Meerschaum Block Pipe - Info request

[patack]

Hello,

Purchased this pipe at a high end estate auction on Saturday and looking for some information.
I have read some of the most interesting information about Meerschaum Pipes.

I think these usually represent someone, and not sure who this is. The first name that came to mind was Ghengis Khan.
Any idea how old this is?

On the box is a sticker (small) that says Block Meerschaum Made in Turkey
Thoughts on condition?

Thank you.
Links to photos:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/69738387@N02/29611394483/in/dateposted-public/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/69738387@N02/29611394453/in/dateposted-public/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/69738387@N02/29611394433/in/dateposted-public/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/69738387@N02/29611394393/in/dateposted-public/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/69738387@N02/29611394373/in/dateposted-public/

 

[ravenwolf]

If I were to hazard a guess, it would be that this is a somewhat recently made pipe - judging on what appears to be a smooth delrin tennon and mortise juncture. A lot of the old meerschaums had screw in type connectors, often made of bone. The delrin is likely to be preferable for anyone interested in smoking this pipe. For a collector of antiques, that doesn't plan to smoke it, I would think that this indicates a recent manufacture that may potentially reduce their interest.
Are there any further markings either on the leather box or the pipe itself?
As for condition, seems more or less okay, as far as I can tell from a few pictures. It's been smoked, but not excessively. Being an estate/smoked pipe, as a pipe smoker, I value an internally cleaned up used pipe to be valued at about half of what it was when new. There are expert meerschaum cleaner/restorer folks who specialize in meerschaum if you want to do anything to it.

 

[patack]

Thanks, Ravenwolf, for your quick response.
As for marks, I have found none except for the paper label (very small) glue to the trim around the box.

Speaking of trim, it makes me think mid century?

This couple, now deceased, spent many vacations in Asia. I purchased several items that were 40s.
I don't know what these run new, but I was checking/searching to see if I could find an example of whoever this is and couldn't find anything like it.

 

[ravenwolf]

Most high level meerschaum carvers will carve their name into the pipe itself somewhere. Without a carver's name either on the pipe or the case (pipe being preferable, as sometimes people will alter the case from what it was originally, sometimes dishonestly) - it'll be hard to value it. Some carver's work commands more money than others. Sometimes a master level carver will have apprentice carvers that are being taught - the master carver isn't going to be putting his name on the work of an appentice, and an apprentice better not put his teacher's name on an apprentice quality work... so sometimes you end up with unmarked pipes like this in such situations, I think. Who knows what other speculative things could be conjured up why a pipe isn't identifiable by a brand or makers marks.
Mid century would be way too old, I think. Delrin tennon and mortise junctions really only became a thing within, maybe, the last decade. If I'm wrong, I'm sure somebody else will chime in.
The quality of the carving looks pretty good to me. It's a nice pipe as far as I can tell.
I would guess that a pipe smoker looking to acquire a new pipe to smoke would probably value it at something like $100-150.
Our forum has sponsors such as www.smokingpipes.com that carry new and estate block meerschaum pipes (and the same for briar pipes) - they have brand new meerschaum block pipes around $150-250, which probably aren't as artistically carved as yours.
I could go buy a block meerschaum pipe from Baki (Ural) online for instance, which I consider top notch, for something like $300-500 brand new, or about half of that used.
There are very few Asiatic pipe brands or pipe artisans. The ones I can think of, work in briar instead of meerschaum.

 

[patack]

I'm amazed you think this is so new. I believe meerschaum is quite white when new (judging from what I've seen) and this looks like it has quite a patina already. Does that sound normal or reasonable?

But, I see what you mean about the tennon. Almost looks out of character for the pipe since I've seen "real" tennons.

 

[pipesmokingtom]

I'm amazed you think this is so new. I believe meerschaum is quite white when new (judging from what I've seen) and this looks like it has quite a patina already. Does that sound normal or reasonable?

White or patina is a function of how much it has been smoked - not how old it is.

 

[hmhaines]

I don't have anything helpful to add. Just wanted to say, that is easily the coolest Meerschaum I've ever seen.

 

[cossackjack]

@patack:

Beautiful meerschaum. I've been looking for one just like that.
I don't think that it is Ghengis Khan, I think that it's ME:

If you ever wish to sell it, let me know.

 

[wyfbane]

That is a very normal tenon for a meer. You don't want to do a lot of twisting on them so they developed those push/pull numbers. Regardless of age it is a very nice looking pipe. Nice score!

 

[Sinan Altinok]

@patack
It's most likely a pen-portrait of Genghis Khan. One of the historic characters we make replicas most.
Here is another example of Genghis Khan replica pipe made by our master carver, Suleyman Coskun:

https://www.altinokpipes.com/FG1032-meerschaum-genghis-khan
Happy smokes,

Sinan Altinok

 

[gnesiohamartolos]

ravenwolf wrote, "Delrin tennon and mortise junctions really only became a thing within, maybe, the last decade. If I'm wrong, I'm sure somebody else will chime in." Most European carvers prior to the Turkish uncarved meerschaum export embargo of 1961 used bone screws to attach the stummel to the stem. “The one exception [to bone screws] is a pipe made by the Andreas Bauer Company in Vienna in which a Teflon tenon in the stem fits into a collar of the same material in the end of the shank.” The Book of Pipes and Tobacco, p. 86. Additionally, prior to the embargo, Bauer used stems made from cultured amber is called amberdan. It has properties fairly near natural amber. Its refractive index is about 1.56 (natural amber is 1.54) and its specific gravity is 1.23, also well above that of natural amber. The hot point gives an odor at once reminiscent of plastic and amber, suggesting a natural resin with a plastic binder. Some claim that Bauer used amber bits exclusively while its pipe were manufactured in Austria. However, others assert that Ernst, Andreas Bauer’s son and successor, introduced both teflon connectors and cultured amber bits while Bauer carved its bowls in Austria and long before the company was sold to Konçak.

 

[wiwo]

the first meerschaum pipes by bauer had an amber mouthpiece.later his patent CULTURED AMBER was used for the pipes,also the tenon is a bauer patent

regards

 

[jonasclark]

My opinions as a collector of meerschaums:
This pipe is Turkish, and likely dates to the late 1960s or early 1970s. That style of case lining, a sort of not-too-smooth white cloth that looks like it'd be translucent if held up to light, was popular then, as was the yellow stem, which is indeed plastic-- not any amberoid or amberdan or amberol (oops, that last one was a type of phonograph record!) The number on the end of the stem where it meets the shank (the shank should have a corresponding number, though it's not unheard-of for it to be missing) was a signal between carver and stem-maker to match them, as they were made for each other; this is a Turkish and not at all a European thing. These tell me quite firmly where it was made, and approximately when. It's my opinion that it is 100% NOT European, it isn't older than the 1960s, and it isn't newer than the mid-1970s.
I think the carving is quite nice for that time period, during which a LOT of meerschaum carving was very poor. I wouldn't just call it "okay," though mediocrity is better than a lot of what was made. It isn't incredible, but it's fun and expressive. I'm not surprised that it isn't signed; Ismet Bekler was the first carver to begin signing his pipes, circa 1973 or 1974, followed by Ismail Ozel (who signed his pipes "The Artist") several years later. But it's nonetheless very good.
The patina could be from handling, from being kept in a room where pipes were smoked, or simply from age. Meerschaums can do that, including Turkish ones. I have a modern Turkish Bacchus by Erdogan which has acquired a beautiful amberish patina, darker in some areas, from my handling and holding it; I've never smoked it.

 

[gnesiohamartolos]

The delrin mortise indicates this is a contemporary Turkish carving as ravenwolf indicated. Sinan Altinok said this depicts the Genghis Khan, a title given to Temüjin. Based on the loose hair queue at the top of a shaved pate and extended mustache, my guess is that this pipe depicts a Zaporozhian Cossack. They lived in what is now Ukraine. Their relationship with the Ottoman Turks was like a bad marriage. They often warred against and insulted the vastly more powerful Turks but on occasions fought on their behalf. Many Turkish people are descendants of the Seljuqs who were associated with the Mongols. The unknown carver would have been familiar with both the Zaporozhians and Mongols, so who is to say.