The auld Peterson hallmark issue

[LiamClanNastey]

So, we know that Peterson didn't use the UK Assay office for Hallmarks between 1939-1968. However, I came across the attached as a 1960 hallmark and all the other "missing" dates.

So, is this a Dublin hallmark or and English one on a "what-if Peterson had used it" basis?

 

[OzPiper]

Those are English hallmarks
Lion = England
Leopard’s head = London

Corresponding to Peterson’s London Made era

 

[LiamClanNastey]

Those are English hallmarks
Lion = England
Leopard’s head = London

Corresponding to Peterson’s London Made era

So, likely to be the "what if" scenario?

 

[OzPiper]

So, likely to be the "what if" scenario?

Back in the days it was pretty much what you wanted to stamp on the pipe. A lot of pipes stamped Made in London/England were in fact of French manufacture but “finished” in the Old Dart

But Peterson did have a pipe making factory in London as early as 1899.
This closed in 1969/1970 (Pipedia)

 

[LiamClanNastey]

Back in the days it was pretty much what you wanted to stamp on the pipe. A lot of pipes stamped Made in London/England were in fact of French manufacture but “finished” in the Old Dart

But Peterson did have a pipe making factory in London as early as 1899.
This closed in 1969/1970 (Pipedia)

Thanks OzPiper. The French part is interesting. Presumably they were still called Petersons? Or was the French company using its own name?

 

[LiamClanNastey]

I've just seen St Claude in "the book" - using Algerian and Moroccan Briar.

 

[LiamClanNastey]

Apparently the French didn't put their names on the pipes they produced. (between the wars)

 

[OzPiper]

Thanks OzPiper. The French part is interesting. Presumably they were still called Petersons? Or was the French company using its own name?

Sorry for misleading you.
I meant that a lot of English pipe companies bought French stummels or even finished pieces, added some silver adornment and then labelled them as “Made in London/England”

I have a Peterson African meer adorned with Dublin hallmarked silver, which I bought new in the mid-1970s.
I strongly suspect that this came out of the Isle of Man meerschaum factory which made pipes for several well-known brands.

 

[ashdigger]

Back in the days it was pretty much what you wanted to stamp on the pipe. A lot of pipes stamped Made in London/England were in fact of French manufacture but “finished” in the Old Dart

But Peterson did have a pipe making factory in London as early as 1899.
This closed in 1969/1970 (Pipedia)

I own an 1894 Peterson with Birmingham Hallmarks.

 

[Ahi Ka]

I’m confused by the question. Are you saying you have a Peterson pipe with 1960 London hallmarks? If so, I’d love to see it.

 

[paulfg]

Sorry for misleading you.
I meant that a lot of English pipe companies bought French stummels or even finished pieces, added some silver adornment and then labelled them as “Made in London/England”

I have a Peterson African meer adorned with Dublin hallmarked silver, which I bought new in the mid-1970s.
I strongly suspect that this came out of the Isle of Man meerschaum factory which made pipes for several well-known brands.

As you say
A 1970's Meerschaum Peterson would be Tanganikan (Tanzania) meer made by Laxey pipes IOM and maybe having the band added in Dublin.

Laxey Pipes Ltd. - Pipedia

pipedia.org

 

[LiamClanNastey]

As you say
A 1970's Meerschaum Peterson would be Tanganikan (Tanzania) meer made by Laxey pipes IOM and maybe having the band added in Dublin.

Laxey Pipes Ltd. - Pipedia

pipedia.org

Thanks Paul

 

[RustiePyles CPG]

Peterson made plenty of pipes in London during that time, London hallmarks are not uncommon on Peterson's.

 

[LiamClanNastey]

Peterson made plenty of pipes in London during that time, London hallmarks are not uncommon on Peterson's.

OK - so they would have the London Hallmark? That's interesting. is that the one I attached earlier?

 

[RustiePyles CPG]

OK - so they would have the London Hallmark? That's interesting. is that the one I attached earlier?

Yes they generally they have London Assay office hallmarks on them, but not always. Hallmarks are a tricky business. Often times large pipes companies would make their mountings in one place and make their pipes in another or even have their mountings made by an entirely different firm. These mountings would be sent in bulk to whatever assay office could accept them at the time. British silver assay was done in London, Birmingham, Edinburg, & Sheffield. It's not uncommon for any single pipe factory to use any one of these or all of them. The stamped, assayed, silver would then be returned to the factory to then be mounted on pipes. Pipes made in London would have most likely utilized the London assay office, but if a firm had manufacturing facilities in multiple locations it might send over silver mountings to one location that had been assayed in another location. Meaning that a pipe made in London could have Dublin silver work on it and visa versa. Singleton & Cole pipes of that era show up with any one of the four assay marks on em, and as @ashdigger said, he's got Petes with Birmingham marks. There are no hard fast rules with brit silver mountings on pipes.

 

[LiamClanNastey]

Yes they generally they have London Assay office hallmarks on them, but not always. Hallmarks are a tricky business. Often times large pipes companies would make their mountings in one place and make their pipes in another or even have their mountings made by an entirely different firm. These mountings would be sent in bulk to whatever assay office could accept them at the time. British silver assay was done in London, Birmingham, Edinburg, & Sheffield. It's not uncommon for any single pipe factory to use any one of these or all of them. The stamped, assayed, silver would then be returned to the factory to then be mounted on pipes. Pipes made in London would have most likely utilized the London assay office, but if a firm had manufacturing facilities in multiple locations it might send over silver mountings to one location that had been assayed in another location. Meaning that a pipe made in London could have Dublin silver work on it and visa versa. Singleton & Cole pipes of that era show up with any one of the four assay marks on em, and as @ashdigger said, he's got Petes with Birmingham marks. There are no hard fast rules with brit silver mountings on pipes.

That's a great help! Interesting stuff. Cheers.

 

[tobakenist]

I own an 1894 Peterson with Birmingham Hallmarks.

Ireland was part of Great Britain then.

 

[tobakenist]

The main part of my Peterson Collection are London Made, made in England, just to be different, only my newest Petes are Dublin made.

 

[ashdigger]

The main part of my Peterson Collection are London Made, made in England, just to be different, only my newest Petes are Dublin made.

I have quite a few Made in England. Those are great finds.

 

[LiamClanNastey]

Yes they generally they have London Assay office hallmarks on them, but not always. Hallmarks are a tricky business. Often times large pipes companies would make their mountings in one place and make their pipes in another or even have their mountings made by an entirely different firm. These mountings would be sent in bulk to whatever assay office could accept them at the time. British silver assay was done in London, Birmingham, Edinburg, & Sheffield. It's not uncommon for any single pipe factory to use any one of these or all of them. The stamped, assayed, silver would then be returned to the factory to then be mounted on pipes. Pipes made in London would have most likely utilized the London assay office, but if a firm had manufacturing facilities in multiple locations it might send over silver mountings to one location that had been assayed in another location. Meaning that a pipe made in London could have Dublin silver work on it and visa versa. Singleton & Cole pipes of that era show up with any one of the four assay marks on em, and as @ashdigger said, he's got Petes with Birmingham marks. There are no hard fast rules with brit silver mountings on pipes.

That's a great help! Interesting stuff. Cheers.

I have quite a few Made in England. Those are great finds.

where did you buy them. Shops or online?