New Samuel Gawith Tins

[pantsBoots]

Please see the other threads.
Every single tin is vacuum sealed.
The plastic strip around the tin is a heat sealed anti-tamper device.

9 out of 10 of the tins I just bought did not hold their vacuum by the time they reached me and the lids came off as though they had been previously opened. Has there ever been talk of going to a round tin? It's not as attractive as a square or rectangular in my opinion, but they seem to hold their seal much more reliably.

 

[gawithhoggarth]

Thank you, much appreciated.

 

[gawithhoggarth]

As already stated every single tin is vacuum sealed. Each tin is placed by hand in the vacuum sealer and sealed. Then it is placed in the heat sealer to have the plastic anti-tamper device placed around it so there is absolutely no doubt that any tin could have been previously opened. We have new well designed square tins that seal well. A tin lid does not need to be very tightly on for there to be a vacuum seal, you do not have to yank the lids off or open with a coin. Just because the lid comes off fairly easily does not mean it was not vacuum sealed.

 

[eljimmy]

To address this yet again

1) Every single tin is vacuum sealed in the factory. Each tin is placed in the vacuum sealer by hand, it is vacuum sealed.
2) Just because the tin lid comes off relatively easily does not mean it was not vacuum sealed. In the past we had complaints that tin lids were too difficult to get off. You should not need to spend ages trying to get a lid off with a coin! A tin does not need to "pop" when opened to mean that the there was a vacuum seal. You should not need to really yank on a tin lid to prove it had a vacuum seal. Lids can still come off relatively easily and the tin was still vacuum sealed.
3) A year or two back the original suppler of the square tins stopped producing them so we had to find a new supplier. Despite rigorous testing and guarantees, these newer tins did not seal as well as we had hoped and were not as strong and so as a temporary measure we put in the cardboard inserts while we used up the supply and designed, sourced and received new tins. It can take many months to do this and so we cannot just switch to a new tin in a matter of days.
4) The heat seal is an anti-tamper device to ensure that tins have not been opened. It is not a "vacuum seal". The tins are all vacuum sealed before going into the machine that puts the plastic heat seal around the edge. It is two separate things.
5) The new tins all seal well, although of course no system is 100% fool-proof and many other factors come into play such as how the tins are treated in carriage and storage of which we have little control over.
6) Our tobacco is sold to be smoked and enjoyed. Not necessarily for long term storage.

First, I’d like to thank you guys for making such great tobacco. My purpose for posting this was simply a heads up. I totally understand production issues happen and I also understand that these tins travel a long way which can also affect your product. Personally, I purchase all I can because it simply isn’t that readily available and I have no issues with jarring it. Thank you for your reply/explanation , I appreciate it.

 

[beefeater33]

" I see there's a seal film around them but these can't be vacuum sealed."

Please explain your reasoning behind this. How do you know just from looking at the tin that it is not vacuum sealed? The heat sealed plastic around the tin is the anti-tamper device and as long as this is not broken then it is doing the exact job it is meant to be and showing the tin has not been tampered with.

Every single tin is vacuum sealed. Each tin is placed by hand into the vacuum sealing machine and then it is heat sealed separately.

At the end of the day we produce and sell our tobacco to be smoked, not for long term storage. So long as the tobacco is still good and high quality then that is what matters.

Wouldn't the loss of the seal do the same thing as the "anti-tamper device"?
Seems to me, if I received tins without seals, they may have been tampered with.
If the tins are truly sealed, then what purpose does this "anti-tamper device" serve, other than holding the lid on to the unsealed tin?

Please understand, I love your products. Absolutely top quality. But honestly, this seems shady, like you know there's a problem, but aren't owning up to it..............

 

[gawithhoggarth]

No, a vacuum seal is completely different to an anti-tamper device. You cannot look at a tin and say there is no seal or vacuum. Indeed even by opening a tin you cannot say categorically there was no vacuum seal as a tin can be vacuum sealed but still have a lid that comes off relatively easily. But with a security seal around it, you can certainly say that no one else has opened that tin from when it was done in the factory to when the end customer opens it to smoke the tobacco.

In the future there will no doubt be more requirements placed on tobacco products with regard to security. There are certainly other security seals being talked about.

The heat seal is to show no one has tampered with the product before it reaches the end consumer.

"But honestly, this seems shady, like you know there's a problem, but aren't owning up to it.............."

We were made aware of a problem with the old style tins not always sealing well, mostly after long shipping or storage situations and so went about re-designing and sourcing new tins. This is hardly "not owning up to" a problem. And on numerous forums in numerous threads I have addressed the issue. Again this is hardly being shady and not owning up to a problem. We noted the problem and responded with a new tin design. And as part of ongoing improvements, and due to some concerns by some customers that tins may have been tampered with before they reached the end consumer, we have opted to heat seal all tins with a plastic wrapper so that there is an anti-tampering device as well.

 

[beefeater33]

No, a vacuum seal is completely different to an anti-tamper device.

I understand this................
What is evident is the fact that without the anti tampering device, many of these tins would have their contents spilled out during shipping, do to the insufficient vacuum........
I'm not saying there is no vacuum on the tins, rather it's not enough to hold the lid on..............

 

[gawithhoggarth]

Ahhh, then I guess that means that I will no longer be buying any tinned blends from them. I really haven't been a huge Sam Gawith fanboy anyways. I wonder what they didn't just stick to selling bulk instead of inflicting their market with bad tins? ...just to make the extra money? That sort of thing pisses me off about a company.

Samuel Gawith's have long been sold in tins. The products have been tinned going back 100+ years!
Indeed it costs us far more to produce in tins than in bulk.
As already stated the tin manufacturer we used to use stopped operating and so we had to find replacement tins. This was not an easy thing to do but we now have a new designed better tin.

"When I buy tins in the store, I always give removing the lid a try before selecting them. When I get a shipment in from an online retailer, I go through and try to pry all of the lids off. If there isn't a seal, it will come off rather easy, if there is, I cannot pull the lid off at all without a coin to pry it off."

And this was one reason why we decided to also place anti-tamper heat seals around the tins so that someone could not go round trying to get the lids off tins in shops and thus breaking the seal and putting back for another person to buy. A vacuumed sealed tin does not necessarily need a coin to pry the lid off. A tin can be vacuumed sealed and still allow for the lid to come off without too much effort.

 

[cosmicfolklore]

Samuel Gawith's have long been sold in tins. The products have been tinned going back 100+ years!
Indeed it costs us far more to produce in tins than in bulk.
As already stated the tin manufacturer we used to use stopped operating and so we had to find replacement tins. This was not an easy thing to do but we now have a new designed better tin.

"When I buy tins in the store, I always give removing the lid a try before selecting them. When I get a shipment in from an online retailer, I go through and try to pry all of the lids off. If there isn't a seal, it will come off rather easy, if there is, I cannot pull the lid off at all without a coin to pry it off."

And this was one reason why we decided to also place anti-tamper heat seals around the tins so that someone could not go round trying to get the lids off tins in shops and thus breaking the seal and putting back for another person to buy. A vacuumed sealed tin does not necessarily need a coin to pry the lid off. A tin can be vacuumed sealed and still allow for the lid to come off without too much effort.

I have hundreds of tins from all of the pipe tobacco manufacturers in my cellar (+400 lbs.) that cannot be pried open with merely my fingers. Many of these are Samuel Gawith tins.

If I found one in the store that opened easily, I would immediately bring it to the attention of the store.

 

[beefeater33]

And this was one reason why we decided to also place anti-tamper heat seals around the tins so that someone could not go round trying to get the lids off tins in shops and thus breaking the seal and putting back for another person to buy.

Well, this does make sense from that perspective............
I haven't bought tins in shops for years, mostly all mail order now, so I hadn't really thought about that.

 

[worlok]

" I see there's a seal film around them but these can't be vacuum sealed."

Please explain your reasoning behind this. How do you know just from looking at the tin that it is not vacuum sealed? The heat sealed plastic around the tin is the anti-tamper device and as long as this is not broken then it is doing the exact job it is meant to be and showing the tin has not been tampered with.

Every single tin is vacuum sealed. Each tin is placed by hand into the vacuum sealing machine and then it is heat sealed separately.

At the end of the day we produce and sell our tobacco to be smoked, not for long term storage. So long as the tobacco is still good and high quality then that is what matters.

Well, in the case of the 2 tins of squadron leader, I can easily smell the latakia. If they were vacuum sealed then I shouldn't smell anything, right? Go to PIpe Smokers of America on Facebook there are other guys there saying in no way that their tins were sealed and they are jarring them up because of it. You guys make a GREAT product and I hope that you get this sorted at some point.

 

[admin]

Answered by the manufacturer.

If you have an actual verified issue that goes beyond wild speculation, take it up with the retailer you bought it from.

Closing.