Organic Tobacco

[F4RM3R]

You can get organic Virginia and burley whole leaf. processing these into nice smokelable product is fairly easy, so I’d suggest this route if you are serious about organic pipe tobacco.

Unfortunately any other leaves, especially processed ones like perique, Latakia, Kentuckyare harder to come by.

as some members have mentioned. The problem isn’t so much the organic leaf, but that the processing and additives need to be organic as well. Not sure if there’s organic PG…..:p

 

[anotherbob]

You can get organic Virginia and burley whole leaf. processing these into nice smokelable product is fairly easy, so I’d suggest this route if you are serious about organic pipe tobacco.

Unfortunately any other leaves, especially processed ones like perique, Latakia, Kentuckyare harder to come by.

as some members have mentioned. The problem isn’t so much the organic leaf, but that the processing and additives need to be organic as well. Not sure if there’s organic PG…..:p

doubtful on the pg it's not considered a natural product because of the process to create it.

 

[odobenus]

If you ever want a scary rabbit hole, check out the source of raw phosphate they spread on the fields of Virginia tobacco - much has been found to be slightly radioactive and those little morsels are pernicious.

I know a bit more about cigar (black) tobacco growing methods than cigarette/pipe tobacco. Cigar tobacco, at least in the DR and Cuba, essentially could qualify as "organic" tobacco, primarily fertilized with decomposed animal manure, and de-pested by handpicking. The last thing a producer wants is some persistent chemical altering the flavor of their premium leaf. I do know they chembomb the hell out of Virginia leaf, and burley to a slightly lesser extent. I shudder to think what goes on in Africa or India, which don't have squat for environmental regulation.

Same goes for wine - organic wine is a bit of a hustle and excuse to charge more as most large, established growers cannot risk ending up with inferior product due to the products they use during the season. Unfortunately, a lot of the popular pesticides, herbicides, and fertilizers do not attenuate readily, but live on in the plant matrix.

As mentioned above, the USDA has claimed dominion over the word "organic" and made it a high-priced brand. Unless you're doing very little business, you have to pay dearly and deal with a boatload of hypocritical red tape to obtain the right to use that word. This is why so many farmers' markets have side-stepped the powers that be by inventing their own terms, such as "eco-ganic," "certified naturally grown," and the like. Farmers are one short conversation or pamphlet away from winning over customers who want chemical-free produce, but don't know how corrupt the "organic" movement has become.

well said

 

[kwg116]

Mcclelland produced a straight Virginia blend called Organically Grown flake.

From tobaccoreviews.com :

The Virginia in this organically grown tobacco is of the finest quality.

Notes: Pipestud had mentioned the problem McClelland had with this tobacco. My understanding is that they were NOT forced to stop production; they chose to. Mike had procured this wonderful organically grown Virginia leaf and planned to tin and sell it as "organic tobacco," which it is. The problem arose because McClelland had processed it using the same machinery as was used to process non-organic tobacco. This is a no-no. No organic product may contain any trace of non-organics. So, Mike sent this out as organically-GROWN, which it was, but was so disappointed and disgusted with the Federal nit-picking, he decided not to pursue the issue further.

View attachment 123002

I still have a few tins left of OGF. It was a fantastic tobacco. I cracked a tin about two years ago and enjoyed it.

 

[boston]

C&D used to have one. Organic Pipe Dreams. I may have a be tin, but never tried it and it was discontinued. I recall Craig worked hard to make that one happen.

 

[hoosierpipeguy]

Am I the only one who sees the irony of trying to find healthier ways to smoke? Why not just accept it's not good for your health and quit trying to rationalize it?

 

[Jaylotw]

I'm a certified organic farmer.

I don't see how organic tobacco would be healthier for the consumer, but for the land and environment it would certainly be better to grow it organically. The cost would go WAY up, though. Just growing lettuce in an organic setting is tricky enough, tobacco would be another level. I just don't think it's worth it for a farmer to bother. I know there are a few organic growers for American Spirit cigarettes, but they are labeled "organically grown," since I'm sure Am Spirit isn't willing to dedicate a line just to produce them.

I get frustration with the nitpicking, but as someone who takes being certified seriously, and follows the rules (and beyond) it pisses me right off when someone tries to sneak around the law and label something as Organic when it's not certified.

 

[Egg Shen]

Mcclelland produced a straight Virginia blend called Organically Grown flake.

From tobaccoreviews.com :

The Virginia in this organically grown tobacco is of the finest quality.

Notes: Pipestud had mentioned the problem McClelland had with this tobacco. My understanding is that they were NOT forced to stop production; they chose to. Mike had procured this wonderful organically grown Virginia leaf and planned to tin and sell it as "organic tobacco," which it is. The problem arose because McClelland had processed it using the same machinery as was used to process non-organic tobacco. This is a no-no. No organic product may contain any trace of non-organics. So, Mike sent this out as organically-GROWN, which it was, but was so disappointed and disgusted with the Federal nit-picking, he decided not to pursue the issue further.

View attachment 123002

I can understand why the government would want to keep the 2 lines separate but this alone probably kills any possibility of producing an organic blend for most companies, since now you would need a whole other equipment line and space in your facility for it, but that’s the easy part. The hard part is that at lot of these blenders are using presses and other equipment that just aren’t made anymore.

 

[Egg Shen]

Am I the only one who sees the irony of trying to find healthier ways to smoke? Why not just accept it's not good for your health and quit trying to rationalize it?

It’s not that I’m trying to gain health, it’s more about the environmental consequences of using all this shit on everything we grow. Think toxic algae blooms. For me eating organic is more about being a good steward of Earth.

 

[Egg Shen]

You can get organic Virginia and burley whole leaf. processing these into nice smokelable product is fairly easy, so I’d suggest this route if you are serious about organic pipe tobacco.

Unfortunately any other leaves, especially processed ones like perique, Latakia, Kentuckyare harder to come by.

as some members have mentioned. The problem isn’t so much the organic leaf, but that the processing and additives need to be organic as well. Not sure if there’s organic PG…..:p

Yeah I haven’t seen much outside of VA + burley. I know that the fire process on DFKY emits significant carcinogens, so because of that, organic certification may not be attainable (not sure on that). Latakia is fired too.

 

[Eastmon]

Interesting topic, but I can’t help but find it hilarious.

 

[BROBS]

Interesting topic, but I can’t help but find it hilarious.

Your avatar is cringe

 

[Jaylotw]

Yeah I haven’t seen much outside of VA + burley. I know that the fire process on DFKY emits significant carcinogens, so because of that, organic certification may not be attainable (not sure on that). Latakia is fired too.

I don't think carcinogens have much to do with organic certification or not. If they're using organic wood for the fires, and not say treated pallets or pellets with some kind of chemical binder, I'd bet it would still fly as organic if a producer was really concerned about it. There would of course be other steps in the process that might need addressed.

We have a HUGE list of chemicals we can use on the farm which are "organic." Some are carcinogenic, or reputed to be, or at the very least not something you'd want to eat or get on your skin.

Organic is a good thing for the Earth, which is why I practice it, however I just don't see a market for organic tobacco outside of one or two small producers. Getting a farmer to commit to growing organic is easy, but getting a manufacturer to do the same is pretty difficult. As soon as you start processing something organic, and wish to maintain its certified status is when problems occur and it becomes a headache.

 

[mso489]

I think "organic" is a conundrum. You can refrain from using insecticides, and that is an expensive but beneficial practice. But what's in the water and air in which the leaf crops grow? Some tobacco fields hereabouts grow in the omnipresent stench of industrial hog farms. Well, that's organic. How is smoking hog waste infused "organic" tobacco? It bears some thought. Some of the food purists shrug off the "organic" label as being essentially a fabrication, and they have a case. When you get into complex blends and flavorings, I think the concept is pure imagination. Addressing cleaner water and air is probably the best tactic overall, whether you smoke or not.

 

[Egg Shen]

I don't think carcinogens have much to do with organic certification or not. If they're using organic wood for the fires, and not say treated pallets or pellets with some kind of chemical binder, I'd bet it would still fly as organic if a producer was really concerned about it. There would of course be other steps in the process that might need addressed.

We have a HUGE list of chemicals we can use on the farm which are "organic." Some are carcinogenic, or reputed to be, or at the very least not something you'd want to eat or get on your skin.

Organic is a good thing for the Earth, which is why I practice it, however I just don't see a market for organic tobacco outside of one or two small producers. Getting a farmer to commit to growing organic is easy, but getting a manufacturer to do the same is pretty difficult. As soon as you start processing something organic, and wish to maintain its certified status is when problems occur and it becomes a headache.

Lol organic wood. I didn’t even think of that but yeah that’s another cost of production.

 

[Egg Shen]

I think "organic" is a conundrum. You can refrain from using insecticides, and that is an expensive but beneficial practice. But what's in the water and air in which the leaf crops grow? Some tobacco fields hereabouts grow in the omnipresent stench of industrial hog farms. Well, that's organic. How is smoking hog waste infused "organic" tobacco? It bears some thought. Some of the food purists shrug off the "organic" label as being essentially a fabrication, and they have a case. When you get into complex blends and flavorings, I think the concept is pure imagination. Addressing cleaner water and air is probably the best tactic overall, whether you smoke or not.

You can’t really control what particulate is on the air near an organic field nor what falls in the rainwater. The certification controls everything that can be controlled. There is criteria that must be met about adjacent uncertified fields in order to certify the field you want to grow organically on. Also to obtain the certification there can’t be non-organic pesticide, fertilizer, fungicide, nor can your seed be GMO. So it’s not a fabrication; it’s just not perfect. I could see the tracibility for flavorings being difficult and costly as you say.

 

[anotherbob]

I'm a certified organic farmer.

I don't see how organic tobacco would be healthier for the consumer, but for the land and environment it would certainly be better to grow it organically. The cost would go WAY up, though. Just growing lettuce in an organic setting is tricky enough, tobacco would be another level. I just don't think it's worth it for a farmer to bother. I know there are a few organic growers for American Spirit cigarettes, but they are labeled "organically grown," since I'm sure Am Spirit isn't willing to dedicate a line just to produce them.

I get frustration with the nitpicking, but as someone who takes being certified seriously, and follows the rules (and beyond) it pisses me right off when someone tries to sneak around the law and label something as Organic when it's not certified.

I've seen studies on orgainc tobacco and health and while far from conclusive (it takes years of people using it to really tell) it looks like there is little health benefit to the consumer for tobacco. Could be benefits to the taste and things like that.

 

[pantsBoots]

Am I the only one who sees the irony of trying to find healthier ways to smoke? Why not just accept it's not good for your health and quit trying to rationalize it?

So you don't support Vegan Methamphetamine or Fair Trade Corned Beef Hash?

 

[pantsBoots]

I don't think carcinogens have much to do with organic certification or not. If they're using organic wood for the fires, and not say treated pallets or pellets with some kind of chemical binder, I'd bet it would still fly as organic if a producer was really concerned about it. There would of course be other steps in the process that might need addressed.

We have a HUGE list of chemicals we can use on the farm which are "organic." Some are carcinogenic, or reputed to be, or at the very least not something you'd want to eat or get on your skin.

Organic is a good thing for the Earth, which is why I practice it, however I just don't see a market for organic tobacco outside of one or two small producers. Getting a farmer to commit to growing organic is easy, but getting a manufacturer to do the same is pretty difficult. As soon as you start processing something organic, and wish to maintain its certified status is when problems occur and it becomes a headache.

I like the cut of your jib. Many moons ago, when this city-raised country boy was getting started in agriculture, I worked on an organic peach farm in southern California. They sprayed every last drop of every permitted chemical while just barely maintaining Organic compliance. It was a great eye-opener early in my meandering career. People tell me I'm too much of a purist in my home gardens. That's why I grow just about every vegetable my region supports myself, folks - so I can enjoy my neuroses in peace.

I'd easily pay a couple bucks extra if some pipe tobacco manufacturer was putting their name on paper as sourcing tobacco free of synthetic ferts, assuming I liked the blend.

 

[Jaylotw]

I've seen studies on orgainc tobacco and health and while far from conclusive (it takes years of people using it to really tell) it looks like there is little health benefit to the consumer for tobacco. Could be benefits to the taste and things like that.

I could see it producing more robust plants, which may effect flavor or curing. As far as being healthier...nah.