Stupid Smoking Ban

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judcole

Lifer
Sep 14, 2011
7,491
39,551
Detroit
Joe runs a restaurant. Anyone has the right to go into that restaurant and order a meal. That's the law. Likewise, Joe has the right to deny service to anyone who is disruptive or violates the stated policies of his place: if he has a sign up that says "No Shirt - No Shoes - No Service", he can deny service to someone who comes in without a shirt on.

Absent any laws on the subject,Joe also has the right to allow - or forbid - smoking in his place. People can patronize that establishment - or not - as they chose. Someone like my daughter, who is allergic to tobacco, can choose not to exercise her right to frequent that place. Now, if someone chooses to go in there, even if they are allergic, and know what the policies are, and still complain, they are, at the very least, a jerk. Likewise, people who go into a non-smoking place and light up is not only a jerk, they can be booted out. That's the way it should be.
Ideally, everyone would be considerate of other folks. If I had my way, there would be public places - restaurants and bars, in particular - where people who choose to smoke could congregate, as well as establishments for people who choose not to do so. Unfortunately, we seem to be going through a phase where way too many people are concerned about their own rights, and way too few people are being considerate of the rights of others. They're not talking to each other, or listening to each other - they're just yelling at each other.
Tobacco users are getting the short end of the stick, right now - but let's be honest,folks, for too long non-smokers were the ones getting the shaft. I hope we get into a situation where there's some balance, but I am afraid I won't see it in my lifetime.

(And, yeah, saying that you can't smoke in a smoke shop is just plain silly.)

 

topd

Lifer
Mar 23, 2012
1,745
11
Emerson, Arkansas
I would put a cabinet near the door and offer these to visitors.... :)
398px-Gas_mask_MUA_IMGP0157.jpg


 

dervis

Lifer
Jan 30, 2012
1,597
3
Hazel Green AL
My wife is very allergic to peanuts. So I’m taking Logans to the highest court in the land. They are purposely not letting her go into their restaurant AND ITS HER RIGHT. They have peanuts just sitting on the tables and its WAY more deadly that smoking to a person with the allergy. She can’t visit a Logans and none of you care. ITS HER RIGHT Wait ....no its not.... STUPID Smoking Ban.

 

judcole

Lifer
Sep 14, 2011
7,491
39,551
Detroit
Failing analogy. Sorry. Your wife can avoid eating peanuts if they are in an establishment. My daughter can't avoid tobacco smoke in the same place.
I agree,btw, that it should be the decision of the restaurant owner. There should be choices for everyone. I said that in my previous post. There should be places for smokers,and places for non-smokers.

 

taerin

Lifer
May 22, 2012
1,851
3
@TOPD I would do that if I owned a business it was legal to smoke just for the laugh!
@Jud Any law set to deny us acess to legal products in any public place is just plain unconstitutional. No one should have the right to legislate the current non-smoking laws we currently have in place because there will always be non-smoking places to go, even bars because there is always a market for it. Making it illegal everywhere is like making penuts illegal because some people might die from them if they are not careful about what they order. I believe that was the point that Dervis was trying to make and it is a good one. Nany policies are not constitutional, they never have been, defending the law, because it is the law is just silly. What America has turned into makes me want to leave for a country with some actual freedoms, I turn around and I realize there are not any left!

 

judcole

Lifer
Sep 14, 2011
7,491
39,551
Detroit
defending the law, because it is the law is just silly.
I must not be making myself clear. Let's try again.
1. I agree that the owner of an establishment should be able to set the policies for that establishment.
2. I disapprove of legislated smoking bans.
3. People like my daughter need to have places to go, too. Although there never used to be places like that, I think there will be places like that now because more people do not smoke.
4. If a law is in place, it should be applied fairly to everyone, until it is repealed.
5. People need to talk to each other, not at each other.
:puffy:

 

puffy

Lifer
Dec 24, 2010
2,511
98
North Carolina
I hoped when started this that I could express the following opinion.I feel that there is a difference between a public place and a private business.I feel that smoking policies in a private business should be left to the owner of that business.I have absolutely no problem with those who choose no smoking.I just feel that smoking bans have become more inclusive than should be legal.For the record I never took my pipe into a restaurant even before the smoking bans out of consideration for others.

 

locopony

Part of the Furniture Now
Jun 7, 2011
710
3
I would love to open a place..... bar, grill, tobacco shop. Smokers only no nonsmokers allowed. No politicians either. The sighn out front would read.

No nonsmokers,

No politician

No fascists

No religious fanatics

No nannies

No do gooders.

 

dervis

Lifer
Jan 30, 2012
1,597
3
Hazel Green AL
Jud -- I think you and I are on the same page more than I have implied with my comments. At the very least you are a father that has/is showing concern for his daughter. There is nothing bad that can be said about that. Also we agree that non-smokers need places just as smokers need places. Kudos to you sir.

 

topd

Lifer
Mar 23, 2012
1,745
11
Emerson, Arkansas
On a serious side: I do believe in the law of the land. Different communities will make their own local ordinances we have to abide by, even if we don't agree with them. But I strongly believe that laws and local rules should not be 'written in stone' with no exceptions allowed. For instance:

Here in south west Arkansas, Columbia County is dry. No alcohol sales, no bars and no night clubs. But the local VFW Post is exempted. We can go in and have a beer and smoke our cigars or pipes. Non military types can be invited and signed-in by a member to enjoy. Non drinkers and bible thumpers need not drop by if they wish not to be involved. Now what's wrong with that.....

 

brian64

Lifer
Jan 31, 2011
10,083
16,203
On a serious side: I do believe in the law of the land. Different communities will make their own local ordinances we have to abide by, even if we don't agree with them. But I strongly believe that laws and local rules should not be 'written in stone' with no exceptions allowed. For instance:

Here in south west Arkansas, Columbia County is dry. No alcohol sales, no bars and no night clubs. But the local VFW Post is exempted. We can go in and have a beer and smoke our cigars or pipes. Non military types can be invited and signed-in by a member to enjoy. Non drinkers and bible thumpers need not drop by if they wish not to be involved. Now what's wrong with that.....
Absolutely nothing wrong with that...as long as the exemption applies to any and all private clubs.

 

topd

Lifer
Mar 23, 2012
1,745
11
Emerson, Arkansas
****Absolutely nothing wrong with that...as long as the exemption applies to any and all private clubs.****
It absolutely does here, but it just happens that there aren't any. One is in the planning stages and plans to open next year. I'm looking forward to it.

 

brian64

Lifer
Jan 31, 2011
10,083
16,203
It absolutely does here, but it just happens that there aren't any. One is in the planning stages and plans to open next year. I'm looking forward to it.
Sounds good. Prediction: if it catches on, and such private clubs become popular and fairly numerous, the local restaurant owners will probably get together and get the law changed. : )

 

judcole

Lifer
Sep 14, 2011
7,491
39,551
Detroit
I'm glad we all understand - we are really on the same page. Private clubs, like the VFW Hall TopD mentioned, should have much more control over their establishments than a place that is open to the public. If the place mentioned in the OP is open only to members - a private club - then it is a totally different kettle of fish than if anyone can walk in and have a cup of coffee and a sandwich, or whatever.
I still hope that some day the pendulum swings back a bit, and folks try harder to accommodate each other.

 
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