P.S. When I comment on the forum about science topics, I’m trying to give the best explanation to what is known…sure I don’t know everything…but biology is my career. Be careful what you read on popular websites and those selling goods. And sadly enough…the right answer to many questions in science is, “We don’t know.”

 

[captainprophesy]

@lankfirdjl... LOL... I've seen that, thats why I am saying its not so clear cut as less calories mean less weight... genetics are a mofo! you can also have medical issues as well that make you gain weight.

It amazes me how one generations environmental circumstances can affect the following generation. Also wonky are humans that I can eat all the peanuts I want and be fine and others just smell it and they die!
understand Im just a big monkey! I just read allot of what others, who are much smarter than I am, have written.

Be careful what you read on popular websites and those selling goods

I cannot agree with you more.

 

[lankfordjl]

@captainprophesy
:lol: You are far far from being just a big monkey, my friend! Keep reading...all that you can.

 

[sparroa]

These nutritional dilemmas are deep seated social, cultural, and economic problems. Nobody has all of the answers and they are impossible to fix from the top down in my opinion.
To me, these warning labels and junk taxes are the complete opposite of what we should be doing as a society. It is an authoritarian approach. Education about nutrition, cooking, and smart shopping would go a lot further than this tax approach. The Canada Food Guide should be completely rejigged to reflect reality instead of outdated notions. As well, I think that small scale agriculture should receive some subsidies - community gardens or people with livestock for personal ocnsumption should get some kind of break. (That may sounds quaint in congested urban areas, but we have a vast country where that is not only practical but just plain smart to do in most areas)
People may think they are too busy to worry about what they eat, but that is probably the most important health question of all. Society as a whole should be helping people to make better choices, rather than guilting/shaming/scaring/taxing them into buying whatever is arbitrarily approved by the government.

 

[lankfordjl]

Hear, Hear! Hear, Hear! simenon