New vs Estate Pipes?

[rockymtnsmoker]

New to the pipe collecting/smoking addiction and have some questions about "so called" estate pipes. It seems there are a handful of what I have heard called "deadmen's pipes" on the market at any given time - the kind of pipe that for a literalist like me are the "legitimate" estate pipes of a higher quality from the 50s to the 70s. These seem to be fetching upwards from $350 for a better known name.
There also appears to be a parallel market in "estate" pipes that are 1 to 5 or even 10 years old, smoked and unsmoked, whose original owners are very much alive. I wonder what percentage of these pipes are cycled back into the market just because the original purchaser chose to go in a different direction, or if it's more likely these pipes are found to be unsatisfactory on some level - e.g. they just aren't good smokers? These are the kind of pipes that are often priced at a level I find attractive - under $200, say.
I have 3 of these - two decent english briars and a Pete and have yet to have a completely enjoyable smoke - understanding well that there is a ton of user error at this point in my pipe smoking career : ) Having said that, smoked my first bowl in a brand new entry level Sav yesterday and experinced instant nirvana. Just a lucky combo of pipe/tobacco blend and packing/ puffing technique, or is something else going on?
Anyway, guess what I'm really seeking is your thoughts on whether the newbie is better off getting his feet wet with some good quality, new, entry level pipes and getting hisself some edumacation before venturing into the more complex world of estate pipes.

 

[tjameson]

Roth nice 10000th post!

 

[igloo]

Thanks Roth .Now write the book . ::

 

[nsfisher]

I agree with Roth. Myself, when I buy an estate pipe (of which I have many), it has to be at least 30+ yrs old. I prefer these to the new pipes made today. Except for Mr. Brogs, which I have 5. They NEVER fail to produce a great smoke. Estate pipes, new pipes, it is all up to the smoker to decide what your preference is. I think the kicker for me, is taking a long forgotten estate pipe and making it new again. I have one, a 1953 Dunhill Patent, that took me 12 hours to refurbish. I much preferred that, to receiving a New Dunny in the mail, ready to smoke. Once again mate, personal preference rules here.

 

[rockymtnsmoker]

Great feedback guys. Thank you for response. Seems many of you are collecting what again to my literalist mind are true estate pipes. My own pull is definitely in that direction, but I'm seeing a fairly steep learning curve on a lot of levels. So, Roth, about that book.... :D

 

[bentmike]

Roth's already wrote the book -it's in the form of 10,000 posts on this forum. :worship: For many years I was against the idea of smoking estate pipes but I eventually got over that and have a few wonderful mid grade estates in my collection. One kind of pipe I do prefer to buy only new are meerschaums. Watching the color develop from the beginning in the meerschaum is a very cool experience in my mind. I have been trying to concentrate on my cellar and slow down on the pipe purchases but I can see more meerschaums in my future at some point.
Welcome to the forum smoky.

 

[petergunn]

It seems there are a handful of what I have heard called "deadmen's pipes" on the market at any given time - the kind of pipe that for a literalist like me are the "legitimate" estate pipes of a higher quality from the 50s to the 70s.

I'm playing in that sandbox also but I will take a flyer on a lower tier maker from that era if the price is right and the pipe is unsmoked.

 

[voorhees]

I'm with nsfisher. Out of the 30 or so pipes I have, only 3 are new(Savinelli/Comoy(NOS)/Meer)all others are estate pipes. My biggest catch was a 1926 Patent Dunhill. Finding it and deciphering it and restring it was more fun that buying a new one.

 

[allan]

Not much to add once Roth is finished
I own mostly 'estates', of course meaning used pipes. Amongst everything already mentioned, one real positive note I'd like to say is that a pre-owned pipe is already broken in. I have found that I don't particularly enjoy breaking in a new pipe. If a pre owned pipe is carefully restored, it's just load up and smoke.
Of course the down side is if someone if finicky and compulsive about smoking someone's else's pipe-you know, their saliva etc. If one thinks about it enough, i suppose you can get disgusted about the thought.
Not me. I usually clean out a pipe prior to smoking it with an everclear using a cleaner, and go on my merry way.
The other issue brought up is the idea that buying someone elses pipe implies that that person had a badly made pipe and they were just trying to pass it on.
I don't necessarily agree with this thought. Pipes, like tobaccos, are liked and not liked by individuals with different tastes. One person's choice in tobacco (say, aromatic) is another one's, "Oh my God, how can you smoke that!" And, of course, buying a new pipe is no guarantee that it will smoke well, either.
Most of the pipes I own are previously owned and restored, either by a great seller like Mike at Briar Blues, or from ebay from a reputable seller/dealer.
Other than my Rad Davis' pipes which I purchased new, I am 90 per cent happy with my estates.
Allan

 

[pruss]

Morning friends.
@Rockymntn
I agree totally with the comments above. The answer to the question around what kind of pipe to buy depends totally on your preference which is likely somewhat predetermined by the $ you have available, the time you want to put into refurbishing/restoring/cleaning, and the availability of the make/shape/material/condition of the particular pipe(s) you're looking for.
I just started back into the hobby in November. I took the road of buying & refurbishing/cleaning, then re-selling estate pipes to finance my collection. My collection of smokers is now up to 13 pipes, and while I don't have a single pipe in my collection that is worth more than $200.00, I am pleased with the scope of my briars so far. Over time, I hope to be able to finance the purchase of high-grade pipes (new or estate) and to ultimately commission my first pipe. I have only, to date, purchased one new pipe for my collection. The rest are well loved, well re-conditioned, and great smoking Estates.
Cheers,
-- Pat

 

[brdavidson]

Great advice so far, I figured I'd throw in my 5cents as I have approached my pipe buying in a different manner. I began pipes smoking and collecting in late December 2012 and have to this point only purchased new pipes (with the exception of 2 new old stock pipes that had never been smoked, so to my eye they were new). There's really no good reason behind it other than I really didn't know enough about the value of estates nor did I know what I liked in a pipe so I didn't want to commit to something I wasn't sure to like. I read up on the best brands out there today, making the best quality for the price range I was interested in and made decisions based on research on these forums. Now I have a pretty good idea of what I like in a pipe, generally straight or quarter bent, light at least under 40gms, saddle bit for a narrower mouth piece. Now that I'm comfortable with what I like, I may start venturing into estates. I also have no refurbishing skills whatsoever nor do I have the time to invest in figuring that part out.
The advice above is all from people more knowledgeable than I, but just thought I'd throw out a slightly different viewpoint.

 

[pruss]

Now I have a pretty good idea of what I like in a pipe, generally straight or quarter bent, light at least under 40gms, saddle bit for a narrower mouth piece.

Now I know what pictures to post to whet your PAD whistle.
:twisted:
-- Pat

 

[brdavidson]

Like you hadn't figured that out already Pat!!!! I just picked up a Brebbia bulldog to see if I would like that shape and feel. Small in stature, which is what I was looking for, but love the feel of it. I'll be breaking it in at the trailer this weekend.

 

[numbersix]

You make some good observations Rocky - and in theory I would guess that a "true" estate pipe (whose owner has passed away) is more likely to be a better pipe than an estate from someone who's just looking to get rid of a pipe.
However - this is not always the case. I would bet that many of these still living smokers are just not as enamored with the style more than the smokability. I've sold some excellent smokers only because I didn't like the style or length of the pipe.

I have 3 of these - two decent english briars and a Pete

Pete's can be sketchy (hell, even Dunhill has been known to make a few clunkers). The safest bet is to buy from a trusted seller who will take returns. Then examine the pipe very carefully before smoking, make sure there's no charring, it's drilled perfectly, etc.
If all looks good and it's thoroughly cleaned (even retorted), odds are it will offer a solid smoke.

 

[plateauguy]

At first I had trouble with the thought of smoking someone's pipe. After seeing the restorations that Kashmir has done, I changed my mind.
I bought an older Rex bulldog and got started. It was very rewarding to revitalize a pipe that had probably been tossed in a box at a garage sale. I didn't start with an expensive pipe, or a pipe brand that I was familiar with. I looked for a well made pipe in a shape that I liked. It's turned out to be a great smoker. Just bought a 83' Comoy for my next project.

 

[pruss]

At first I had trouble with the thought of smoking someone's pipe.

You should have seen the look of disgust and fear on my wife's face when I told her what estate pipes were, and that I was buying two of them :mrgreen: My first two estate purchases were from eBay power sellers with stirling reputations, and I followed all of the cleaning and sanitizing tips I had gathered prior to smoking them. She became even less dubious after I started retorting my pipes.
-- Pat

 

[plateauguy]

Pat,

My wife thought she'd help me with the Falcon I'd bought. I was busy outside and the pipe was sitting on the kitchen counter (obviously a wrong move on my part).
I'll give her credit for trying, she took it apart and made up the purex/water solution (yep, for an aluminum pipe). After a 1/2 hour "bath" she pulled it out to find it discolored and splotchy. With tears in her eyes, she brought it out to me and said, "I've ruined your pipe." Thank God for Mother's mag polish, and elbow grease.

It is now a beautiful, shiny Falcon with a new bowl from 4noggins.

 

[dlattim]

Nine out of my 12 pipes are estate pipes bought off of ebay. They all smoke great and with the exception of one Dunhill all cost under $40. I'm certain I am due for a bad experience from ebay, but it hasn't happened yet. I have bought Stanwell's, Savinelli's, a Hilson and one Amphora. All good smokers. I buy the ones that are advertised to be completely restored. I check out the sellers reviews first and then pull the trigger. From my experience I have to advocate estate pipes from Ebay. Of course, even more reputable vendors can be found as roth states. I just seem to be getting better deals doing it my way. I'll let you know when I get a bad one and have to eat these words :wink:

 

[pruss]

The world of pipes is your oyster and there are countless pearls for the taking. Ask questions, learn about pipes, avoid anyone that tells you they are an “expert”, and stay away from any seller that treats you with disrespect and rudely.

:clap:

 

[tennsmoker]

My pipe collection is all over the place, a mixture of old and new. I’m not as organized as, say, Roth, or near as smart about pipes and tobacco.
I have just gone about collecting willy-nilly for the past four decades, but with an eye toward what might be considered historic English type pipes.
I have collected new Ashtons when the late Bill Taylor was making them. I have an estate Dunhill that dates to the 1960s, a new unsmoked Ferndown gold, a couple of estate pre-transition Barlings, a pre-Lane Charatan, old Algerian briar Edwards, Parkers, Hardcastle, new Petes, as well as a recent find, an estate Sasieni four-dot from the 1940s.
But then, later, I fell in love with Italian pipes. Now my collection includes new Ardor, Ser Jacopo and others, such as Savinelli new and estate.
So, I guess where this is going is to say that I have purchased and love my estate pipes, especially one given to me by a colleague who said it was from what he believed to be a a Tracy Mincer-era Custom-Bilt. It is a treasured pot. I clean up the estates, such as any cleaning I give a pipe: Everclear and pipe cleaner. Then light up.
Pipe collecting and smoking is one of the great hobbies. It is like collecting friends or souls. It allows you the freedom to go one way, then change downstream, with few consequences, as I have done. You will find that those pipes you bought three or four decades ago bring back not only fond memories, but also produce pleasant evening smokes.
Collecting, of course, is as individual as a thumb print. But there is no right or wrong way. One day you might find that billiards are the thing you enjoy most. Then in another year, it could be bent billiards. I once saw a photograph of the world-renowned philosopher Bertrand Russell with a beautiful bent billiard. I had to have one of the exact same black stain and design.
My physics professor in college was friends with Einstein. They smoked bents. I have several and still smoke and love my prof's favorite tobacco, SWR. And, yes, I smoked the old-time Revelation as well as the now new C&D Ephiphany, which is as close as it comes to the old. I was hoping the pipe and tobacco would rub off some of my prof's smarts. It didn't take.
And yes, I like to think that pipe smokers are the mind workers of the world. Ours is a contemplative society.
With that said, Rocky, you follow Roth’s advice and you won’t go wrong.