SG 1792 Flake Question

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cosmicfolklore

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Aug 9, 2013
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I just take my ration, put it on a paper plate, toss it in the microwave for 12 seconds, and pack it before it cools, so that the oils that make up the flavors don't dissipate, and smoke away. This wakes up the flavors and really makes them sing. I don;t exactly fold and stuff it neatly, because my stock of it came all jumbled up, but I am not rubbing it out either, just sort of crush and jam it in there, ha ha. I do sometimes have to relight. Although I love the flavor, I cannot keep a steady cadence with it, because that would kill me, ha ha. So, I have to remove the pipe periodically for a sip of coffee and defibrillation, ha ha. So, relighting is just a given for me with this one.

Glad to hear that someone else loves a full flavored tobacco also.

 

cigrmaster

Lifer
May 26, 2012
20,248
56,848
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Sarasota Florida
SG Full Virginia Flake is very similar to 1792 and here is what I do to keep it smoking nicely.

I cube cut it into very small cubes. I then let it dry out for at least two hours. I then load said tobacco into a group 4 Dublin and voila, I get a great smoke every time. Give it a shot and let us know how you make out.

 

crusader

Can't Leave
Aug 18, 2014
399
347
Nebraska
Is the bulk stuff just as good? I see P&C carries it in bulk and typically I do not order from them because it seems to take up to a week to get stuff shipped to me in Ne. So I normally stick to SP.

 

cigrmaster

Lifer
May 26, 2012
20,248
56,848
67
Sarasota Florida
crusader, I stock SG Best Brown Flake, St James Flake and Full Virginia Flake in bulk. I have smoked the tinned version of all three and I cannot tell the difference. I would assume the 1792 would be fine in bulk. I have tried 1792 a couple of times and did not care for the Tonquin Bean flavor but I have never smoked it aged so I am aging a tin to see if I will like it with some age on it. It is a very unique tasting blend for sure.

 

saltedplug

Lifer
Aug 20, 2013
5,192
4,989
It is the taste of the tonquin bean flavor and the high-voltage nicotine that are the allure of 1792. But it is the tonquin that apparently combusts at a higher temperature than the tobacco that causes the many relights. I have a lot of 1792 in the cellar and most of it is drier than I would like, but what amount of moisture is optimal as it affects combustion and flavor remains a judgment call. Other than avoiding the extremes, is it true that particular tobaccos perform better at 12% vs 14%? I don't think anyone knows other than those who are able to detect the nuances while they smoke. I too have problems keeping 1792 lit, but given the low moisture of my stash, I am disinclined to dry it further given the impact this might have on flavor. So I rub it out two iterations past the point that I normally rub out flake, and I still have too many relights.
It would seem to me that 1792 likes being lit because this ignites more of the tobacco, but as it burns past that point the higher temperature needed to combust tonquin dies down; and the adjacent layer of tobacco resists combustion, absent the light. Yes, that layer burns, but not as vigorously, and the coal dies out.
I don't see any way around this, but as it just happens that I've been working on this issue with 1792, this is what I'm going to try next: enlarging the airway and draft. I have an Edwards Algerian briar canadian where the draft hole is just a smidge above the bottom of the bowl. The pipe smoked just fine to the halfway point but then needed more relights than your average pipe. Though the location of the draft couldn't be changed, its diameter could, so I enlarged the airway with a small diameter wood file. Given that it is a 7" pipe, the file wasn't long enough, so I couldn't enlarge the draft, but even with just opening the airway a bit, it smokes better; and I am in search of a longer file. So I'm going to go to work on the Barontini's airway and draft; there's that collector that advocates a 4mm? draft? Whatever it is that's as big as I would go. I'm also going to experiment with a more loose pack as the draft should then be able to suck more air per puff through a pack that is less dense.
I think only the Mac Baren management know how to smoke a flake rolled and stuffed. Though the optimal fold can be discovered through trial and error, the smoking cadence needed to burn whole flake is an entirely different matter, worthy of a project of some duration.

 

mso489

Lifer
Feb 21, 2013
41,211
59,146
Isn't 1792 famous for ghosting? With the soapy-floral aromatic flavors? At least, I think it's one that you smoke in a designated pipe, even if you usually don't designate pipes for Latakia and such -- I don't. But if you like it, you like it. No one has ever said it's too mild.

 

saltedplug

Lifer
Aug 20, 2013
5,192
4,989
Yes, 1792 will ghost. But I don't think you can describe the flavor of tonquin as either soapy or floral, which adjectives though often used to describe Lakeland tobaccos as a whole, do not apply to 1792, whose tonquin casing tastes nothing like Condor's. No one knows exactly what is in the Lakeland flavorings as they are proprietary. Not even management knows, according to Pease. All they know is that a barrel labeled "rose geranium" is applied to Condor, and others to others. But SG/GH are straight-forward about 1792's tonquin flavoring.

 

cosmicfolklore

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Aug 9, 2013
36,465
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MSO, I am a hater, detester, repulsed by all that is Lakeland. The soapy grandma flavor is just one that strikes at the heart of my ire. But, I really like 1792. It may have a tad of that bean stuff in it, but it doesn't have a rose geranium oil stuff that I think of as a Lakeland taste. So, maybe it is from the Lakeland area, but I don't put it in the same genre at all. I smoke it in any of my pipes that i would normally smoke a Virginia in. I don't get a ghost at all.

Now, if it were one of those grandma's soaps blends... I would have to just destroy the pipe afterwards.

 

cosmicfolklore

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Aug 9, 2013
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Actually, Woodsroad had posted lists that has the complete ingredients to all of the Lakelands. By English law they cannot hide that information. Or, maybe it is European law. Ha ha, I am not clear on the specifics. But, the bean stuff is not nearly as bad as that rose geranium oil, which is the exact same fragrance used in those 1950's - 60's rose scented soaps that every grandma used to have in her bathroom. Yuck, yuck, yuck.
The bean just adds a very very slight taste to the tobacco. What I like is that strong dark Virginia, maybe an African Virginia.

 

saltedplug

Lifer
Aug 20, 2013
5,192
4,989
Cosmic, you really feel the tonquin is lightly applied? To me the stuff reeks of tonquin both to the nose and taste. Though the tobacco can certainly be tasted, calling the resulting flavor dark VA, not basically tonquin, to me is a misreading.
Thank you for pointing out Woodsroad's list,

 

cosmicfolklore

Moderator
Staff member
Aug 9, 2013
36,465
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You know 4nogginsmike, you could be right. I concede that it could be heavily applied in the tin. My stock is from a bulk. I have not ever had a tin of this. So, it just might be that straight out of the tin, it is more heavily flavored. Sometimes a bulk can loose a bit of the aromatic qualities. So, disregard that part of my comment. But, in the bulk version, I only taste the dark strong cosmopolitan-like tobaccos over any flavorings. Out of the tin, I have no idea. But, I am not afraid of smoking the bulk version in one of my Virginia pipes.

But, the flavors I do detect are not that soapy rose geranium floral stuff. Just that bean taste.

I do prefer Dark Flake "unscented" to 1792, because I had rather have just the pure tobacco taste, but that bean taste doesn't put me off, at least in the amounts that are found in the brick bulk orders.

 

salewis

Can't Leave
Jan 27, 2011
412
0
Try baking 1792 at 250 degrees for 2 and a half to three hours. The tobacco will taste better and be dryer but not too dry.

 

bigpond

Lifer
Oct 14, 2014
2,019
18
Prepare the tobacco the way you want to smoke it, place it on a flat, exposed surface until it is dry (depending on wind/relative humidity this should take about an hour), pack the bowl until the draw is slightly constricted and smoke it this way:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0o8Sfg6EH9k
Works like a charm for me with anything that is relight prone. Of course, if it bends and doesn't break it isn't ready for flame yet.

 
S

seadogontheland

Guest
My first run in with this flake was my last...the cob, full tin and contents of my stomach all hit the trashcan at the same time. :P

 

saltedplug

Lifer
Aug 20, 2013
5,192
4,989
What follows is the first time I've tried to get a deeper understanding of Lakeland blends, the tobacco but more the flavorings. After that are some general remarks.
Perhaps Russ Ouellette's comments on them in tobaccoreviews in his introduction to his "Lakeland Brickle" would help by way of introduction. "Over the past decade, the popularity of the Lakeland tobaccos, with their stout body and unusual flavors, has exploded. In fact, they’ve grown to such a point that availability is now a big issue. What differentiates these blends from everything else are their strength and the old-fashioned “scents” they use. They also make quite a few of their tobaccos in the form of flakes, cakes and ropes."
1792 from what I now understand is not really a Lakeland, but as it is highly flavored and odd to the initiate can be adequately discussed with them. My first reaction was that it was very strange, and very strong. I couldn't keep away from it, however, attracted to both of these qualities but smoked it in small amounts, with a tin here and a tin there for nearly a decade. It in fact at times still continues to confuse my palate; the taste impression that I come away with can be very different from what I deem its real taste, basically tonquin, with adequate tobacco flavor support.
I've read many times the estimation that the tobaccos in Lakelands, and by that term I mean specifically those made by the former SG and now SG/GH, that are highly flavored with rose geranium, ot tonquin, etc., are very good or excellent; specifically I've read this about 1792. Maybe, but given the amount of flavoring that is used, these blending houses might be choosing the substrate tobacco by how well it soaks up the topping/casing, and perhaps also by how well it burns given that casing. Though the contention that the base tobacco is of high quality may be true, I find it challenging to get more than a nominal tobacco flavor from 1792, as tonquin dominates. The flavors of Ennerdale flake are described as "A background flavour of Almond is enhanced with the addition of fruit flavours, vanilla, and the special 'English type' flavours, which give this tobacco its distinctive, yet typical "English Aroma" associated with the UK best selling brands such as Condor and St Bruno." Doesn't this description seem to indicate a boatload of casing? And if so wouldn't the tobacco substrate be more likely chosen not for excellent taste but by its ability to carry the casing, and thus manipulated, burn?
Glengarry Flake would seem to be more lightly flavored, "with the addition of some special Virginia casings to enhance the natural sweetness of the leaf, finished off with a light top flavor of Honey Dew and other sweet flavorings which all combine after pressing to provide a mild sweet gently aromatic smoke." Grasmere would seem more lightly scented as "an overall top-note flavour of English Rose and Geranium." More lightly flavored, these two flakes would need better tasting tobacco, as would Coniston Cut Plug and Condor that are not so dominated. Bosun Cut Plug would appear to be not dominated, as it is described as "with only slightly over 50% (54%) flue-cured Virginias from Brazil, Zimbabwe and Malawi and 31% dark fired leaf this is a fairly strong smoke. There is also some sweeter sun cured leaf from Malawi and rich cigar type notes." "The special Virginia casings complement the top notes derived from the addition of sharper flavours including oil of cloves and rose geranium."
Finishing this look at the tobaccos themselves, more general remarks follow.
By an inexplicable shift in my palate, I never liked rose geranium scenting until this year, but I was convinced that I would love Condor before I smoked it, and now I like it very much. Poking around online looking at tobaccos not distributed in the US I found that GH makes a version of Dark Plug scented with rose geranium; Guantley's has it for ~$180.00/pound, but it is not distributed in the US.
There is a great deal of interest in and writing about Lakelands, and such is very well done by misterlowercase here:
http://pipesmagazine.com/forums/topic/lakelands-an-attempt-to-understand-the-famous-gawith-scents
Loving Condor has put me on the Lakeland trail, and the history and complexity of what the Lakeland blenders have done I find very interesting, as I'm up for something new in the tobacco way given years of adherence to the school of thought to which I was introduced when I started smoking, that natural tobaccos were superior to flavored, and given that blending techniques could fashion endless variations using only them, what was the point in looking for flavor elsewhere; and that any flavor achieved by additives was therefore unneeded or possibly a cheap trick to increase revenue. Everyone wants to profit from their business, but I think dismissing the entire category is done more from ignorance than any point such comments make. Saying that Lakelands taste/smell like granny's perfumed panties certainly indicates aversion but beyond that doesn't say very much. Applying several casings and tracking down which tobaccos shine the best with them, or vice versa, has much difficulty and art as the complex blending of natural tobaccos.
Mr. Pease is ambivalent about scenting, although he ends with a strong accolade, " I’m not an ardent fan of Eu d’OldLady in my tobaccos, though there are some wonderful, more delicate scents being used by my friends at the traditional UK houses. But, the whole of the Lake District picture is something quite beyond drenching a bunch of baccy with Jean Naté and being done with it."
We might end with more of Mr. Ouellette's description of making "Lakeland Brickle." "We start with a combination of Virginias (mostly red), along with dark, tangy Burleys (which add depth, spice and strength) and infuse them with traditional Lakeland-style flavors such as Rose and Tonquin Beans (among others), but with a light hand to avoid the “soapiness” that some people dislike. We then heat-treat it and put it under pressure to further develop the flavor and body," I read thoughtful blending with thoughtful application of additives.

 
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