Why would there be a question? If the pipe was purchased from a reputable shop wouldn't that be enough? I mean, I wouldn't buy my pipes from back of a Yugo.
New Savinelli Tortuga - authentic or not?
- Thread starter CapnJimbo
- Start date
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Something, something, something...millenials, I suppose. I've seen a big uptick lately in posts here and on Reddit asking "is my pipe legit?" and just can't figure out why so many people are so skeptical of everything when 10 minutes of research would yield a solid avenue.
well about six months ago it was is my pipe totally useless because of some minor thing like not passing a pipe cleaner.
The average price of an estate Dunhill, let alone a new one can be several times that of a new Savinelli Tortuga.
What @sasquatch pointed out rightly is that there is no profit in counterfeiting a cheaper factory pipe.
Pipes costing high hundreds or four figures (??Dunhills, ??Danish artisans) is a different ball game.
What @sasquatch pointed out rightly is that there is no profit in counterfeiting a cheaper factory pipe.
Pipes costing high hundreds or four figures (??Dunhills, ??Danish artisans) is a different ball game.
Being able to pass a pipe cleaner was how they knew the Dunhills were fakes.
Because it's more reassuring to get real time answers from those experienced.
pretty close to what I was going to say. Lots of new people and they have questions and we got answers
The world of counterfeiting is like mushrooms, there is no way to eliminate this problem. Beautiful pipe, hope you enjoy it for many years to come.............
️
There can be money in it, same as faking a Monet, which is why I used the art analogy in my post. So if a guy shows up with a Bo Nordh, unsmoked, that no one has ever seen before, and wants to sell it for 15,000 bucks, the alarms start to ring and there are any number of ways to authenticate the pipe. And this stuff does happen, and the community experts examine the pipe and agree as to whether the thing is legit. Those Dunhills were tricky because they were an out-of-catalog shape and yet obviously made on Dunhill equipment (pretty easy to tell) and stamped with genuine (stolen) older Dunhill stamps. So in a sense... the fakes were real. (But they weren't what they were purporting to be).
It's worth faking a pipe if you can get a few thousand for it. But faking a totally ordinary pipe in order to sell it to a wholesaler... is ludicrous. Again, at a wholesale price of 70 bucks, you have to buy the briar and make a stem somehow, max profit is 50 bucks. How fast can you make your fake? If it's 5 hours, you are getting 10 bucks an hour, well below minimum wage. It's a dumb gambit.
Nor is the pipe in question worth any more or any less because it's missing the shield stamp. Pipes get mis-stamped all the time. Make a couple hundred pipes a day, you'll mis-stamp a few. It's no big deal.
My Tortuga is stamped ITALY, but I have a Savinelli Cocktail that just arrived from SmokingPipes that is stamped MADE IN ITALY. That stamp definitely exists in the Savinelli factory and they are using it.
Thanks to all, I think it only fair that I respond to those who took the time to respond. At this point this and other threads have convinced me that this pipe is not a counterfeit. The box, the enclosures, the adaptor and the construction all seem fairly well done. I do agree that this Tortuga 673 RustIc.
So far so good. But here's the rub. The leading pipe markings pictured database is HERE.. Please check it out.
If you do, you will see that most of the 90 Sav lines, most of them have the "S"/Shield stamped visibly on the bowl - but more important - out of the 90 lines, almost every one is stamped "ITALY" in all CAPS. My Tortuga instead carries "Made in Italy", not "ITALY", and that is very, very rare.
So my opinion is this. I tend to believe now, thank you, that this may well be a Savanelli - but because it is so stamped, I now wonder whether it is a second, and thus does NOT carry the "ITALY" stamp that appears on all but one of their 90 lines.
It does not match other Sav's reported here by others that DO carry the "ITALY" bowl stamp. What I am asking is this - not opinions on authenticity, but merely if your SAV, esp a Tortuga is marked "ITALY" OR NOT?
Gracias!
So far so good. But here's the rub. The leading pipe markings pictured database is HERE.. Please check it out.
If you do, you will see that most of the 90 Sav lines, most of them have the "S"/Shield stamped visibly on the bowl - but more important - out of the 90 lines, almost every one is stamped "ITALY" in all CAPS. My Tortuga instead carries "Made in Italy", not "ITALY", and that is very, very rare.
So my opinion is this. I tend to believe now, thank you, that this may well be a Savanelli - but because it is so stamped, I now wonder whether it is a second, and thus does NOT carry the "ITALY" stamp that appears on all but one of their 90 lines.
It does not match other Sav's reported here by others that DO carry the "ITALY" bowl stamp. What I am asking is this - not opinions on authenticity, but merely if your SAV, esp a Tortuga is marked "ITALY" OR NOT?
Gracias!
I hate to tell you this, but that site is VERY out of date. Take a look at the current Savinelli lineup and you will see that a large number of the current line is not listed. Many things have changed since this was last updated.
Good to know; however I checked a few of the leading Sav vendors, many of whose current and complete product lines have pictures of the bowl stamp. These are current, and I must tell you that what I suspected from the old database is still true. If there is one thing that Sav continues it's to include their company's famous "S"/shield stamp - and also - almost all the current line still stamps in all caps "ITALY" (not made in Italy).
The up-to-the minute rustic Tortugas all have the "S"/shield, every one. Mine does not. I would be curious if all those who own Rustic Tortugas report what their stamps are, and we can dispense with hypotheses and guesses. I now believe this is a Sav, but perhaps a second? I find it hard to believe that the decades old company "S"/shield stamp is missing from mine, when both the old database and current Tortuga Rustics have it.
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Honestly, it probably got chucked in the wrong box in whatever the step before stamping was. Or the person doing the stamp went for a cuppa & picked up the wrong stamp when they got back. Or...
In which case you have a rare sport, which is probably worth - if anything - more than whatever you paid for it (as with a misprinted postage stamp which got through QC).
It's very unlikely to be a second. It's just not in their interest.
In which case you have a rare sport, which is probably worth - if anything - more than whatever you paid for it (as with a misprinted postage stamp which got through QC).
It's very unlikely to be a second. It's just not in their interest.
