Pipe Pricing

[Paul_G]

I am new to pipe smoking and the culture surrounding it. I was hoping somebody could explain how pipes are assessed as far in their value and pricing. I understand that most pipes are handcrafted and take a large amount of skill and time to create. I find the different pipe shapes and finishes aesthetically fascinating. It truly is an art form. However, I can't quite wrap my head around the difference between a $200 and $1500 pipe. They look almost completely identical or close to it yet such a vast difference in price.

I would love to hear people's thoughts and educating me a little more.

 

[tobefrank]

A lot has to do with the name and reputation of the shaper. Not always, but most often you can see subtle differences in the shaping which makes a more expensive pipe more 'perfect' than a less expensive one.

 

[gamzultovah]

Want, knowledge, supply and demand....and not necessarily in that order.

To be honest, I’ve had basket pipes smoke better than Eltang’s and Becker’s, and I have no name pipes that are shaped better than Ivarsson’s IMO. It’s all subjective.

 

[tobefrank]

Oh, and a lot has to do with the shaper's skill in shaping a pipe that displays the grain of the wood in the best possible way.

 

[Zack Miller]

Save your money for the tobacco.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

In art, you have painters, some make their way up to the top of recognition and their work becomes worth more, because of the money invested in marketing them to that level of fame. This would be like the pipemakers who hand make each pipe. Some are more famous than others, creating more demand, and much marketing had to go into that.
That doesn't mean that the lesser known artists or pipemakers don't do phenomenal work. it also doesn't mean that the best aren't capable of lesser work. It just means that they are known more widely across the planet. Look at how the Asian market gobbles up Danish pipemakers works.

Then, you have artists like Andy Warhol and other printmakers. They cranked out art prints and even paintings in factory-like conditions. Warhol's studio was literally known as The Factory. You can still get an oil painting of Cambell's Soup cans for about $200. But, a printmaker makes hundreds of the same image. They can sell 1000 prints for $100 a piece, whereas a painter would have to get a return of $100,000 to get the same return on their one-of work. This would be like factory pipes. Savinelli, Nording, Peterson, etc... cheap $100-200 pipes, some made on fraising machines or in workshops with workers focused on their one part in the assembly line.

When Ivarrson puts his year's work on a table, you will get a hundred or so pipes all different. But, when Dunhill puts its yearly production on a table, you will have rows of the same pipe.

What makes a Dunhill factory sell for more than a Nording? Marketing. More people know the history of Dunhill in a way that makes people want them more than a Nording. Can a Nording be better than a Dunhill, absolutely.

Marketing...

 

[Papamique]

The main difference, IMO, is that the higher priced pipes are luxury items as opposed to necessity items (tools).

Something becomes a luxury item by charging a high price, especially when compared to other pipes, being in limited supply, such as hand made pipes that are on back order or some collectible pipes that are no longer produced and/or were limited to begin with, being made of, or perceived to be made of, top quality materials and packaging, and advertised and endorsed by collectors and respected people in the pipe arena (also known as hype). These things can make a pipe more appealing for some people and thus more "luxurious" in their minds creating a higher demand and with the same amount of supply being offered the pipe becomes even more desirable which supports and encourages more endorsement.

Contrast this to a “tool” or necessity item which is priced moderately to low, supply equally or surpasses demand, is made of inexpensive material or inexpensive manufacturing, and is available immediately or in short order to everyone.

The two pipes may smoke the same but one is more of a luxury and the other gets the job done.

Of course there is middle ground but many people either can not afford a luxury pipe or choose not to pay for one because the less expensive pipe gets the job done. There are a few others that can afford the higher prices AND choose to make the purchase because they value the luxury item for what it is-a luxury and not a necessity.

* My definition of luxury item was gleaned from Wikipedia

 

[tschiraldi]

I'll add my 2 pennies. What Cosmic says is true and Dunhill is a good example, however, I think it goes deeper than simply marketing. First of all, I don't agree with your assessment that most pipes are hand made. Most pipes are mass produced by machines. Ma Hines chuck out the stummels, then they are fitted with pre formed stems. Many times even the drilling is done by a machine. The combination of cheaper materials and a faster, less expensive (and less precise) manufacturing means a pipe can be sold for less money and more profit. Very often this, IMHO, leads to pipes of inferior quality. I know, I know, many people here will vehemently disagree with me and wax poetic about how their $50 basket pipe smokes just as well as an expensive hand carved pipe. This is an oft argued subject. My view is that even a blind squirrel finds a nut sometimes. A machine may crank out some exceptional pipes... occasionally. The difference is, a machine will make sure h a pipe a much lower percentage of the time than an experienced artisan pipe carver who spends an untold amount of time Shaping, sanding, drilling, polishing the airway, cutting and shaping stems from rod stock, and many other processes, that a machine can never do with such precision! So the difference, to me, is that a bad pipe from such an artisan is the exception, while it's more of the rule with some mass produced pipes. Thus, the difference in cost. Add Cosmic's marketing differences, and there you go!

 

[Old School 3319]

I will give my opinion I personally don’t buy in to the high dollar pipes but then again I am a simple man I smoke Dr Grabow pipes and otc tobacco I have never smoked tobacco out of a tin but I would attribute it to the same as a name brand guitar over a cheaper brand they both play well a Gibson plays a little better than an epiphone but the player makes a lot of difference

 

[Grangerous]

Pipe Collector or Tobacco Enthusiast? You can be either or both. If you are the latter, don’t be persuaded that your favorite tobaccos will all transform into Nirvana smokes because of the price you’ve paid for your pipe.

 

[Old School 3319]

Pipe Collector or Tobacco Enthusiast? You can be either or both. If you are the latter, don’t be persuaded that your favorite tobaccos will all transform into Nirvana smokes because of the price you’ve paid for your pipe.

I guess I am neither just a pipe smoker

 

[ashdigger]

Because Baskin Robbins makes more than vanilla.

Threads like this always devolve into class warfare. It’s extremely unfortunate.

 

[sasquatch]

A 200 dollar pipe is usually popped together from pieces in a factory, from a box of 200 identical pieces. It would be handled for a grand total of about 10 minutes during various polishing procedures. A 1500 dollar pipe is designed, manufactured from rare materials, hand made in every detail - stem dimensions, curvatures, even the internal geometry, and the finish quite perfect, it takes days. Some people will pay for that, others not. Are you getting enjoyment from a 20 dollar pipe? Great. Is it a piece of crap that tastes bad when you smoke it? Not great, find something better. There's value or values in play at every price point.

 

[gamzultovah]

Because Baskin Robbins makes more than vanilla.

Threads like this always devolve into class warfare. It’s extremely unfortunate.

What are you talking about? They call me ‘Saturday’ because I have no...you know...

 

[ashdigger]

What are you talking about? They call me ‘Saturday’ because I have no...you know...

The reason all things are made that cost less or cost more. People’s taste and budget. Cheap shoes costs less thbespoke shoes.

With pipes it’s the same, but I’m not going to out poor someone or out extended pinky someone. We like what we like.

Just because someone can’t imagine spending more money on something doesn’t make them “a bad person” vs someone who spends an exorbitant amount.

Some like vanilla ice cream, some like rocky road.

In my opinion, the only people I feel sorry for are the ones who want pineapple on their pizza

 

[Jshogan2]

Time in artisans' hands drive a LOT of price, then comes scarcity into the calculus as well (low annual production numbers, lack of distribution for finished pipes, flawless grain on the stummel, rare materials used as accents, etc.). Brand perception and popularity definitely can come into play as well.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

$1500 isn't even a drop in the bucket on what one is supposed to pay for an engagement ring. It's not even a monthly mortgage payment for the majority of Americans. I have several pipes from the $1500 and up range. It's not totally unrealistic, unless you are just making it from paycheck to paycheck or you just don't value your smoking tools. Either of those is totally ok.
I mean, I will never be able to afford a Lamborghini, but I can easily afford the Lamborghini of pipes.

And, yes the attention to detail is wonderful, but I would never ever ever say that a $1500 pipe smokes any better than some bucket pipes I've picked up along the way. I just never buy a pipe like this because I have some insane notion that I am going to get $1500 worth of smoking excellence out of them. In fact, I don't ever even smoke some of them, because they just don't fit my smoking style.

And, I have never gotten a bucket pipe that didn't smoke well, because I wouldn't walk out of a shop without first checking the drilling.

It's marketing. And, in people's heads. However, that doesn't mean that I don't put some value in owning some of these pipes. I don't see a single pipe as a waste of money... even some of them that I just keep in drawers. I still cherish owning them, and will occasionally pull one out to smoke it.

And, I do have one Becker that by luck of the tobacco spirits has made it an extremely great smoker. It smokes as well as one of my beloved $200 Nordings. ;o)

For me and my experience with my pipes that I have collected over these years, I put that "some are better engineered" notion to hogwash. More marketing bullshit, IMO. However, I am still collecting, and will still buy more pipes in this hand made range, because even the most expensive pipes are still cheap as hell.
Compare the cost of pipes and tobacco to firearms, motorcycles, or even photography... and how can anyone say it's too expensive?

 

[Grangerous]

Not a soul is wrong here.

There are many ways of enjoying this or any other hobby.

The only thing wrong would be to look down upon or up upon, depending on your point of view, how someone else enjoys it.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Class warfare can be fun. I am sorta in the middle. I like to make fun of a friend of mine who got stuck with a Maserati when her insanely rich husband died and she is a horrible driver, so you see this really expensive car jumping and jerking up the street with bangs and dings all over it. Stupid rich people. And, I like to giggle at the guys who use plastic wrap to replace a broken side window on their truck.

But, one day you might catch me dressed like a prince in $1000 shoes and a silk shirt to go get a haircut, or walking up and down the aisle of Walmart wearing my bathrobe, socks and sandals... cause I don't give F what anyone thinks of me, ha ha.

 

[DAR]

Bottom line is that a $200 pipe can smoke, feel and be just as good as a $1500 pipe unless you are quite knowledgable about pipe making, pipe makers and the tiny things that don't really matter when talking about actual smoking qualities.

Aesthetics is an important part of pricing a pipe. Of course if it takes an inordinate amount of time to make the design or if it's made from some magical source of briar it may be worth more just for those reasons.
If you find a $50 pipe that is technically well made, smokes well and you like the way it looks, it can be your "$1500 pipe". I think many of us have that very inexpensive pipe that is just right.