as I previously said, I started at the age of 11. My father left my mother when I was 9, for wife number 2 (of7), rare in 1964, and his posessions were quickly removed from the house. About 2 years later i was looking for something in the back of an old junk drawer and discovered a pipe belonging to my dad, and anounced to my mother that i wanted to use it. Her immediate reaction was a resounding no! about an hour later she approached me and asked "if I forbid you to smoke it, will you do it anyway?" I was a precocious kid and replied that I would. The agreement we came to was that I would smoke in the living rooms of the house but never the bedrooms, that I had to fund it from a weekend job i had and that I would also smoke outside in public. She thought that the reaction of friends and neighbours would soon embarrass me into quitting, but 44 years later I haven't. The big mistake she made was that she forgot that I have never cared what other people think of me. One amusing occasion springs to mind. at about 12 years old, I went to a football match with a friend and his father, also a pipe smoker, and when I got my pipe out at the interval, filled it and lit it, he commented that he would not dare use my usual brand of tobacco as it would be too strong for him.
Underage Pipe Smoking
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'Under Age' is really relative because age limits change depending on the feelings and whims of any given society.
I think that whatever the law is, we should follow it, if not only because of the punitive measures which can be imposed. That is, until it becomes ridiculously 'anti-social', like if the movement towards prohibition somehow makes our peaceable freedoms (which dont effect the rights of others) illegal.
I think that whatever the law is, we should follow it, if not only because of the punitive measures which can be imposed. That is, until it becomes ridiculously 'anti-social', like if the movement towards prohibition somehow makes our peaceable freedoms (which dont effect the rights of others) illegal.
Kind of an interesting coincidence that I stumbled onto this topic, b/c I have recently been put in kind of an awkward position.
First, though, I have to say that I smoked my first pipe in my mid-teens and would certainly have found a way to smoke a pipe regardless of adult opinion. From the time I was very young, I knew I'd eventually become a pipe smoker and longed for the day I earned the privilege. I've never been tempted to use tobacco except if smoked in a pipe (I've dabbled in cigars very superficially, but I just don't enjoy them). I admit that I didn't like sneaking around with my pipe before I turned 18, but I'll also admit that I don't regret it: I learned how to enjoy pipes and tobacco way back then, and delaying the initiation would have deprived me of a few years of pleasure. My mother was the first adult in my family to find out. I was in college, and I'd already been smoking my pipe in public fairly openly. She was initially a little disappointed that I'd hidden it while I was "under age," but her main reaction was totally sensible. "You're an adult, and if you're going to smoke tobacco, I'm glad to see that you've chosen a pipe, which you're not likely to get addicted to." She was absolutely right, and eventually the rest of the family got used to it without much fuss at all.
Now, I have a young relative who's 16 and who's been telling me for the past five years he's determined to smoke a pipe as soon as he's "allowed." He's not my kid, and I have neither encouraged nor discouraged him, but I've never refrained from smoking my pipe around him. He is definitely drawn to it, and he already knows a lot. He has a couple of older friends who smoke an occasional cigar or pipe - maybe with the tacit knowledge of their parents. I would be really surprised if the kid hasn't sampled tobacco already (I certainly had by his age). Not long ago, I noticed that one of my pipes had been smoked by someone other than me, and now I'm in an awkward position. I definitely don't want him or his parents to get the idea that I've "encouraged" him by supplying him with the pipe and tobacco. I also know the kid probably felt bad about sneaking my pipe and would feel even worse if I confronted him. I doubt I'd tell his parents, but I'd sure insist that he hold off until he's 18, or at least get his parent's permission if he insists on smoking an occasional pipe. Still kind of a contradictory position for me, though: I had my own pipes at his age and smoked whenever I wanted - but w/o parental knowledge or approval.
If he were my son, though, I'd definitely acknowledge the kid's decision to smoke a pipe (instead of cigarettes or weed, for example). What I'd really like to do is let him know I don't think he should be sneaking around with my pipes and tobacco - not because I don't want him to enjoy pipe smoking but because it's just not acceptable behavior. And then what I'd like to do is offer to give him a pipe, show him how to smoke it, and learn to enjoy it under my adult supervision. If he could get his parents to agree, then I think a real dilemma would be solved.
What does everybody else think?
First, though, I have to say that I smoked my first pipe in my mid-teens and would certainly have found a way to smoke a pipe regardless of adult opinion. From the time I was very young, I knew I'd eventually become a pipe smoker and longed for the day I earned the privilege. I've never been tempted to use tobacco except if smoked in a pipe (I've dabbled in cigars very superficially, but I just don't enjoy them). I admit that I didn't like sneaking around with my pipe before I turned 18, but I'll also admit that I don't regret it: I learned how to enjoy pipes and tobacco way back then, and delaying the initiation would have deprived me of a few years of pleasure. My mother was the first adult in my family to find out. I was in college, and I'd already been smoking my pipe in public fairly openly. She was initially a little disappointed that I'd hidden it while I was "under age," but her main reaction was totally sensible. "You're an adult, and if you're going to smoke tobacco, I'm glad to see that you've chosen a pipe, which you're not likely to get addicted to." She was absolutely right, and eventually the rest of the family got used to it without much fuss at all.
Now, I have a young relative who's 16 and who's been telling me for the past five years he's determined to smoke a pipe as soon as he's "allowed." He's not my kid, and I have neither encouraged nor discouraged him, but I've never refrained from smoking my pipe around him. He is definitely drawn to it, and he already knows a lot. He has a couple of older friends who smoke an occasional cigar or pipe - maybe with the tacit knowledge of their parents. I would be really surprised if the kid hasn't sampled tobacco already (I certainly had by his age). Not long ago, I noticed that one of my pipes had been smoked by someone other than me, and now I'm in an awkward position. I definitely don't want him or his parents to get the idea that I've "encouraged" him by supplying him with the pipe and tobacco. I also know the kid probably felt bad about sneaking my pipe and would feel even worse if I confronted him. I doubt I'd tell his parents, but I'd sure insist that he hold off until he's 18, or at least get his parent's permission if he insists on smoking an occasional pipe. Still kind of a contradictory position for me, though: I had my own pipes at his age and smoked whenever I wanted - but w/o parental knowledge or approval.
If he were my son, though, I'd definitely acknowledge the kid's decision to smoke a pipe (instead of cigarettes or weed, for example). What I'd really like to do is let him know I don't think he should be sneaking around with my pipes and tobacco - not because I don't want him to enjoy pipe smoking but because it's just not acceptable behavior. And then what I'd like to do is offer to give him a pipe, show him how to smoke it, and learn to enjoy it under my adult supervision. If he could get his parents to agree, then I think a real dilemma would be solved.
What does everybody else think?
Welcome to the site Johnscs,
I think you will find that most everyone that participates in these forums holds the following sentiments.
I don't know about the laws where you are, but here it is criminal to supply tobacco products to anyone under 19 years of age. Parental permission would not pass muster in a court of law.
I believe that you would be putting yourself in a very compromising position by doing so, and would leave yourself open to both civil liability and criminal prosecution.
I, like many of us "older" gentlemen on this site started when I was a teenager. I bought my first pipe when I was 16, but then one could buy tobacco products at 16.
Be that as it may, I would advise against supplying any tobacco product to anyone that is underage.
I think you will find that most everyone that participates in these forums holds the following sentiments.
I don't know about the laws where you are, but here it is criminal to supply tobacco products to anyone under 19 years of age. Parental permission would not pass muster in a court of law.
I believe that you would be putting yourself in a very compromising position by doing so, and would leave yourself open to both civil liability and criminal prosecution.
I, like many of us "older" gentlemen on this site started when I was a teenager. I bought my first pipe when I was 16, but then one could buy tobacco products at 16.
Be that as it may, I would advise against supplying any tobacco product to anyone that is underage.
While I don't approve of underage tobacco use of any kind, what are you going to do? Lock them in their room? If they decide to use tobacco, you or I have no control over them. I started smoking when I was 12. I was 15 and had a pack and a half a day addiction when my father finally caught me at the age of 15.
Johnscs:
Seems you have a unique opportunity with the young man. The discussion can be about truth, respect, etc.
I had a sort of similar experience with my brother-in-law about 3 years ago when he was 14 or 15. He was visiting us and I happened to look at my Direct TV account and saw he had rented a few pornos while staying up late.
We had a "put it on the table" conversation. But it wasn't about pornography it was about respect. He had chosen to use my account and incur charges without my knowledge or permission. That's disrespectful. I expect better from him. He was just about as embarrassed as a young man could be. And he's told me since that the conversation really made him think.
Seems you have a unique opportunity with the young man. The discussion can be about truth, respect, etc.
I had a sort of similar experience with my brother-in-law about 3 years ago when he was 14 or 15. He was visiting us and I happened to look at my Direct TV account and saw he had rented a few pornos while staying up late.
We had a "put it on the table" conversation. But it wasn't about pornography it was about respect. He had chosen to use my account and incur charges without my knowledge or permission. That's disrespectful. I expect better from him. He was just about as embarrassed as a young man could be. And he's told me since that the conversation really made him think.
I tell my kids no smoking, drinking, drugs, tattoos, body piercings, or sex until their out from under our roof and able to buy, pay for, and support whatever happens from the choices they make. That’s not to say that after a certain age I didn’t allow them to have a (1) beer with me after working together on a hot afternoon doing yard work. I just want them to understand that choosing any of the before mentioned can alter their lives forever. With all of that being said at the end of the day you just hope and pray that they heard some of what you said and that you didn’t set too bad of an example while they were paying attention. So far we have been blessed and pretty lucky, we have had no major issues with our son’s 24 & 17, or our daughter’s 21 & 15.
THX to everyone who has taken the time to respond to my little quandary. Very thoughtful.
I neglected to mention that I know about legal penalties for supplying tobacco, alcohol, etc. to minors - I wouldn't be tempted to defy the law. I should have framed my dilemma in a more hypothetical way, although the story isn't hypothetical. As I'm not this young man's parent, I was mainly speculating about my decision-making as if I were his father. It never occurred to me to supply this kid with a pipe starter kit until he's 18 and has informed his parents.
What continues to bother me, though, is that he's probably sampling tobacco on his own as it is, without any adult supervision. Familiar story to quite a few of us, as this thread shows. I think I do need to let him know that it isn't cool for him to be borrowing my pipes and smoking my tobacco. I'd like to take this opportunity to have a conversation about making adult (or at least adult-like) decisions when it comes all the adult indulgences that jcsoldit thoughtfully listed. I believe the young man is capable of making some reasonable decisions about tobacco, despite his being under age. At the same time, the law deems him ineligible to partake in the "adult" privilege of smoking a pipe once in a while. A shame for him, as I honestly think the decision to smoke a tobacco pipe (to the exclusion of cigarettes) is pretty mature.
Great to hear everyone's opinions, and I look forward to hearing other perspectives. Thanks a lot!
I neglected to mention that I know about legal penalties for supplying tobacco, alcohol, etc. to minors - I wouldn't be tempted to defy the law. I should have framed my dilemma in a more hypothetical way, although the story isn't hypothetical. As I'm not this young man's parent, I was mainly speculating about my decision-making as if I were his father. It never occurred to me to supply this kid with a pipe starter kit until he's 18 and has informed his parents.
What continues to bother me, though, is that he's probably sampling tobacco on his own as it is, without any adult supervision. Familiar story to quite a few of us, as this thread shows. I think I do need to let him know that it isn't cool for him to be borrowing my pipes and smoking my tobacco. I'd like to take this opportunity to have a conversation about making adult (or at least adult-like) decisions when it comes all the adult indulgences that jcsoldit thoughtfully listed. I believe the young man is capable of making some reasonable decisions about tobacco, despite his being under age. At the same time, the law deems him ineligible to partake in the "adult" privilege of smoking a pipe once in a while. A shame for him, as I honestly think the decision to smoke a tobacco pipe (to the exclusion of cigarettes) is pretty mature.
Great to hear everyone's opinions, and I look forward to hearing other perspectives. Thanks a lot!
Hi John,
I think talking to him is a good idea. You demonstrate the ability to present a reasoned argument, with organized forethought. I'm sure you know the following; I write it only to be helpful. And, I wish you success.
(I'm speaking generally about teenagers as a whole, not individuals. Seasoned with experience with two teenage daughters.)
Talking about a serious manner with a teenager is always going to be a bit like walking through a mine field. Their thoughts are filtered through a hormonal fog rather than clear light of reason. Just about any topic of discussion with the smallest possible hint of a negative overtone will not be perceived as constructive but critical. The hormones kick in and their ears close.
Good luck.
I think talking to him is a good idea. You demonstrate the ability to present a reasoned argument, with organized forethought. I'm sure you know the following; I write it only to be helpful. And, I wish you success.
(I'm speaking generally about teenagers as a whole, not individuals. Seasoned with experience with two teenage daughters.)
Talking about a serious manner with a teenager is always going to be a bit like walking through a mine field. Their thoughts are filtered through a hormonal fog rather than clear light of reason. Just about any topic of discussion with the smallest possible hint of a negative overtone will not be perceived as constructive but critical. The hormones kick in and their ears close.
Good luck.
John… I apologize for not reading your post closely before writing my last comments. I agree with Pstlpkr’s mine field comment, dealing with teens is tough and if anyone ever gets a good handle on it, I’ll buy their book. It’s easy for some of us to comment on how we would or have handled the topic with our own kids, but it’s totally different in your case, he not your son so you really don’t have the right to screw him up like if he was your own.
If I was in your shoes I think I would address the borrowing of your pipe and tobacco without permission rather than making the point that he is too young to smoke. Based on what he has already told you he knows that he is not allowed to smoke, and that topic be best discussed by him and his parents. Now the taking without permission something of yours is where you come in. You have an opportunity to let him know that borrowing your stuff without permission is not okay, and that he has put you in a potentially bad position with his parents, and that if they found out it could appear to them like you where encouraging him to smoke. See there is always a chance that if you make it about underage smoking he is going to take the you’re not my parent attitude. I don’t know if this makes any sense but he sounds like a good kid and he obviously likes and respects you, so the last thing he wants to do is create trouble for you. Good people usually worry more about cause their friends and loved ones harm than they do themselves. I would also make it clear that you will have to go to mom and dad if this happens again.
What I just wrote sounded good in my head but I’m not sure it’s translating well in print. To me the bottom line is that he involved you when he borrowed your pipe and tobacco and I think that’s where you can have the most impact on him.
By the way my stepfather finally got tired of hearing me beg gave me one of his El Producto Blunts to smoke with instructions to smoke it down to my fingers and to not let it go out. He was so sure I’d get sick and never ask for another one. Well I followed his instruction to the letter and was allowed to put out the 1.5” butt. After about an hour and a half rest I asked for another and the rest is history. He was an independent truck driver and man did I have a blast traveling with him in his old Peterbilt.
You'll do fine.
If I was in your shoes I think I would address the borrowing of your pipe and tobacco without permission rather than making the point that he is too young to smoke. Based on what he has already told you he knows that he is not allowed to smoke, and that topic be best discussed by him and his parents. Now the taking without permission something of yours is where you come in. You have an opportunity to let him know that borrowing your stuff without permission is not okay, and that he has put you in a potentially bad position with his parents, and that if they found out it could appear to them like you where encouraging him to smoke. See there is always a chance that if you make it about underage smoking he is going to take the you’re not my parent attitude. I don’t know if this makes any sense but he sounds like a good kid and he obviously likes and respects you, so the last thing he wants to do is create trouble for you. Good people usually worry more about cause their friends and loved ones harm than they do themselves. I would also make it clear that you will have to go to mom and dad if this happens again.
What I just wrote sounded good in my head but I’m not sure it’s translating well in print. To me the bottom line is that he involved you when he borrowed your pipe and tobacco and I think that’s where you can have the most impact on him.
By the way my stepfather finally got tired of hearing me beg gave me one of his El Producto Blunts to smoke with instructions to smoke it down to my fingers and to not let it go out. He was so sure I’d get sick and never ask for another one. Well I followed his instruction to the letter and was allowed to put out the 1.5” butt. After about an hour and a half rest I asked for another and the rest is history. He was an independent truck driver and man did I have a blast traveling with him in his old Peterbilt.
You'll do fine.
Thats what they do at that age , sneak that is . Let him know that you know he took one of your pipes without permission and try to remain calm .If you choose your words right it could lead to a constructive conversation .
JC:
I knew I liked you for some reason. I'm a trucker's kid myself. My earliest memories include trucks. My mother tell sme I'd always go right to sleep as a baby in the sleeper of Pop's yellow Freightliner cab over.
Was always a huge treat to go with him. Over the years it was Kenworths, Macks, Peterbilts, and others I don't recall (pretty sure there was an International in there too). Over the years he hauled cattle, petroleum, grain, freight, rock, and who know what else.
Anyway, my roots are pure good 'ole American working class. Pops was a trucker and Ma was a truck stop waitress. Makes me feel fortunate that despite always seeming to just barely make ends meet, I was able to go to college and somehow got a degree. Now I can sit on my ass for a living but not have to shift!
I knew I liked you for some reason. I'm a trucker's kid myself. My earliest memories include trucks. My mother tell sme I'd always go right to sleep as a baby in the sleeper of Pop's yellow Freightliner cab over.
Was always a huge treat to go with him. Over the years it was Kenworths, Macks, Peterbilts, and others I don't recall (pretty sure there was an International in there too). Over the years he hauled cattle, petroleum, grain, freight, rock, and who know what else.
Anyway, my roots are pure good 'ole American working class. Pops was a trucker and Ma was a truck stop waitress. Makes me feel fortunate that despite always seeming to just barely make ends meet, I was able to go to college and somehow got a degree. Now I can sit on my ass for a living but not have to shift!
I happened to find this thread while searching for the title, hope bumping at this point isn't inconsiderate. I'm an underage smoker as well, soon to be 17 and started at 14 or so. I have to agree with much of what has been said, and that my starting was similar to many as I gather, I'm not really average for my age or group, parents are divorced and working, ect.
As far as I know all of family is aware, and perhaps unconcerned, my dad is at least, figures I'll grow out of it like my granddad and subsequently he did. Of course, I knew my dad did, but I thought grandpa only smoked cigarettes to keep track of time while he was a merchant marine... We all picked the same blend too if you'll believe it, genetic predisposition?
Certainly not my singular vice, I'm a normal kid in that respect, as for Kevin's preposition of switching stoners to pipe tobacco, I'm doing my best but I can't teach them how to inhale without using their lungs.
As far as I know all of family is aware, and perhaps unconcerned, my dad is at least, figures I'll grow out of it like my granddad and subsequently he did. Of course, I knew my dad did, but I thought grandpa only smoked cigarettes to keep track of time while he was a merchant marine... We all picked the same blend too if you'll believe it, genetic predisposition?
Certainly not my singular vice, I'm a normal kid in that respect, as for Kevin's preposition of switching stoners to pipe tobacco, I'm doing my best but I can't teach them how to inhale without using their lungs.
Due to my grandparents being from Scotland I think I had a bit of a different up bringing maybe? I personally fully support the no smoking, drugs, and alcohol till your out of the house or of age belief. I grew up with my family at 16 we were able to start having drinks and smoke a pipe or a cigar from time to time. It was kinda a tradition for all the guys in our family. I think it teaches about safe drinking and being responsible instead of at 21 going out and getting smashed out of your mind for the next couple years. My parents also didn't allow me to go outside of our house and drink and wouldn't allow any friends too without parent permission. However that being said I turned out fine but a couple cousins not so much. They got big into drugs and everything since they had more freedom. Its kinda a touchy subject. I personally will probably do the same thing, but I also believe we got to obey the law of the land to a certain degree.
guillaume,
Good point. A lot of people may shy away from pipes due to this one factor.
A lot of people believe that springing for a pipe and tobacco is just too expensive.
If you compare cigarette costs to pipe smoking costs the pipe will win every time.
I still have my first pipe. I have processed many pounds of tobacco through it over the years. But, the initial cost and subsequent tobacco costs over 36 years is insignificant to the equivalent usage of cigarettes to that pipe. While the pipe cost may be a couple of hundred dollars, cigarettes would easily stretch into thousands.
Good point. A lot of people may shy away from pipes due to this one factor.
A lot of people believe that springing for a pipe and tobacco is just too expensive.
If you compare cigarette costs to pipe smoking costs the pipe will win every time.
I still have my first pipe. I have processed many pounds of tobacco through it over the years. But, the initial cost and subsequent tobacco costs over 36 years is insignificant to the equivalent usage of cigarettes to that pipe. While the pipe cost may be a couple of hundred dollars, cigarettes would easily stretch into thousands.
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