Tired Of The BS

[brian64]

My empirical observation has been that home schooled students are invariably better prepared for learning at the collegiate level than students that went to public school. To a large extent this is because the former has not been afflicted by the damage perpetrated on the latter. Cognitive development involves both knowledge acquisition and development of reasoning formalism ( critical thinking, quantitative reasoning, etc.). However the focus of public education, at least in GA, has focused on passing standardized tests. Hence students are only taught material necessary to get through the test, not the content to any real depth; and certainly only at the lowest levels of Bloom's taxonomy. What is worse, they are indoctrinated into a faulty learning method of memorize, regurgitate, and forget. Believing that to be normal retards their willingness to accept substantially more effective methods of learning presented in college.

:clap:

 

[mp31guitar]

This has turned out better than I thought. Great discussion.

 

[captainsousie]

Very well said profpar. That's what happens when education is done right. It can happen from a public schooled student too but the odds are against them for the reasons you state plus a few.

This has turned out better than I thought. Great discussion.

Yeah, I wasn't expecting anywhere near this level of civility.
@Chris. Thanks, and well said yourself.

 

[zekest]

Wait until all schools adopt the CORE curriculum that Jeb Bush and others have been pushing. Then, all the good work dedicated teachers, like Cris's wife do is meaningless because they will be forced to teach out of the government supplied plans. When children are taught that 7+4=10 and as log as the kids can explain how they came to that answer, they get a passing grade - no judgment.
That is fine as long as they plan to do a mindless job like becoming a politician, but what if they want to make pipes?

 

[pitchfork]

Interesting thread. Good points about a wide range of things.
I would just add that the general trends identified in the OP and in the responses aren't confined to children. Unfortunately, all of us are treated like children more and more these days. Whether it's being told to "shelter in place" every time a lone nut or two goes nuts, having to get a pat-down or a virtual strip search every time you fly on a plane, or being told by the local mayor that your soda cups are too big, a great deal has in fact changed a lot in the last 12 years or so. Coalsmoke's point is well taken, but I would argue there has been a real sea change in the degree to which various authorities try to micro-manage, control and monitor our every move. All for our own good and safety, of course.

 

[captainsousie]

Wait until all schools adopt the CORE curriculum that Jeb Bush and others have been pushing. Then, all the good work dedicated teachers, like Cris's wife do is meaningless because they will be forced to teach out of the government supplied plans. When children are taught that 7+4=10 and as log as the kids can explain how they came to that answer, they get a passing grade - no judgment.

You may want to do a bit more research on that one. Common core's got problems but unless all my recent professional development and all the information from the CC development companies is wrong, those ain't it.

 

[rebornbriar]

Just as bad in the Uk I'm afraid, if not worse. As I heard someone saying last year - the problem is that the government needs to stop treating adults like children - and children like adults.
Sums it all up nicely I think.

 

[bigboi]

I agree with Profpar. Being an Educator in a 2 yr college(community college) we were told that we were the ones who have to get students prepared for 4year higher educations. The students I see in my department some of them are sharp but some of them scare me in trying to prepare them for ancillary medical professions. Sometimes I get in trouble because I will fail a student for not using critical thinking skills that could possibly kill someone. They say, I am being to harsh and try to lighten. BS I say. I don't back down because these guys need to pull up there panties and start using common sense. It is sad that our school systems have failed in teaching reasoning skills.

 

[shaintiques]

I work for a church that has a private school. We started a Clay Pigeon team this year, I'm the head coach. The school paid for me to become an NRA certified shotgun coach. I get to teach kids how to shoot and gun safety. We just had our first scrimmage against another school yesterday. It was fun because some of the kids had never shot a gun until a month ago.. I think perhaps public schools are less tolerant.

 

[rayje589]

As a product of public schooling I like to think I turned out okay. But now everything I read about school's and how absurd they have become has made me second guess ever sending any children I may have through it.

 

[piperl12]

Ok I had to wade in on this one. There are times when you read something and it doesn't even qualify as a WTF moment but rather a deep sadness for what we are handing to our children. I have attached a link to a CBC newscast in which an Ontario Soccer association has taken the soccer ball out of soccer it boggles the mind how STUPID these people are. Honestly what the hell happened to natural selection. Should we not have bred this nonsense out of society? It's a day I am ashamed to be Canadian when I read this drivel.

http://www.cbc.ca/thisisthat/mobile/touch/blog/2013/09/03/to-ensure-every-child-wins-ontario-athletic-association-removes-ball-from-soccer/

 

[phred]

Having survived New Math, the switch from Civics to Social Studies, and the growing pressure to have schools teach "Life Skills" classes that cover topics that parents used to pass on to their kids at home, I can safely assure all of you that the stuff you're pointing out is nothing new - every generation is convinced that the kids today are dumber and less motivated than the generation before. Where now it's video games and banning tag, before it was saxophone music and automobiles spoiling America's Youth. The same language used to condemn twerking was used to lament the use of idiotic slang like "twenty three skiddoo" and "hot-cha-cha"...
There is nothing new under the sun, and this too shall pass.

 

[swampmouth]

OK, I was born 4 days after JFK. They got what they wanted and found out they wanted more. I have seen worse every year. Recently I had my guns confiscated for over 6 years. Everybody is a suspect. What did I do wrong? Homeschooling(until I was illegally abducted), hunting(not in 6 years), raising my own food, brewing & vintning, heating with wood? I did everything right and was punished. Yet what I did made me suspicious. It's not going to get better. I've been in the system. It's a growth industry designed to employ people who can't get jobs in more typical venues.

What did I do wrong? I'm a pipesmoker. Independent, freethinking, intelligent(I was tested during my divorce,court ordered), and a pain in the ass to the authorities. You can have my pipe when you pry it from my dead hand, still smoking.

 

[brian64]

There is nothing new under the sun

Very true...in terms of a global, historical perspective. But there are new things in terms of the life of a nation. Nations rise and fall...which is nothing new. We are a relatively young nation to have already gone from a Constitutional Republic to a decaying Empire. So while there is nothing new under the sun, it does not mean real, substantive changes have not occurred in a given society...and changes that are much more significant than just slang terms and passing fads, imo.

 

[phred]

So while there is nothing new under the sun, it does not mean real, substantive changes have not occurred in a given society.

Point taken - but a lot of real, substantive changes have occurred in previous generations as well, and many of them have, in time, been rolled back (Prohibition, for example). Perhaps my own choice to remain child-free has given me the luxury of taking a more global, historical perspective - but an awful lot of the "good ol' days" rhetoric that I hear sounds really, really familiar, speaking as a student of history.

 

[swampmouth]

My homeschooled kids knew more about computers than me when they were 4.They were prepared for life at 12. If I ever see them again, they'll probably tell me they just want to live their lives. Hopefully they won't be hindered by nationalist, socialist oppression.

 

[lordnoble]

While this thread has stayed civil (for the most part), it has run its course. If I were to let it go for much longer, I wouldn't be surprised if it broke the "No Politics" rule, which it has skirted several times. So rather than wait for that to happen, I'm closing it. Thanks!
-Jason