Oriental's and VaPerOr's Experiences

[jah76]

So I've been falling down the rabbit hole of enjoying several blends with a more "Oriental" bend to them. I have a few thoughts and then a few questions.
1. The term Oriental is HUGE and confusing. One minute it's used to describe Latakia but blends with Latakia are called Latakia blends and then there's the whole Balkan-gate discussion. Then on another tobacco the Oriental seem to used as a catch all for many different regionally grown leaves on their own. These blends seem to be considered just "Orientals".
2. Then there seems to be a big gap between English "Oriental type" blends and Virginia-Perique Oriental blends. The tastes range as far as wide as the differences between your standard English and VaPer flavors. This is confusing because they seem to have the same ingredients. For example I believe a light Oriental leaning English like Lane's Leo has the exact same ingredients as McCelland's Oriental #6 yet the tastes are light years apart.
3. So then I'm guessing the classification comes down to presentation in terms of the amounts of certain tobaccos in each blend itself? I mean when we get down to it...it seems like every tobacco in world is made of the same DNA yet it's arrangement leads us to the huge myriad of differences much like we humans have.
So. Based on my experiences and love of Lane's Leo, McCelland's Tudor Castle, and McCelland's Oriental #6, does anyone have any experience with the following blends and are they in a similar vein?
VaPerOr leanings?-

NYPC Bedloe's Island VaPer Oriental

McClelland Orient 996

McClelland Grand Orientals - Yenidje Highlander
Oriental forward Englishes?-

McConnell's Oriental

McClelland Club Samovar
Thanks in advance.
Edit: Spelling is hard.

 

[lestrout]

jah - you are so right that the term 'Oriental' is huge. It covers a lot of ground, sometimes confusingly including the Latakias. My first thought is that there are a large number of individual Oriental leafs, which differ a lot in appearance and taste. I'm working my way through the McClelland Grand Oriental series which splits out the individual varietals and helps me discern the differences. Then there is the issue of batch and vintage variations, as well as the processing differences. If you just think of the ways stoving, steaming, pressing, etc affects the flavor of 'simple' Virginias, there is a lot of room for creating different flavors. There's a reason we have only a handful of master blenders, like Greg Pease, RussO and the late Bob Runowski.
hp

les

 

[trucha]

I havn't tried any of the above mentioned blends but I do love the few oriental forward blends that I've tried. The last tin i cracked was c&ds sunday picnic which is now in my top 5 tobaccos and if you want to try a vir/o blend i would highly reccommend it. I also really want to try the McC grand orientals as I think that the direction of showcasing a particular leaf from a particular region is under utilized in pipe smoking. I would like to see more of this from the main blenders. I was actually just thinking of starting a post asking for thoughts on the grand oriental series but if anyone wants to give their thoughts here it would be greatly appreciated.

 

[jah76]

Les, thanks for the response. It's a really interesting sub-"genre" of tobacco in my opinion.
Trucha. I'll have to try that. I haven't had good luck with C&D tobaccos as odd as that sounds. I tend to find McCelland and Rattray fit in my wheel house better.
The only Grand Oriental I've had is #6. It's got just a tiny bit of Latakia in it, but the Virginia's have the familiar McCelland tang but aren't as present like they can be in flake form in St. James Woods, Beacon, and Tudor Castle. The Orientals are soft sometimes cedar like, sometimes creamy and herb like. I smells fantastic when you snork it out of your nose. I am almost through my first tin, but I will be buying more.
I haven't tried any blends with just Virginias and Orientals. I usually like some Perique or Latakia to give it more "fullness". Plain Virginias always feel thin to me.
I'm really looking forward to trying some new blends on my next order.

 

[escioe]

To add to the confusion, sometimes the same leaf has different names. For example, Izmir is also called Smyrna.
If you want to try how varied Izmir / Smyrna can be, try GLP Embarcadero and McClelland's Smyrna #1. These are deeply different blends that purport to use the same basic mixture of leaf.
Also worth trying from the McClelland Grand Oriental Series is Yenidje Highlander.
And you're right, there are definitely oriental-forward latakia blends. I find that looking at tobaccoreviews.com can help bring to light the latakia blends that you might like better than others.

 

[lestrout]

jah - McClelland has 2 series with the name Oriental: the original Oriental Mixture group comes in green labels and is numbered. Several years ago, when Mary locked in the arrangement with some Greek village farmers on individual varietals like Yenidje and Smyrna, they issued a neat series of blends, each with a singular varietal blended with VA - this is the group I'm learning on.
hp

les

 

[jah76]

Escioe, thank you for the recommendations.
Good catch Les. I meant the Mixture line.
Coalsmoke thanks for the info. I always plan out and stalk my orders, this one is proving to be the most fun yet.

 

[cortezattic]

I just recently discovered H&H's Sierra Nevada. Wonderful Oriental/VaPer blend (ribbon cut). Working on my 2nd tin right now.

It's Oriental forward, but balanced nicely by the Virginia(s); and the Perique lends a plummy wine-like goodness without the peppery pinch for which it is normally renowned. Although a natural blend, it's sweet enough to attract a following from the aromatic smoking crowd, IMO.

 

[Perique]

This is making me think about GL Pease's Cairo.

 

[lochinvar]

The Virginia-Oriental mixtures are my favorites. With the Virginias giving backbone, the Orintal can play of the sweetness with varying levels of spice, citrus and aromatic pungency. They often have a very rich earthy sweet spice to them, like the smell when you're plowing good dirt on a hot spring day. The lack of latakia keeps the tastes from overcrowding. The Grand Oriental line is fantastic, especially the Drama Smyrna and Samsun. There are some great flakes that combine Virgina and Oriental, McClelland No. 24, Ashton Revival Pebblecut and Butera Blended Flake. I have had mixed results with GLP Cairo, several times I found it sublime and several times subpar, but plan on giving it another run soon.
As far as Oriental forward blends with Latakia, Rattray's Red Rapparee is one of my favorites. Smoking it is like smoking sweet, smoky, citrusy razorblades (in a good way). LEO reminds me of Rapparee's little brother. LJ Peretti of Boston has several very good, very old Oriental forward blends, Tashkent and Oriental No. 40 being my two favorites. Pipes2smokes Compton's Macedonian is a huge Oriental forward Balkan that is at the top of the game....and is priced as such.
I also like to order straight Oriental from P&C and mix it in with blends I like, to see how they are with extra Oriental. Ive really yet to find a situation where I like less oriental.

 

[cortezattic]

Nice post, Andy (lochinvar)! You provided some valuable insights. Obviously a well educated palate. :clap:

 

[jah76]

Excellent info. Thanks everyone, I really do appreciate the insights. These forums and tobaccoreviews.com really help in navigating a huge sea of tins and leaf.
I like Red Rapparee. It took me a bit to settle into, however. I found air pocketing it and slowing down a bit on it really helped. In hindsight that can probably be said for most blends.