My pipe has gurgle!

[menuhin]

You guys that are enlarging the airway are on the right track. By widening the air path you are minimizing the effect that the irregular restrictions caused by condensation can have on air flow, which mitigates turbulent flow and maximizing laminar flow reducing the chances that gurgle will develop.

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I agree with much of what Torque wrote above and will add that in many cases that "turbulent air flow" occurs in the space or gap that exists where the stem/tennon meet or I should say, don't, meet.

***

Opening the airway works if one also opens up the bit and reduces the flat face area of the tenon.

It's getting more precise and technical in here:

1. What actually is 'gurgling'?

- Turbulent flow caused by irregular restrictions which in turn caused by condensation along *some part* of the airway;

(hint: then which *some part* is the critical part of the airway?)

2. What factors contribute to gurgling? (and by reducing them eliminates gurgling)

- Proposal 2a: draft hole hitting right at the bottom of the bowl without a pool for condensation to 'sink in';

(counter example: some pipes with draft holes drilled right at the bottom smoke real dry and never gurgle.)

- Proposal 2b: the gap where the stem/tennon do not meet causes gurgling;

(counter questions: plausible reason, but then by the same logic, does that mean that all Canadian shape is then gurgle free? How about reverse Calabash pipe with huge air chamber? Or those filtered pipes with chamber for filter?)

 

[buroak]

1. I think the other members posting here are saying the gurgling that occurs WITHIN the airway originates in the gap between the end of the tenon and end of the mortise.
2a: An answer here may require distinguishing among straight pipes and various degrees of bent pipes. Some exceptions will exist, of course, but I imagine that most contributors here would report a straight pipe with a draft hole at the bottom of the bowl will tend to be less likely to gurgle than a bent pipe with a draft hole at the bottom of the bowl.
2b. I am not sure why Canadian pipes would be universally free of a gap between the end of the end of the tenon and the end of the mortise. I have no experience with reverse Calabash pipes. When I smoke a filter pipe without the filter, I do find myself running a pipe cleaner down the airway fairly frequently to stop gurgle.
There is another issue we should probably discuss: the angle at which a pipe is held. Moisture will migrate to the lowest point, which in turn will vary depending on how a pipe is held.

 

[lordofthepiperings]

First of all, what the heck is YMMV?
Second of all, I have an 80S Killarney and it doesn't gurgle. I also have three Peterson System pipes that don't gurgle or smoke wet. I think the well does its job very well and recommend a Peterson System pipe to any beginner, as it truly does produce a cool dry smoke.
Personally when I do have a pipe gurlge it's because I've packed it wrong. I dump the ash and use the poker on my pipe tool to loosen up the tobacco. I let it rest for a while, usually about 5 minutes, and then gently tamp it down again and relight it. That does the trick for me.

 

[aldecaker]

YMMV=Your mileage may vary.

 

[menuhin]

@buroak

1. I think settersbrace specifically mentioned that he suspect the gap between the end of the tenon and end of the mortise is the cause of the gurgling, while other does not specify the location of the location, e.g. will it be near the mouthpiece or will it be right at the entrance of the draft hole, etc.
2b. Of course there exists a gap between the end of the tenon and the end of the mortise, and if gurgling occurs only at that junction it may well occur there too. However, if moist steam is the cause of condensation AND the location of condensation is particularly only at that junction, then there is less chance for a long shank pipe like Canadian to gurgle badly because proportionally less moist steam air can travel that far to make it to condense in that only turbulence causing condensation spot - the tenon-mortise junctional gap - or if a Canadian pipe gurgles, then it gurgles at the spot right in front of one's lips. It is my speculation from that reasoning. We can actually find a reference answer to this by conducting a vote/survey on "What shape does your gurgly pipe belong to?"

2a. I think that is quite related to what you mention about the angle at which a pipe is held - when a straight pipe gurgles, holding it pointing downwards will reduce the gurgling for me as well, i.e. the angle of the shank is then held like a bent pipe pointing downwards.

 

[lordofthepiperings]

YMMV=Your mileage may vary.

IHNI. TYFTI. IDUWETIA.
I had no idea. Thank you for the information. I don't understand why everyone types in acronyms.

 

[skagit]

When you swab the airway with a pipe cleaner you remove these irregular restrictions allowing laminar flow to return to the pathway and the gurgling goes away.

:clap:
Torque FTW. First time I've heard someone describe the effects of laminar flow and fluid dynamics when talking about pipes.
-- Skagit 8)

 

[menuhin]

Hmm... :puffpipe:

When you swab the airway with a pipe cleaner you remove these irregular restrictions allowing laminar flow to return to the pathway and the gurgling goes away.

With the same idea, if there is a certain kind of build-up on the briar wall along this airway, then it makes condensation easier to occur. Let's think if one tries to add moisture with his breath to a piece of aged wood from a violin maker, he probably wouldn't succeed; but if he tries that on a piece of wood coated with multiple layers of lacquers, then that would be easy to create condensation on the surface. Same way goes with the airway in case tar or similar layer of substance built up that avoid the moisture absorbing functioning of briar along the airway.

 

[torque]

1. I think settersbrace specifically mentioned that he suspect the gap between the end of the tenon and end of the mortise is the cause of the gurgling, while other does not specify the location of the location, e.g. will it be near the mouthpiece or will it be right at the entrance of the draft hole, etc.

You are correct Menuhin. In my rather simplistic explanation of how turbulent flow can contribute to gurgle I certainly didn't try to pinpoint any specific problem areas. My example mainly dealt with condensation and it's contribution to the problem which I believe happens (can happen) across the entire length of the airway. That said, I also believe that most of the condensation happens where the airstream enters the airway as that's when it contains the highest moisture level.
I also think that settersbrace's point that the gap between mortise and tennon contributing to the turbulence is very relevant. I also think that the surface finish of the pathway has to contribute to the overall effect as well as angle. Lots of good stuff from a lot of perspectives and gives my noodle some new things to chew on. This is a pretty awesome thread.