New Carvers For Cheap?

[bigvan]

Rather than look for "an artisan pipe" at a particular price point, think about whose pipes you really like. Look at their web sites and at the pictures posted here, then contact them. You're going to spend more than $100 so you'll need to save up for a little longer, but when you're smoking the pipe you REALLY want it'll all be worth it.
So whose pipes do you like so far?

 

[pflan]

Winton, thanks for that perspective! I really have to make it to a pipe show in the near future..
Bigvan, hmmm.. I'm really digging the Tinsky pipes. He seems to do a lot of poker type shapes and that is really what I want. So, I'm going to save up a few hundred and talk to Mark Tinsky and see what we come up with. ::

 

[bigvan]

I REALLY think you'll be pleased with one of Mark's pipes, and you'll be getting what you WANT (and not settling for less).

 

[rx2man]

PM sent on a $100 custom pipe.
As others have said there are some trade offs when dealing with a new carver. I do not do hand cut stems. I have some rod and I have made a stem. But it takes me too long so a modified premade is used. Briar was mentioned, I do not use expensive brair as I make mistakes and sometimes mistakes that cannot be worked around. So a lot of my pipes will be rusticated due to pits. I do like to use bamboo and think that makes up for the premade stem. It also takes me a long time to make a pipe even with it being my only "job". All that being said I really enjoy pipe making and plan on being around for a while.

 

[pflan]

Interesting.. PM sent

 

[zack24]

This was an interesting question. If i were going to make $100 pipes, how would i do it? Easy enough- buy precut stummels from my Italian guy for $12, throw in a factory stem for $4.Thirty minutes to sand, 30 minutes for finishing, about $20 in materials including sandpaper and another $20 to cover the cost of equipment and shop- grand total of around $40.
The question is what is my goal? I want to be a good pipemaker making 200 pipes per year in 4 years. I just placed a $1600 order with my Briar supplier for 54 pieces of top grade plateaux briar (we also visited his family in Calabria, Italy last fall to get a relationship that helps ensure i get the best briar he offers, but i won't figure that cost into the equation). I'm wating on an order of SEM rod stock to arrive from Germany- $500 for 5 one meter rods- some beautiful colors that nobody is offering. Most of my pipes include ivory, horn or exotic wood inlays that add to the cost. Every pipe comes with a great leather bag from Neil Flancbaum for $12. I attended the Vegas show, the Chicago show, and will be at the Kansas City show and the Nashville show- figure $1500 for each show- $6k total. Last year, i spent $5k on tooling, and will spend about the same this year. With this approach, I'm at around $52 per pipe in raw materials, $6000 for shows- at a production of 50 pipes a year, that is $120 per pipe., $5k per year for equipment amortized over 50 pipes is $100. If my math is correct, that works out to about $272 per pipe. My pricing in Chicago was $255-325 per pipe and I had a good show.
In the next 2 years, i hope to spend some shop time with a couple of the great pipe guys here and in Europe- absolutely essential to be able to be able to improve on the limited skills I have at this point, ...
As a business, the math doesn't work unless you're able to charge a minimum of $400 or more per pipe and produce 200 pipes a year...the great news, is that i make a good living that allows me to enjoy this passion for making pipes...i also get to hang out at some great shows, meet some fascinating people, and smoke some great tobacco with friends...and that's priceless...(hard to believe i started down this slippery slope last May when i spent $150 to buy some old equipment that came from a pipe repair shop)

 

[rx2man]

Good article on pricing by Rainer Barbi. Similar thought process as Zach. I think Zach's pipes are priced very well and are a true value for a artisan carver.
https://web.archive.org/web/20061209184035/http://www.pfeifenbox.de/articles/barbi1_en.htm
As a new carver you have no choice but to discount your work. Why would anyone pay more? If you are going to pay more then you buy from an established carver with a good reputation. As a new carver you need to have a generous return policy. I am sure there are better ways make money but making pipes is fun LOL.

 

[zack24]

First time i've seen that article... Barbi was the master.
It was interesting in Chicago- i met two pipemakers - one a swedish guy and one an American who have priced themselves out of the American market. The American is getting up to $15 k in China for pipes that would sell for $5k in the states. The Swede is doing the same thing in Russia and China. the problem comes into play when the tastes or economies of those markets changes and their prices collapse....

 

[rx2man]

$15K, wow I would ride that horse as long as I could and enjoy it while it lasted!!!!

 

[novicemaker]

this was one very long thread to read but great points all around. Now while i am still in the tinkering phase of pipe making, i can say from a handmade furniture maker its hard on the makers to see something they worked on go for less then what they hoped for. But you are a great guy asking a great question and not asking someone to make a new pipe for x dollars. You asked what is a good pipe in this price range. I say in all honestly buy a bag or cobs and save up. Once i get past this weirdness at work ill be saving up to get one of the guys on here to make one.

(i love to help out people so if i can put my money into a small business owners hands and not a big company i am happy at any price.)
But just to tell you from my POV, i have worked with some crazy wood were i was sweating every cut and every sanding. Brazilian hardwoods and some African woods are some of the most gorgeous i have ever had my hands on. Briars and olive woods i have never even seen in person except on pipes.

 

[captainsousie]

You just have to keep your eyes open and you can score one of the big names for the price you want. An example is a Tinsky Canadian that I got for $40 from an eBay seller who didn't know what it was. It looked like it had only been smoked a couple times with half bowls and broke in nicely.
Keep an eye out, research a lot, and with luck+patience you will find what you want.

 

[sladeburns]

I'll put in another plug for Polinski. I have a few and love them. They are still inexpensive but there is no snagging one for absolute peanuts, near basket prices anymore. He has been noticed and good for him.

 

[mso489]

If you find this person who does finely crafted handmade pipes for $100, don't under any circumstances give his (or her) name.

That's only common sense.

 

[bulletsnbriars]

Great discussion here. Thanks for everyone sharing their wisdom. Bookmarkedfor future PAD purposes.

 

[simnettpratt]

Wow. I think I learned more from this one thread than any I've ever read, and I've been here since 2011. I'm going to read it a few more times, more slowly. A big thank you to all the wiser guys educating the less wise guys like me. Thank You.
Dave

 

[pflan]

Glad I was able to start such an informative thread!
It sure took a path of its own, and glad it did! Some great responses and tons of useful knowledge to note.

 

[zenforest]

This topic reminds me of one I have seen in the flyfishing "industry"/community. Can some expensive flyrod help you catch more fish ? Can it help you enjoy your time on the river more ?
I can tell you from personal experience the answer is NO ! Neither MARKETING SUGGESTION is true !!!!!
C'mon people !!
Assuming some basic standards are met, good tobacco taste good in a cob of corn, or any ole pipe.
When I see people talking about $250/$500/$1,500/$3,000 pipes I literally ROFLMA !
I guarantee the tobacco I smoke from my $9 Corn Cob taste every bit as sweet as yours !!!!

 

[pruss]

Hey zenforest... A slight detour from the OP's thread but I'll follow for a second.
If you think your $9 cob smokes as well as a $250 Alden, a $500 Rad, or a $1200 Bang, good for you. Keep doing what you're doing and enjoy those smokes. I will offer two thoughts though. First, briar is a different animal than cob and this thread has done a marvellous job pointing out how costs impact briar pipe design, materials, crafting, engineering, and finish (not to mention marketing and business development!). Second, not everyone in the cob world thinks a $9 cob offers the same smoking experience: http://aristocob.com/Riccardo-Santia-Ultimate-Corn-Cob-Pipe-1--P2663029.aspx
PS - Riccardo Santia routinely makes custom cobs for under $100 but he's not exactly a new pipe maker.
-- Pat

 

[zack24]

Pipesmoking and a lot of other activities (like flyfishing) are a mixture of functionality and ritual. The functionality comes cheap, the ritual can cost a fortune. It explains why my son owns a $1,000 coffee roaster when a Keurig coffeemaker does the same thing. In my case, I could actually make more money per hour banging out $100 or $150 pipes, but it wouldn't be as satisfying. I'll be a happy guy if the day ever arrives where I can charge $600 or more per pipe- because that means I can use some of the best briar in the world that can actually cost over $100 per block...and use some really rare materials like amber that are challenging to work with but incredibly beautiful... It allows time for details like polishing the tobacco chamber to 1200 grit and all the other myriad details that add hours to the process. For me it's about producing the best work at whatever price the market will bear and my skills will support...If you could imagine the bidding process a few centuries ago for the Sistine Chapel- one painter named Luigi took a look, shook his head and said- "Yep, 3 coats of paint- me and my guys will knock it out in time for Sunday Mass. This scruffy guy named Michelangelo said- "Not a problem, You'll just need to plan on holding Mass somewhere else for the next 7 years...." Whose name do we remember?

 

[wcannoy]

It allows time for details like polishing the tobacco chamber to 1200 grit...

1500 :D
It was great seeing you in Chicago Zack!