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perdurabo

Lifer
Jun 3, 2015
3,305
1,581
Is this a FDA probe? Honestly, the OP hasn't responded. Of course the OP has a life and can't spend every waking hour on this forum. Duh.
I'm always suspicious of these one time ambiguous post. Last time I checked eating can kill you, I mean what is this? It's like we gonna hear "Let's round them up!" If we say, "You less likely to get cancer of the mouth if you smoke a pipe moderately." Anyone else getting this?

 

perdurabo

Lifer
Jun 3, 2015
3,305
1,581
Then we get into second hand smoke. Oh God! Nicotine evaporates almost immediately upon coming in contact with the air around you. Has anyone seen a Death Certificate that said, "John Horner died of second hand smoke!" The answer's no. The second hand smoke diatribe is propaganda. Plain and simple.

 

philobeddoe

Lifer
Oct 31, 2011
7,546
12,247
East Indiana
I know this much, high stress is going to kill you faster than anything you smoke or eat. Pipe smoking has helped me relax and destress more times than I care to count, I firmly believe that pipe smoking has contributed positively to the quality of my life and it has ADDED years to my life, years I would have lost to stress, had I not had a pipe to comfort me in my darker moments. My father already lies in a grave that came much to early, a death that was hastened by the high blood pressure he had throughout his adult life, in part due to a poor diet, but in large part to a highly stressful job and no way to release this stress. He bottled it all up and it prematurely aged him and he died much too young.

 

perdurabo

Lifer
Jun 3, 2015
3,305
1,581
So what are the facts to second hand smoking? What If I told you that I have a friend that did clinical stuides with cigarettes and second hand smoke. What if I told you that most cases second hand smoke wasn't even a factor, but the environment in which people worked. Wow. What If I told you this friend, stated that there is no scientific data supporting what you stated on this forum, Thomas. Now, of course, this is Hearsay, but so was your post, frankly. Let's dispense with the hyperbole, no one has died of second hand smoke.
Now to something completely different. This same individual has been and is currently envolved with Cannabis Studies. She told me the other day, as of right now, there is 0(zero) research indicating that cannabis is of any medical Use whatsoever.

 

jpmcwjr

Modern Moderator
Staff member
May 12, 2015
26,199
30,134
Carmel Valley, CA
I would like to point out that the sous-chefs responsible for cutting up vegetables in restaurants are 80% more likely to have cuts on their fingers than those who merely eat the food.

 

phil67

Lifer
Dec 14, 2013
2,052
7
I do not have the facts so I might be incorrect but I understand there is a study that shows that pipe smokers live longer than non smokers.
No offense intended, but that has to be the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard! So yes, you certainly don't have the 'facts' and are incorrect.

________________________________________
Yes, there are health risks associated with any form of tobacco use. There are several articles about pipe smoking and the health risks associated with it. It is a personal choice if you are willing to accept these risks, if not then the best advice I can give is not to smoke.
My exact feelings and it sums it all up quite succinctly.

________________________________________
Do I regret smoking a pipe? HELL NO, all the cool characters from Lord of the rings smoke, like Gimli son of Gloin, Gandalf and even those hobbits.
Uhh... you do realize that those 'cool' characters are fictional.

 

randelli

Part of the Furniture Now
Nov 21, 2015
914
5
Death is brought on by swallowing small amounts of saliva over a long period of time.

 

thomasmartin

Can't Leave
Jul 13, 2015
324
1
Unesco world heritage
Just one of the most recent the systematic reviews: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/26627181/?i=6&from=passive%20smoking&filters=MetaAnalysis
The evidence regarding the risks of SHS is so overwhelming that denying it would be like denying that the earth turns around the sun. Disclosure: I'm a physician with an MPH working in public health. So I am perhaps a little "biased" on the matter. That's also the reason why I tend to stay away from health related topics on this forum. But sometimes I cannot resist.

 

thomasmartin

Can't Leave
Jul 13, 2015
324
1
Unesco world heritage
This one is a litte older: Mattias Öberg, PhDa, Prof Maritta S Jaakkola, PhDb, Prof Alistair Woodward, PhDc, Armando Peruga, DrPHd, Dr Annette Prüss-Ustün, PhDd,

Worldwide burden of disease from exposure to second-hand smoke: a retrospective analysis of data from 192 countries, The Lancet,Volume 377, Issue 9760, 8–14 January 2011, Pages 139–146
(...)"Worldwide, 40% of children, 33% of male non-smokers, and 35% of female non-smokers were exposed to second-hand smoke in 2004. This exposure was estimated to have caused 379 000 deaths from ischaemic heart disease, 165 000 from lower respiratory infections, 36 900 from asthma, and 21 400 from lung cancer. 603 000 deaths were attributable to second-hand smoke in 2004, which was about 1·0% of worldwide mortality. 47% of deaths from second-hand smoke occurred in women, 28% in children, and 26% in men. DALYs lost because of exposure to second-hand smoke amounted to 10·9 million, which was about 0·7% of total worldwide burden of diseases in DALYs in 2004. 61% of DALYs were in children. The largest disease burdens were from lower respiratory infections in children younger than 5 years (5 939 000), ischaemic heart disease in adults (2 836 000), and asthma in adults (1 246 000) and children (651 000)."

 

jvnshr

Moderator
Staff member
Sep 4, 2015
4,617
3,896
Baku, Azerbaijan
Thomas, thank you very much for the link. It was an interesting read for me.
I'm a physician with an MPH working in public health. So I am perhaps a little "biased" on the matter.
That's good to know as in my own opinion you should be biased. All the physicians are probably biased on this matter and it is a good thing indeed.
It is not an easy task to mark or find people that have been exposed to second hand smoke. When you are doing a research about the association between smoking and cancer (or any other disease) you have bunch of smokers on your hand. They know the amount of smoked cigarettes per day, their physical abilities, etc. On the other hand, if you are doing a research about the association between second hand smoking and ischaemic heart diseases, etc. you won't have many test subjects available. Even if you have them, they won't know the total time or amount of the smoke that they have been exposed to second hand smoke. Even the analysis states that
Usually, never-smokers or non-smokers were studied.
It says "usually" but not "always". Long story short, I am still not convinced. Put bunch of people in a cell, smoke 20 cigarettes per day and expose them to the smoke for 30 years, there you have bunch of test subjects. Then do the same thing with cigar smoke, then with pipe smoke, then e-cigarette smoke, etc. Then every tobacco smoker will accept second hand smoke thing. As it is an unethical thing to do, we will probably never know the true effects of second hand smoke.
Anyway, I am also one of those who believe that second hand smoke might have some bad effects on human beings so I prefer staying away from everyone while smoking, especially if there are any kids around. And I suggest every other smoker to do the same thing.

 

perdurabo

Lifer
Jun 3, 2015
3,305
1,581
Thomas your still printing hyperbole. These are statistics that are propagated, Not clinical studies. Drumroll..........because clinical studies for secondhand smoke that have been done are to few and far between to get any useful data, plus the existing health conditions of the subject have to be taken into account.

 

hextor

Part of the Furniture Now
Sep 20, 2015
642
6
I have heard too that, if you sit down more than 4 hours, it considered a health risk, it was being compared to smoking cigarettes, and also don't forget about bacon, that was being compared more dangerous than smoking a cigarette and also there are articles out there that says that using the phone to talk might expose you to radiation thus giving you ear cancer.

 

perdurabo

Lifer
Jun 3, 2015
3,305
1,581
The Second-Hand Smoke Charade
By Dominick T. Armentano

September 28, 1998

Smoking tobacco products over a long period of time may entail significant health risks. Acknowledging those risks, millions of Americans have quit smoking because they estimate that the possible costs exceed any possible benefits. That’s their right. Alternatively, millions of other Americans have voluntarily assumed the risks of smoking and they continue to puff away. And that’s their right, too.
Or is it? One of the important arguments for restricting smoking is that it can endanger innocent nonsmokers who inhale environmental tobacco smoke (ETS). Indeed, many states (led by California and Florida) have decided over the last few years to severely restrict smoking in commercial establishments on the basis of a 1993 Environmental Protection Agency report that classified ETS as a “Group A Carcinogen,” that is, as a significant risk to health.
It now turns out that the influential 1993 EPA report “Respiratory Health Effects of Passive Smoking: Lung Cancer and Other Disorders” was as phony as a three-dollar bill. State officials and private businesses that believed that ETS was a public health danger (and not just a nuisance) were completely misled by the EPA. And, of course, so was main street American public opinion.
Are those the views of a vast right-wing conspiracy? Hardly. They are the sober conclusions of a gutsy federal district court judge in North Carolina named William Osteen, whose recent ruling invalidated the very foundation of the EPA report. Judge Osteen’s views coincide with a Congressional Research Service analysis released in late 1995 that had serious reservations about the EPA report.
You don’t have to be a fan of smoking to agree that the EPA is a regulatory renegade spinning wildly out of control on this issue. Even several veteran career employees of the agency have gone public recently to protest its “junk science” and its irrational environmental zealotry.

Judge Osteen determined that the EPA had “cherry picked” its data and had grossly manipulated “scientific procedure and scientific norms” in order to rationalize the agency’s own preconceived conclusion that passive smoking caused 3,000 lung cancer deaths a year. In addition, Osteen ruled that the EPA had violated the Radon Act, which was the agency’s authority for disseminating its “de facto regulatory scheme” that intended to prohibit passive smoking. The agency responded, embarrassingly, with an ad hominem attack on the judge, not on the cold logic of his arguments.
As a result of the EPA report, many bans on smoking in public places have been introduced. One would think that any such ban would be based solidly on scientific studies of ETS exposure in public places. In fact, the EPA did not even evaluate the studies on smoking in public places. Instead, the EPA’s analysis was based on 11 U.S. studies that examined the risks of contracting lung cancer to nonsmoking spouses married to smokers, a different matter altogether. Yet none of the studies in the original sample reported a strong relative cancer risk associated with ETS.
Still, the EPA was determined to prove that ETS was a serious carcinogen that justified stringent regulation. To do that, it simply set aside 19 of the original constellation of 30 ETS studies and then, defying all scientific standards, simply changed the “confidence levels” in the statistical analysis from 95 percent to 90 percent. When the highly manipulated smaller sample finally “confessed” that passive smoking was a health risk, the EPA proudly announced it had “proven” its preconceived conclusions.
And the sordid tale gets worse. The EPA chose to omit entirely from its analysis two recent U.S. ETS studies that had determined that passive smoking was NOT a statistically significant health risk. Worse for the EPA, including those studies with the “cherry-picked” 11 produces a result that shows no statistically significant health risks associated with passive smoking, even at reduced confidence levels. In short, even employing the EPA’s own corrupt methodology, ETS was simply not a “Group A Carcinogen,” as the agency had boldly asserted.
You don’t have to be a fan of smoking to agree that the EPA is a regulatory renegade spinning wildly out of control on this issue. Even several veteran career employees of the agency have gone public recently to protest its “junk science” and its irrational environmental zealotry. Congress should pull the plug on any EPA regulation that cannot be justified by evidence that is demonstrable, compelling, unequivocal and significant. None yet exists with respect to passive smoking.
Let's be honest, most studies on second hand smoke were done in the 90's.

 

lotharen

Starting to Get Obsessed
Jul 26, 2016
184
10
@skydog Thanks for quoting that post. I was about to look for it myself. I had remembered reading that during my forum searching.

 

aldecaker

Lifer
Feb 13, 2015
4,407
45
@thomasmartin- When you say you are in "public health", is it the colossal Orwellian bureaucracy that gives us this FDA jackboot-in-the-face type public health, or is it the treating people who can afford face piercings and neck tattoos aplenty but can't afford a doctor visit for their children type public health?

 

perdurabo

Lifer
Jun 3, 2015
3,305
1,581
jvnshr- there nothing wrong with showing a fellow individual the common courtesy, smoke can stink and you can't argue that it's not an allergen, perique makes me sneeze.

 

stranger

Might Stick Around
Apr 27, 2016
86
0
There is a risk to everything we do. I look at all the other hazardous situations and fumes that I am exposed to on a daily basis and for some reason the risk from a pipe doesn't seem so bad.

 
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